From tsiegel at softcon.com Mon Aug 1 02:57:30 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2011 21:57:30 -0400 Subject: space technology and how it benefits us Message-ID: The comment here a while ago about the us no longer going into space, and being happy about it, because we need to focus on things here on earth before going into space got me all riled up. I honestly can't believe how many people don't realize the massive benefits derived from space based initiatives. It's actually taken me this long to settle down enough to compose a response that wasn't laced with explitives and remarks that really aren't condusive to ongoing discussions. However, now that I have reached that point, I went hunting for some space based technology that has paid off for the general public, and I'm not just talking about us citizens, or those countries that do maintain space programs. I first thought that I'd just make a blog post, and make a huge list of all the things we use daily that grew out of space related diciplines. Then I discovered Nasa already has such a publication. They're called spinoffs, and Nasa has a whole publication dedicated just to such technologies. The page for the publication is located at: http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/ Anyone who spends just half an hour or so browsing the publications here will find an amazing array of technologies, that get used everyday, and some of which you might not at first believe came out of space related work, but it's all true, and there's plenty of examples there, just on the front page of the publications, not even talking about what's actually mentioned inside the publications themselves. Anyone who believes even slightly that space is not a good use of funding seriously needs to peruse just a few of these documents, and you'll see that space technology has led to many many more research breakthroughs than anything else in modern history. I don't think that anyone with a highschool education could possibly make the claim that space is bad after examining just a few of these publications, not to mention the main page itself. Things like 100 percent stronger hip replacements, better parachutes that have (to date) saved 261 lives, And, this isn't even mentioning benefits like satellites which handle everything from phone calls to tv and internet access all over the world, weather prediction, and more. I don't know how many lives have been saved by weather satellites, but I'm sure it's in the thousands if not millions. Should we mention the computer technologies that have been assisted by space tech? Or what about the lighter and stronger materials used to build both aircraft and automobiles, saving both money and lives with their integration into current designs. I can't even begin to guess how many technologies have benefited indirectly from space tech, that most folks don't know came via that route. I can't believe that anyone would even think such things in today's day and age, but if you have any doubts, spend some time with the spinoffs site, and see for yourself just how much space tech has benefited you and those around you, then if you can still say honestly that you still think there should be no space program, because it's a waste of resources, then at that point, I'd have to accept your belief as your own, but at least it'd be an informed belief. Check out the site, and let's see what discussions we can take from it. the url again is: http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/ Enjoy. From tvii at optonline.net Mon Aug 1 04:36:12 2011 From: tvii at optonline.net (John Panarese) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2011 23:36:12 -0400 Subject: space technology and how it benefits us In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I wasn't going to touch this topic either, as it can lead to too much debate and too much work to prove my own points as well. Thank you for posting that link. I am often absolutely flabbergasted by the lack of knowledge, ignorance and misperceptions people have of how the space program has positively benefited the world in so many ways. It's not simply spending gobs of money to put people in space or wasting money to explore other planets with expensive gismos. I can list tons of areas the US government and European governments spend money on that far out weigh the budget of NASA on a yearly basis, but, again, I prefer not to get into an opinion driven debate. Again, though, ugh appreciation for posting the link, Travis. Take Care John Panarese On Jul 31, 2011, at 9:57 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > The comment here a while ago about the us no longer going into space, and being happy about it, because we need to focus on things here on earth before going into space got me all riled up. I honestly can't believe how many people don't realize the massive benefits derived from space based initiatives. It's actually taken me this long to settle down enough to compose a response that wasn't laced with explitives and remarks that really aren't condusive to ongoing discussions. > However, now that I have reached that point, I went hunting for some space based technology that has paid off for the general public, and I'm not just talking about us citizens, or those countries that do maintain space programs. > I first thought that I'd just make a blog post, and make a huge list of all the things we use daily that grew out of space related diciplines. Then I discovered Nasa already has such a publication. They're called spinoffs, and Nasa has a whole publication dedicated just to such technologies. > The page for the publication is located at: > http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/ > Anyone who spends just half an hour or so browsing the publications here will find an amazing array of technologies, that get used everyday, and some of which you might not at first believe came out of space related work, but it's all true, and there's plenty of examples there, just on the front page of the publications, not even talking about what's actually mentioned inside the publications themselves. Anyone who believes even slightly that space is not a good use of funding seriously needs to peruse just a few of these documents, and you'll see that space technology has led to many many more research breakthroughs than anything else in modern history. I don't think that anyone with a highschool education could possibly make the claim that space is bad after examining just a few of these publications, not to mention the main page itself. > Things like 100 percent stronger hip replacements, better parachutes that have (to date) saved 261 lives, And, this isn't even mentioning benefits like satellites which handle everything from phone calls to tv and internet access all over the world, weather prediction, and more. I don't know how many lives have been saved by weather satellites, but I'm sure it's in the thousands if not millions. > > Should we mention the computer technologies that have been assisted by space tech? Or what about the lighter and stronger materials used to build both aircraft and automobiles, saving both money and lives with their integration into current designs. > > I can't even begin to guess how many technologies have benefited indirectly from space tech, that most folks don't know came via that route. I can't believe that anyone would even think such things in today's day and age, but if you have any doubts, spend some time with the spinoffs site, and see for yourself just how much space tech has benefited you and those around you, then if you can still say honestly that you still think there should be no space program, because it's a waste of resources, then at that point, I'd have to accept your belief as your own, but at least it'd be an informed belief. > Check out the site, and let's see what discussions we can take from it. > the url again is: > http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/ > Enjoy. > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 1 11:39:20 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2011 11:39:20 +0100 Subject: space technology and how it benefits us In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7ABE29DE-9677-4680-B4A9-C1E8EB445E54@mac-access.net> Travis You are mistaken! We do realise the benefits, but surely the current situation on earth demands that you set your own affairs in order before going further afield. I won't continue this discussion here because it's social, rather than technical. But you are very much mistaken in your interpretation of the original comments. Gordon On 1 Aug 2011, at 02:57, Travis Siegel wrote: The comment here a while ago about the us no longer going into space, and being happy about it, because we need to focus on things here on earth before going into space got me all riled up. I honestly can't believe how many people don't realize the massive benefits derived from space based initiatives. It's actually taken me this long to settle down enough to compose a response that wasn't laced with explitives and remarks that really aren't condusive to ongoing discussions. However, now that I have reached that point, I went hunting for some space based technology that has paid off for the general public, and I'm not just talking about us citizens, or those countries that do maintain space programs. I first thought that I'd just make a blog post, and make a huge list of all the things we use daily that grew out of space related diciplines. Then I discovered Nasa already has such a publication. They're called spinoffs, and Nasa has a whole publication dedicated just to such technologies. The page for the publication is located at: http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/ Anyone who spends just half an hour or so browsing the publications here will find an amazing array of technologies, that get used everyday, and some of which you might not at first believe came out of space related work, but it's all true, and there's plenty of examples there, just on the front page of the publications, not even talking about what's actually mentioned inside the publications themselves. Anyone who believes even slightly that space is not a good use of funding seriously needs to peruse just a few of these documents, and you'll see that space technology has led to many many more research breakthroughs than anything else in modern history. I don't think that anyone with a highschool education could possibly make the claim that space is bad after examining just a few of these publications, not to mention the main page itself. Things like 100 percent stronger hip replacements, better parachutes that have (to date) saved 261 lives, And, this isn't even mentioning benefits like satellites which handle everything from phone calls to tv and internet access all over the world, weather prediction, and more. I don't know how many lives have been saved by weather satellites, but I'm sure it's in the thousands if not millions. Should we mention the computer technologies that have been assisted by space tech? Or what about the lighter and stronger materials used to build both aircraft and automobiles, saving both money and lives with their integration into current designs. I can't even begin to guess how many technologies have benefited indirectly from space tech, that most folks don't know came via that route. I can't believe that anyone would even think such things in today's day and age, but if you have any doubts, spend some time with the spinoffs site, and see for yourself just how much space tech has benefited you and those around you, then if you can still say honestly that you still think there should be no space program, because it's a waste of resources, then at that point, I'd have to accept your belief as your own, but at least it'd be an informed belief. Check out the site, and let's see what discussions we can take from it. the url again is: http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/ Enjoy. _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 1 12:45:28 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2011 12:45:28 +0100 Subject: 1Password Message-ID: <6242E09E-3088-4F14-9A7F-240547263C3E@mac-access.net> Hi all Does anybody still use this and, if so, what's necessary to sync it with Mac and Windows and maybe even a cloud like Dropbox or our own server. Can that be done? Gordon From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon Aug 1 13:17:56 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2011 22:17:56 +1000 Subject: 1Password In-Reply-To: <6242E09E-3088-4F14-9A7F-240547263C3E@mac-access.net> References: <6242E09E-3088-4F14-9A7F-240547263C3E@mac-access.net> Message-ID: There's a whole page! devoted to various methods of synching 1 Password but as standard 1 Password can sync in either of 2 ways, it can sync to other devices via your wi-fi network or it can use dropbox. On 01/08/2011, at 9:45 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi all > > Does anybody still use this and, if so, what's necessary to sync it with Mac and Windows and maybe even a cloud like Dropbox or our own server. Can that be done? > > Gordon > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 1 15:13:52 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 1 Aug 2011 15:13:52 +0100 Subject: 1Password In-Reply-To: References: <6242E09E-3088-4F14-9A7F-240547263C3E@mac-access.net> Message-ID: OK, I'll investigate that further a bit later on. On 1 Aug 2011, at 13:17, Dane Trethowan wrote: There's a whole page! devoted to various methods of synching 1 Password but as standard 1 Password can sync in either of 2 ways, it can sync to other devices via your wi-fi network or it can use dropbox. From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue Aug 2 01:51:43 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2011 10:51:43 +1000 Subject: article: Consumers Prefer FM & Analogue Than Digital Radio Message-ID: <4E374A1F.6020607@internode.on.net> This article caught my attention and my reaction upon reading is "No Surprises Here". DAB+ in Australia in my view will never take off in areas outside the main capital cities because of the vast distances. The audio quality of analogue FM signals is often better than their DAB+ counterparts because of the AC+ encoding and band width. AM signals are always there and don't drop-out even they do fade, there's static sometimes etc. Read on http://smarthouse.com.au/Real_Sound/Digital_Radio/N7A3P2C3 -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue Aug 2 06:43:08 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2011 15:43:08 +1000 Subject: Radio Data System Message-ID: <4E378E6C.6070900@internode.on.net> Hi! I'm reading about the Radio data system and I have a question, has any manufacturer of radio ever made a set which can read this data and speak it through synthesised or static speech? I'm only interested in the RDS because my most recent purchase of a Sangean tabletop clock radio uses the RDS to set the time automatically, pressing a button on the front displays traffic information, pressing it again displays Station Id and so it goes on. RDS works on the FM band and - according to the article - is widely used in the U.K. and North America, not sure how wide the use of the RDS is in Australia but I do know that several stations here must use it or else the clock of the radio wouldn't set itself . -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net From lynne at mac-access.net Tue Aug 2 12:28:21 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2011 12:28:21 +0100 Subject: Radio Data System In-Reply-To: <4E378E6C.6070900@internode.on.net> References: <4E378E6C.6070900@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <840A706E-3EAC-4391-8726-BB7EBF127D52@mac-access.net> Hello Dane RDS is very widely used here; my own in-car audio system supports it. My system is both analogue and digital. RDS is also used to adjust the frequency if, when you're listening to a national station over here, for instance, you move out of range of a transmitter. The tuner automatically tunes to the next transmitter in the geographical sequence. But I personally have never encountered a radio which can speak the RDS data. I doubt it would be possible using static speech because there are too many variations which appear on the display. Gordon used to have the Pure Digital radio that spoke using static speech and to be honest it was pretty basic. But I gather that Pure have stopped making talking radios and I have never encountered another manufacturer making them; and yes, I have looked. Gordon isn't interested in FM radio much any more to be honest. Everything we listen too is on digital and the quality is far superior. Lynne On 2 Aug 2011, at 06:43, Dane Trethowan wrote: Hi! I'm reading about the Radio data system and I have a question, has any manufacturer of radio ever made a set which can read this data and speak it through synthesised or static speech? I'm only interested in the RDS because my most recent purchase of a Sangean tabletop clock radio uses the RDS to set the time automatically, pressing a button on the front displays traffic information, pressing it again displays Station Id and so it goes on. RDS works on the FM band and - according to the article - is widely used in the U.K. and North America, not sure how wide the use of the RDS is in Australia but I do know that several stations here must use it or else the clock of the radio wouldn't set itself . -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu Aug 4 02:22:22 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2011 20:22:22 -0500 Subject: Radio Data System Message-ID: <201108040122.p741MMnp028521@x.it.okstate.edu> It is all over the place, here. Some stations have both RDS and digital audio as digital here is on the same channel. "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > RDS is very widely used here; my own in-car audio system supports it. My > system is both analogue and digital. > > RDS is also used to adjust the frequency if, when you're listening to a > national station over here, for instance, you move out of range of a > transmitter. The tuner automatically tunes to the next transmitter in the > geographical sequence. But I personally have never encountered a radio > which can speak the RDS data. I doubt it would be possible using static > speech because there are too many variations which appear on the display. I wonder if the British RDS system is the same one we have here? If I connect a short wave receiver to the discriminator output of an FM radio, I can easily tell who has RDS. It is a rhythmic digital whine around 57 KHZ. The rhythm is due to the fact that it keeps repeating the display information until something new is transmitted such as when the song changes. Obviously, this does no good for accessibility, but there is no technical reason at all why somebody couldn't come out with either a talking radio or better yet, a bluetooth device one could use with an iphone or something similar. > > Gordon used to have the Pure Digital radio that spoke using static speech > and to be honest it was pretty basic. But I gather that Pure have stopped > making talking radios and I have never encountered another manufacturer > making them; and yes, I have looked. > > Gordon isn't interested in FM radio much any more to be honest. > Everything we listen too is on digital and the quality is far superior. FM stations here have caught the same disease. Never has garbage been delivered with such amazing clarity. You can hear every one of the five or six songs a station plays and all the ads over and over and over and not miss a single reverbed automobile or shoe price. Martin From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu Aug 4 13:51:02 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 07:51:02 -0500 Subject: Radio Data System and GPS Message-ID: <201108041251.p74Cp23O031119@x.it.okstate.edu> "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > RDS is very widely used here; my own in-car audio system supports it. My > system is both analogue and digital. > > RDS is also used to adjust the frequency if, when you're listening to a > national station over here, for instance, you move out of range of a > transmitter. The tuner automatically tunes to the next transmitter in the > geographical sequence. Does the car have a GPS system built in to the electronics? If so, you probably never have to set your clock except maybe to enter your time zone but the GPS could even do that and probably does. By the way, GPS was a classified US Department of Defense project in the late 70's. It was decided quite some time ago that it had tremendous civilian and public safety possibilities so a dumbed-down version of capabilities was released for public use and then, a few years ago, the US Air Force stopped scrambling the timing of the signals so that extremely accurate positioning information was possible. Before that, your GPS was only good to a few meters. Now you can get them to about a meter resolution. Another interesting fact is that GPS receivers sold to the general public have a special kill feature built in to them that will shut them down if they are found to be moving faster than a certain speed. This speed is high enough that the GPS will still work in airplanes and, of course, cars, but not in a missile, for instance. I think they can still disable GPS in any part of the world if they believe it is being used for ulterior purposes, but for most of us, it is the sword turned in to a plowshare. From lynne at mac-access.net Sun Aug 7 14:11:40 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 14:11:40 +0100 Subject: DVD Authoring Message-ID: Hello everybody For Mac & Windows, anybody happen to know a good quality DVD authoring solution for source files which are, for instance, MP4 video? I can use iDVD on the Mac but it is clunky to be honest and not particularly user-friendly. Lynne From moopiecurran at gmail.com Sun Aug 7 14:23:38 2011 From: moopiecurran at gmail.com (Courtney Curran) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 09:23:38 -0400 Subject: DVD Authoring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, Yes, I know of one, it's called DVD Creator, it's in the mac app store, for $39.00. HTH, Courtney Sent from my iPod On Aug 7, 2011, at 9:11 AM, "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" wrote: > Hello everybody > > For Mac & Windows, anybody happen to know a good quality DVD authoring solution for source files which are, for instance, MP4 video? I can use iDVD on the Mac but it is clunky to be honest and not particularly user-friendly. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sun Aug 7 16:07:17 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 16:07:17 +0100 Subject: DVD Authoring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0045CE6F-9CEB-49CD-80E3-11003A335624@mac-access.net> Hello Courtney is it accessible, as Gordon would need to use it? Lynne On 7 Aug 2011, at 14:23, Courtney Curran wrote: Hi, Yes, I know of one, it's called DVD Creator, it's in the mac app store, for $39.00. HTH, Courtney Sent from my iPod On Aug 7, 2011, at 9:11 AM, "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" wrote: > Hello everybody > > For Mac & Windows, anybody happen to know a good quality DVD authoring solution for source files which are, for instance, MP4 video? I can use iDVD on the Mac but it is clunky to be honest and not particularly user-friendly. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From moopiecurran at gmail.com Sun Aug 7 16:11:10 2011 From: moopiecurran at gmail.com (Courtney Curran) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 11:11:10 -0400 Subject: DVD Authoring In-Reply-To: <0045CE6F-9CEB-49CD-80E3-11003A335624@mac-access.net> References: <0045CE6F-9CEB-49CD-80E3-11003A335624@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <05A127C2-803F-4310-BEBE-BA047624368C@gmail.com> Hi, I use it all the time, it's accessible, there's an unlabeled checkbox, but that's the checkbox to burn the dvd. HTH, Courtney On Aug 7, 2011, at 11:07 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Courtney > > is it accessible, as Gordon would need to use it? > > Lynne > > On 7 Aug 2011, at 14:23, Courtney Curran wrote: > > Hi, > Yes, I know of one, it's called DVD Creator, it's in the mac app store, for $39.00. > HTH, > Courtney > > Sent from my iPod > > On Aug 7, 2011, at 9:11 AM, "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" wrote: > >> Hello everybody >> >> For Mac & Windows, anybody happen to know a good quality DVD authoring solution for source files which are, for instance, MP4 video? I can use iDVD on the Mac but it is clunky to be honest and not particularly user-friendly. >> >> Lynne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sun Aug 7 16:36:03 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 16:36:03 +0100 Subject: DVD Authoring In-Reply-To: <05A127C2-803F-4310-BEBE-BA047624368C@gmail.com> References: <0045CE6F-9CEB-49CD-80E3-11003A335624@mac-access.net> <05A127C2-803F-4310-BEBE-BA047624368C@gmail.com> Message-ID: <707B7A5B-9995-4176-85AF-F65390A2B5A0@mac-access.net> Hello Courtney Is this the one by Wondershare Company? Can it convert MP4 and aline into DVD video? How about creating DVD images? Lynne On 7 Aug 2011, at 16:11, Courtney Curran wrote: Hi, I use it all the time, it's accessible, there's an unlabeled checkbox, but that's the checkbox to burn the dvd. HTH, Courtney On Aug 7, 2011, at 11:07 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Courtney > > is it accessible, as Gordon would need to use it? > > Lynne > > On 7 Aug 2011, at 14:23, Courtney Curran wrote: > > Hi, > Yes, I know of one, it's called DVD Creator, it's in the mac app store, for $39.00. > HTH, > Courtney > > Sent from my iPod > > On Aug 7, 2011, at 9:11 AM, "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" wrote: > >> Hello everybody >> >> For Mac & Windows, anybody happen to know a good quality DVD authoring solution for source files which are, for instance, MP4 video? I can use iDVD on the Mac but it is clunky to be honest and not particularly user-friendly. >> >> Lynne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From moopiecurran at gmail.com Sun Aug 7 16:49:03 2011 From: moopiecurran at gmail.com (Courtney Curran) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 11:49:03 -0400 Subject: DVD Authoring In-Reply-To: <707B7A5B-9995-4176-85AF-F65390A2B5A0@mac-access.net> References: <0045CE6F-9CEB-49CD-80E3-11003A335624@mac-access.net> <05A127C2-803F-4310-BEBE-BA047624368C@gmail.com> <707B7A5B-9995-4176-85AF-F65390A2B5A0@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <8B24ADF8-E1B5-4877-98C1-27B0F5AD617C@gmail.com> Yes, It's the one by Wondershare, and yes, it can put mp4 and mov formats on a dvd that's playable on standard TV. I don't know about DVD images, I haven't tried. HTH, Courtney On Aug 7, 2011, at 11:36 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Courtney > > Is this the one by Wondershare Company? Can it convert MP4 and aline into DVD video? How about creating DVD images? > > Lynne > > On 7 Aug 2011, at 16:11, Courtney Curran wrote: > > Hi, > I use it all the time, it's accessible, there's an unlabeled checkbox, but that's the checkbox to burn the dvd. > HTH, > Courtney > On Aug 7, 2011, at 11:07 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > >> Hello Courtney >> >> is it accessible, as Gordon would need to use it? >> >> Lynne >> >> On 7 Aug 2011, at 14:23, Courtney Curran wrote: >> >> Hi, >> Yes, I know of one, it's called DVD Creator, it's in the mac app store, for $39.00. >> HTH, >> Courtney >> >> Sent from my iPod >> >> On Aug 7, 2011, at 9:11 AM, "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" wrote: >> >>> Hello everybody >>> >>> For Mac & Windows, anybody happen to know a good quality DVD authoring solution for source files which are, for instance, MP4 video? I can use iDVD on the Mac but it is clunky to be honest and not particularly user-friendly. >>> >>> Lynne >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Sun Aug 7 16:50:16 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 7 Aug 2011 16:50:16 +0100 Subject: DVD Authoring In-Reply-To: <8B24ADF8-E1B5-4877-98C1-27B0F5AD617C@gmail.com> References: <0045CE6F-9CEB-49CD-80E3-11003A335624@mac-access.net> <05A127C2-803F-4310-BEBE-BA047624368C@gmail.com> <707B7A5B-9995-4176-85AF-F65390A2B5A0@mac-access.net> <8B24ADF8-E1B5-4877-98C1-27B0F5AD617C@gmail.com> Message-ID: <65F1DE98-47BF-4080-AF7C-43DBCBBB4B36@mac-access.net> hello Courtney Thank you. I will go and get it. Lynne On 7 Aug 2011, at 16:49, Courtney Curran wrote: Yes, It's the one by Wondershare, and yes, it can put mp4 and mov formats on a dvd that's playable on standard TV. I don't know about DVD images, I haven't tried. HTH, Courtney On Aug 7, 2011, at 11:36 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Courtney > > Is this the one by Wondershare Company? Can it convert MP4 and aline into DVD video? How about creating DVD images? > > Lynne > > On 7 Aug 2011, at 16:11, Courtney Curran wrote: > > Hi, > I use it all the time, it's accessible, there's an unlabeled checkbox, but that's the checkbox to burn the dvd. > HTH, > Courtney > On Aug 7, 2011, at 11:07 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > >> Hello Courtney >> >> is it accessible, as Gordon would need to use it? >> >> Lynne >> >> On 7 Aug 2011, at 14:23, Courtney Curran wrote: >> >> Hi, >> Yes, I know of one, it's called DVD Creator, it's in the mac app store, for $39.00. >> HTH, >> Courtney >> >> Sent from my iPod >> >> On Aug 7, 2011, at 9:11 AM, "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" wrote: >> >>> Hello everybody >>> >>> For Mac & Windows, anybody happen to know a good quality DVD authoring solution for source files which are, for instance, MP4 video? I can use iDVD on the Mac but it is clunky to be honest and not particularly user-friendly. >>> >>> Lynne >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed Aug 10 03:02:58 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 9 Aug 2011 19:02:58 -0700 Subject: wordpress as a content maniger Message-ID: <0D3F745F-F525-4B5D-96F2-3FB5C3B0B144@gmail.com> Hello to all. I'm going to set up on one of my sub domains using the wordpress plugin. I really dunno what I'm doing and I want this site to look good but at the same time to be navigable. I want a form for one of the pages that people can fill out if they want to contact me for testing. You can write me off list if you so desire. Take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://tffp.marrie.org/podcast youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 From gordon at mac-access.net Sat Aug 13 22:25:48 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2011 22:25:48 +0100 Subject: Zoom H1 Recorder Message-ID: <38E72285-7FB9-431B-A0E4-2216E16AD30D@mac-access.net> Hi all This is one of those frustrating occasions where I need to ask for assistance owing to the side effects of the soul-destroying cocktail of medications I am having to take daily. I need help with the H1 recorder. It's been a while since I used it and my memory is being impeded by the drugs so that I simply can't remember how you use the thing beyond switching it on. Logic tells me that the big round button in the middle on the front is record/stop and I've figured out how to play content because there's already something on here. But how do I erase it? How do I initiate a new recording, as I need too tomorrow. I'm sorry for the memory problems, and I almost threw the thing through the window just now in frustration. Lynne is at her sister's next door keeping her company and won't be home till late. Sebi is recovering from illness and so on. Yours frustratedly, Gordon From support at mac-access.net Mon Aug 15 10:24:21 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 10:24:21 +0100 Subject: New Member Welcome Message-ID: <234B4446-54B8-43AC-8C30-8647BEC196AB@mac-access.net> Hello everybody It is traditional when new members join the Techno-Chat group that Gordon and I try to welcome the new member(s) personally. In keeping with that tradition, we are delighted to welcome: chris hallsworth to our number. Anything related to technology is open for discussion in this group. Members frequently post links to interesting articles in this group. Whilst the primary function of Techno-chat is discussion, we recognise that these articles are often of value. That is why we encourage members to post links, rather than the full articles themselves, to the group. This way, members have the option of whether to follow up the articles, or to discard them. We hope that you will find Techno-Chat a pleasant, friendly and worthwhile place to be. if you have any list-related queries, please don't hesitate to contact either Gordon and myself, support at tft-bbs.co.uk or our very able and capable assistant list controller Mary Stores, mstores at indiana.edu and we'll be pleased to help you. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From support at mac-access.net Mon Aug 15 12:33:05 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 12:33:05 +0100 Subject: New Member Welcome Message-ID: Hello everybody It is traditional when new members join the Techno-Chat group that Gordon and I try to welcome the new member(s) personally. In keeping with that tradition, we are delighted to welcome: Michael Jones to our number. Anything related to technology is open for discussion in this group. Members frequently post links to interesting articles in this group. Whilst the primary function of Techno-chat is discussion, we recognise that these articles are often of value. That is why we encourage members to post links, rather than the full articles themselves, to the group. This way, members have the option of whether to follow up the articles, or to discard them. We hope that you will find Techno-Chat a pleasant, friendly and worthwhile place to be. if you have any list-related queries, please don't hesitate to contact either Gordon and myself, support at tft-bbs.co.uk or our very able and capable assistant list controller Mary Stores, mstores at indiana.edu and we'll be pleased to help you. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From christopherh40 at gmail.com Mon Aug 15 14:23:02 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 14:23:02 +0100 Subject: Hi Message-ID: <4E491DB6.1080008@gmail.com> Hello all. I have just joined this list. Since this is about technology in general this is right up my street smiles. I hope I ejoy it here. Chat soon. -- Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird From rose at chicksdigmacs.net Mon Aug 15 14:30:17 2011 From: rose at chicksdigmacs.net (Rose Morales) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 09:30:17 -0400 Subject: Hi In-Reply-To: <4E491DB6.1080008@gmail.com> References: <4E491DB6.1080008@gmail.com> Message-ID: Nice to see you round these parts, Chris. I mainly read instead of posting, but I find the posts here to be very informative and certainly food for thought. You'll love the content if nothing else. Rose On Aug 15, 2011, at 9:23 AM, chris hallsworth wrote: > Hello all. > I have just joined this list. Since this is about technology in general this is right up my street smiles. I hope I ejoy it here. > Chat soon. > -- > > Chris Hallsworth > Sent from Thunderbird > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 15 16:45:11 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 16:45:11 +0100 Subject: Hi In-Reply-To: <4E491DB6.1080008@gmail.com> References: <4E491DB6.1080008@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Chris We're glad to see you here. The rules are obviously a bit looser than on Mac Access because technology is a very wide-ranging subject. Generally the list is quite quiet, but we're hoping to try and build it up. I should tell you all something now though. The home of the list will be moving soon to a new domain. Don't panic, we'll port your memberships over automatically. Gordon On 15 Aug 2011, at 14:23, chris hallsworth wrote: Hello all. I have just joined this list. Since this is about technology in general this is right up my street smiles. I hope I ejoy it here. Chat soon. -- Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From support at mac-access.net Mon Aug 15 19:45:00 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 19:45:00 +0100 Subject: Essential System Maintenance Message-ID: <8E6B1FDB-43EE-4B34-A4F7-3BBC9DF146E4@mac-access.net> Hello everybody In the early hours (UTC) of either Tuesday morning, 16 August 2011 or Wednesday morning, 17 August 2011, we will need to perform some essential system maintenance. This will involve taking all services down on the primary server temporarily. We are going to try and schedule this for the least inconvenient time possible. But of course, we can't please everybody. So in advance of this work we apologise for any inconvenience. We will do our best to ensure that the outage is as brief as possible. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From support at mac-access.net Tue Aug 16 09:48:09 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2011 09:48:09 +0100 Subject: New Member Welcome Message-ID: <07FD083F-B3FF-4236-A8FF-52DC5C8BC368@mac-access.net> Hello everybody It is traditional when new members join the Techno-Chat group that Gordon and I try to welcome the new member(s) personally. In keeping with that tradition, we are delighted to welcome: Eric Caron to our number. Anything related to technology is open for discussion in this group. Members frequently post links to interesting articles in this group. Whilst the primary function of Techno-chat is discussion, we recognise that these articles are often of value. That is why we encourage members to post links, rather than the full articles themselves, to the group. This way, members have the option of whether to follow up the articles, or to discard them. We hope that you will find Techno-Chat a pleasant, friendly and worthwhile place to be. if you have any list-related queries, please don't hesitate to contact either Gordon and myself, support at tft-bbs.co.uk or our very able and capable assistant list controller Mary Stores, mstores at indiana.edu and we'll be pleased to help you. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From support at mac-access.net Tue Aug 16 22:48:42 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2011 22:48:42 +0100 Subject: Maintenance Work Scheduled Message-ID: <8EFCDB5B-EE60-4B58-9092-1695FC825B86@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Just a reminder; we didn't get the maintenance work done last night, so we're now looking at the second option which is the early hours of Wednesday morning, 17 August, UTC. We will try and keep this time slot; so please don't be too surprised if things go down not long after midnight. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From lynne at mac-access.net Tue Aug 16 23:59:45 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2011 23:59:45 +0100 Subject: BluRay Writing Hardware Message-ID: <2BFB5B0E-23CF-4568-860F-18E192A46BEC@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Does anybody happen to know of, and can recommend a type of BluRay writer? Somebody on our other list reminded me of my intention to get one of these things and I want to investigate the prices, availability and compatibility. Lynne From support at mac-access.net Wed Aug 17 03:48:46 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Wed, 17 Aug 2011 03:48:46 +0100 Subject: Maintenance Going Ahead; Please REad Message-ID: Hello everybody As mentioned earlier, we have some essential maintenance work which needs doing quickly. Therefore we are forfeiting our night's sleep in order to get the work done at a time which is inconvenient to the least number of people possible. We shall be taking the mail services off line at 02:00 UTC today. That is in 14 minutes from the time of writing. I won't predict how long it will be down but we'll get the job done as quickly as possible. Our mail backup servers are waiting to catch any mail while we're off line. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From mstores at indiana.edu Tue Aug 16 20:39:40 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2011 15:39:40 -0400 Subject: Peacemaker Sound Enclosure Message-ID: <20110816153940.xdk1hiaen4ow4wk4@webmail.iu.edu> Hi guys, So our university is looking into replacing the sound booth (which is old, ugly, losing its insulation and therefore not as effective) with a Peacemaker sound Enclosure from Enabling Technologies. The video that ET has on their site is inconclusive. Have any of you had any experience with this sound enclosure? We would like to be able to emboss stuff during the day when students are around, so your honesty would be appreciated. I've looked for blog entries on it, but I've found nothing. Thanks for any feedback you can provide. Mary From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu Aug 18 14:47:27 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2011 08:47:27 -0500 Subject: Peacemaker Sound Enclosure Message-ID: <201108181347.p7IDlRcd017222@x.it.okstate.edu> Have you got a link to the video you watched? There are lots of ways sound leaks in and out and you could have an enclosure that was excellent at stopping sound that came through the air but lousy at preventing vibrations through the floor or walls. Teletype machines from years gone by used to be really good at almost shaking a whole building to pieces. Our news room at KOSU in the early seventies had 3 Teletypes in it of different speeds and all of them really rocked and rolled when they were running. The worst one ran at 120 words per minute and the table it was on would sway back and forth. It was kind of scary. It was ear-splittingly loud through the air and I can imagine how a sound booth would have cut that sound down but there would have been a lot of vibration still transmitted through the floor. Unless that enclosure has an absorbent floor, it might do really well on the sound through the air but nothing for vibrations transmitted directly through objects. Mary Stores writes: > Hi guys, > > > So our university is looking into replacing the sound booth (which is old, > ugly, losing its insulation and therefore not as effective) with a > Peacemaker sound Enclosure from Enabling Technologies. The video that ET > has on their site is inconclusive. Have any of you had any experience with > this sound enclosure? We would like to be able to emboss stuff during the > day when students are around, so your honesty would be appreciated. I've > looked for blog entries on it, but I've found nothing. > > > Thanks for any feedback you can provide. > > Mary > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated > web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > From mstores at indiana.edu Thu Aug 18 18:13:08 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Thu, 18 Aug 2011 13:13:08 -0400 Subject: Peacemaker Sound Enclosure In-Reply-To: <201108181347.p7IDlRcd017222@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108181347.p7IDlRcd017222@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <20110818131308.mofukl5aao0ccooc@webmail.iu.edu> Hi Martin Oops, I pressed reply instead of reply to list. the video is at http://www.brailler.com/peacemaker.htm . Thanks for your points about sound. The higher-ups have considered it. Mary Quoting Martin McCormick : > Have you got a link to the video you watched? > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 03:39:59 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 03:39:59 +0100 Subject: Windows Recovery Message-ID: <6F3B2743-9248-45C9-9AF0-392FCBF6C0F9@mac-access.net> Hello everybody This is another example of why I hate Windows. The other day I tried changing the memory in our Asus NetBook. The reason for this was that we put a 2GB PC3 1067 MHZ module in it a while back and it seemed to be running quite slowly still. So when the opportunity came around, owing to another upgraded machine earlier this week, I inserted the same type of memory but it was 1333 MHZ instead of 1067 MHZ. I surmised that since this machine was quite new and since it was Intel Core 2 Duo, I should be able to get away with this and I thought that, if it required slower memory it would simply drop the buss speed. No such luck! The entire system went absolutely mental! And it has left me with a trashed NetBook. Well, from the software perspective I mean. I changed the memory back, in the hope that I'd be able to roll back the system using RollBack. But no such luck, it isn't appearing in the boot menu for some reason. So, what I'm asking now is does anybody know where I can get an Asus EeePC resort disk? I thought we had one but when I looked at it it wasn't a disk image, just a copy of the Windows files, so it isn't bootable. There's supposed to be a recover partition on the HD which I had thought you used by holding down the F9 key at power up. But that isn't working either. I really don't like this new idea of using hidden partitions to recover the OS. Apple has gone the same way now but at least one can either download the OS or create a bootable thumb drive. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 03:46:02 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 03:46:02 +0100 Subject: More Windows Queries Message-ID: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> Hello again Another Windows question. First of all, is it possible to obtain a Windows XP 64-bit edition CD image from anywhere and, if so, do you need separate product keys from the 32-bit version? If, of course, there's even such a thing as a 64-bit version of XP. I have an official Windows 7 product key actually and I have an official Windows 7 64-bit DVD image. But what I don't have is a way to create a bootable DVD using it. Although my other half has just suggested something which might work; so maybe I should go that route first. He's just come up with a possible solution. Even so, is there a way with XP? Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 07:59:45 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 07:59:45 +0100 Subject: The Future Of Windows XP; I Am Curious? Message-ID: <9BB4EF8B-7B35-494C-AA8B-3C840B5C0FE5@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Whilst installing a virtual machine on to one of our Macs this morning, a strange thought crossed my mind and I thought I'd run this passed the group to see whether anybody had any definitive knowledge, or whether anybody would care to speculate on my question. So here goes; and I should point out from the very very start that I'm only speculating, I have absolutely no insider knowledge or information whatsoever on this point. When Microsoft removes support for Windows XP, as I understand they plan too in the not too distant future, what, I wonder, is going to happen when you need to re-install your operating system on the assumption that you've decided to stick with that particular version of Windows? I ask this question because as I'm sure you know, on the average single user's license pack, it's necessary to activate your software using Microsoft's servers before the thing will come out of trial mode. If Microsoft do as they have done with Windows 2000, remove all updates and downloads from their website, it could be problematic because I would think they will also remove their activation servers. After all, why would they retain the activation server for a product that they no longer support? That would effectively put an end to the use of Windows XP even if you don't plan to upgrade to whatever is at that time their latest and greatest offering. Now, before the "boo boys" start jumping on this as a criticism of Microsoft, it isn't. I'm not at all criticising; in fact I can totally understand their position. It would be unrealistic to expect them to maintain the activation servers once the product has reached the end of its life cycle. Lynne From christopherh40 at gmail.com Fri Aug 19 09:05:21 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 09:05:21 +0100 Subject: More Windows Queries In-Reply-To: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4E4E1941.5000707@gmail.com> I think there is one, and I mean one, copy of XP X64 ever produced. I don't know why it was so unpopular and why it didn't do well in the markets but there you go. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 19/08/2011 03:46, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello again > > Another Windows question. First of all, is it possible to obtain a Windows XP 64-bit edition CD image from anywhere and, if so, do you need separate product keys from the 32-bit version? If, of course, there's even such a thing as a 64-bit version of XP. > > I have an official Windows 7 product key actually and I have an official Windows 7 64-bit DVD image. But what I don't have is a way to create a bootable DVD using it. Although my other half has just suggested something which might work; so maybe I should go that route first. He's just come up with a possible solution. Even so, is there a way with XP? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 09:14:38 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 09:14:38 +0100 Subject: More Windows Queries In-Reply-To: <4E4E1941.5000707@gmail.com> References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> <4E4E1941.5000707@gmail.com> Message-ID: <7613526C-1140-4994-953D-648F389309A1@mac-access.net> Hi Chris My other half has gone out to work, so I'll reply in her stead. I am surmising, as I said to Lynne, that the reason XP 64-bit didn't catch on was that at the time 64-bit machines were very very expensive. Indeed, when I bought my first AMD Athlon 64, it cost me nearly 400 Pounds just for the processor and another 50 for the necessary heat sink and fan. That was much later than the release of XP so as I said, my guess is that it was pure economics. It wasn't really until that disaster, Vista was released that it became realistic to produce 64-bit operating systems. The availability of such machines is now far more widespread. Indeed, anybody who owns an Apple machine produced within the last 4 years or so has a 64-bit machine right away. Many other laptops are also using Xeon processors now which means, of course, that they too are capable of running 64-bit operating systems. I have an Asus NetBook here which is 64-bit although the manufacturers, I suspect because of the price, ship those machines with a 32-bit OS. Actually my Asus is broken and, for whatever reason, I can't get it to even show me the Rollback boot menu which is odd in itself because it was definitely installed. So how I'm going to recover that I'm not entirely sure. But that's another story. Gordon On 19 Aug 2011, at 09:05, chris hallsworth wrote: I think there is one, and I mean one, copy of XP X64 ever produced. I don't know why it was so unpopular and why it didn't do well in the markets but there you go. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 19/08/2011 03:46, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello again > > Another Windows question. First of all, is it possible to obtain a Windows XP 64-bit edition CD image from anywhere and, if so, do you need separate product keys from the 32-bit version? If, of course, there's even such a thing as a 64-bit version of XP. > > I have an official Windows 7 product key actually and I have an official Windows 7 64-bit DVD image. But what I don't have is a way to create a bootable DVD using it. Although my other half has just suggested something which might work; so maybe I should go that route first. He's just come up with a possible solution. Even so, is there a way with XP? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 10:07:00 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 10:07:00 +0100 Subject: Window-Eyes 7.5 First-Time Installation Message-ID: Hi all Has anybody tried a from the ground up installation of Window-Eyes 7.5 without first having any other version on your system? I ask because I have been trying to continue what Lynne started earlier this morning, installing a VM on our Mac which contains Windows XP SP2 and I attempted to add Window-Eyes 7.5 to it. Each time I try this I'm getting as far as Doug Geoffray's announcement about installing with speech, without speech, etc. Pressing enter to restart the computer and then, following the restart, WE runs in silent mode when it should be speaking. If I run that horrible "Narrator", I can see what Lynne told me was there. Window-Eyes taking me through its installation. So I followed the installation prompts, selecting the appropriate paths etc. When the install concludes I get no speech, no error no nothing. According to the list of active processes, Window-Eyes is running and the default synthesiser is running. But as I said, silence. This kind of thing makes me realise just how lucky I am to have escaped the binds of Windows, for the most part. We only installed a VM for the sake of helping somebody out and also we thought that perhaps we could use it for my embossing if we could get the KeySpan drivers to load properly. Ah well, it looks like I'll have to try something else. Maybe install NVDA and see if that works. But in general I have to say I'm very unimpressed by GW Micro's latest offerings. Gordon From christopherh40 at gmail.com Fri Aug 19 10:15:42 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 10:15:42 +0100 Subject: Window-Eyes 7.5 First-Time Installation In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4E4E29BE.5080601@gmail.com> I cannot seem to duplicate this unless this is a problem with VMware Fusion. I can install a VM of Windows XP and add Window-Eyes with no issues under VMware Player for Windows. Oh well let's hope NVDA works. It should. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 19/08/2011 10:07, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi all > > Has anybody tried a from the ground up installation of Window-Eyes 7.5 without first having any other version on your system? I ask because I have been trying to continue what Lynne started earlier this morning, installing a VM on our Mac which contains Windows XP SP2 and I attempted to add Window-Eyes 7.5 to it. Each time I try this I'm getting as far as Doug Geoffray's announcement about installing with speech, without speech, etc. Pressing enter to restart the computer and then, following the restart, WE runs in silent mode when it should be speaking. If I run that horrible "Narrator", I can see what Lynne told me was there. Window-Eyes taking me through its installation. So I followed the installation prompts, selecting the appropriate paths etc. When the install concludes I get no speech, no error no nothing. According to the list of active processes, Window-Eyes is running and the default synthesiser is running. But as I said, silence. > > This kind of thing makes me realise just how lucky I am to have escaped the binds of Windows, for the most part. We only installed a VM for the sake of helping somebody out and also we thought that perhaps we could use it for my embossing if we could get the KeySpan drivers to load properly. > > Ah well, it looks like I'll have to try something else. Maybe install NVDA and see if that works. But in general I have to say I'm very unimpressed by GW Micro's latest offerings. > > Gordon > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 10:40:58 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 10:40:58 +0100 Subject: Window-Eyes 7.5 First-Time Installation In-Reply-To: <4E4E29BE.5080601@gmail.com> References: <4E4E29BE.5080601@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Chris It's possible that it's a Fusion issue, but I doubt it because I've used it with WE 7.2 in the past with no problems. I guess I'll try it again with 7.2 then upgrade to 7.5 when I can be bothered. To tell you the truth Windows doesn't do much for me these days anyway. Personal choice, of course. But I find Windows a bit cumbersome. That said there's no doubt it does have advantages. For instance, VoiceOver struggles with Ajax websites. Gordon On 19 Aug 2011, at 10:15, chris hallsworth wrote: I cannot seem to duplicate this unless this is a problem with VMware Fusion. I can install a VM of Windows XP and add Window-Eyes with no issues under VMware Player for Windows. Oh well let's hope NVDA works. It should. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 19/08/2011 10:07, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi all > > Has anybody tried a from the ground up installation of Window-Eyes 7.5 without first having any other version on your system? I ask because I have been trying to continue what Lynne started earlier this morning, installing a VM on our Mac which contains Windows XP SP2 and I attempted to add Window-Eyes 7.5 to it. Each time I try this I'm getting as far as Doug Geoffray's announcement about installing with speech, without speech, etc. Pressing enter to restart the computer and then, following the restart, WE runs in silent mode when it should be speaking. If I run that horrible "Narrator", I can see what Lynne told me was there. Window-Eyes taking me through its installation. So I followed the installation prompts, selecting the appropriate paths etc. When the install concludes I get no speech, no error no nothing. According to the list of active processes, Window-Eyes is running and the default synthesiser is running. But as I said, silence. > > This kind of thing makes me realise just how lucky I am to have escaped the binds of Windows, for the most part. We only installed a VM for the sake of helping somebody out and also we thought that perhaps we could use it for my embossing if we could get the KeySpan drivers to load properly. > > Ah well, it looks like I'll have to try something else. Maybe install NVDA and see if that works. But in general I have to say I'm very unimpressed by GW Micro's latest offerings. > > Gordon > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From support at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 10:52:00 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 10:52:00 +0100 Subject: New Member Welcome Message-ID: <4A530E06-058C-4D27-BD46-CC91E372F4B8@mac-access.net> Hi all Lynne isn't here to do this so I am jumping in. Hannah Day just joined us and we always like to welcome new members personally. So welcome N Hannah and I hope you find this coup an interesting place to discuss technology. If you have any list-related issues, don't hesitate to contact us as indicated by the policy document you were sent when you joined. Have fun. Gordon ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Fri Aug 19 16:28:53 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 10:28:53 -0500 Subject: What's in a hard drive? Message-ID: <201108191528.p7JFSrqw024354@x.it.okstate.edu> I recently noticed that a ten-year-old hard rive was beginning to sound more like a 747 sitting on the runway, cleared for takeoff so I decided to retire it before it decided to pick the day, itself. I replaced it with a solid-state flash drive so it is very, very quiet now. The only sound is the fan in the power supply. The old hard drive will never make noise again as I took it apart for fun. It is the newest drive I have ever looked at and here is what you find in your average hard drive: Firstly, one must never open a hard drive unless you are absolutely sure it is dead because they are sealed in a clean room environment as the slightest speck of dust will cause a head crash. This drive was your typical IDE 3.5-inch-platter drive that you find in many middle-aged computers. The screws that hold the lid on and the circuit board in are security screws that require a special tool. I used a tiny screwdriver that can wedge in to the special head and turn it anyway so that's how I got it open. Firstly everything inside the sealed compartment is extremely clean unless there has been a head crash and then you might find debris from the crash. This drive had not crashed, however, so it was nice and clean. What you see is a spindle in the center holding two 3.5-inch platters stacked like phonograph records used to be back in the day. The only other thing inside the enclosure is the head stack or comb. It is two sets of two heads that read both sides of the platter. They are on an arm that goes to a post that acts like a pivot. If you look down on the disk platters, the arm is like a see-saw on its side. The positioning of the heads is done by what is called a voice coil because it resembles a loud speaker. There is a powerful magnet and right above it is the coil such that electric current applied to the coil makes it attract or repel the magnet and that moves the heads. Except for the motor that continuously spins the platter stack, that's pretty much it. The magic is in the circuitry on the controller board that applies the varying voltage to the voice coil in the head stack and finds the right track on the four sides of the disk. That part amazes me that it can work as well as it does for as many years as it does. This drive was loud enough as it ran to be kind of uncomfortable to listen to near by and no telling how much longer it would have continued to operate as it would sometimes make additional strange sounds as if some object was getting caught in the motor and then thrown. Amazingly, it still read and wrote data but one would have been a fool to trust it. From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 19:09:09 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 19:09:09 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> Message-ID: <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> Hi Sarah I have moved this from Mac Access because it isn't Apple specific so it doesn't belong on that list really. The newer drives have that hidden partition on them, whereas the old ones did not. They just allowed you to delete the software if you didn't want it. I've been using WD drives for about 15 years up until a couple of years ago. In the good old days, they were excellent. But the new ones are a disaster. Lynne and I have had 3 of them die in the last 12 months alone. Not portable ones I grant you that. I do actually have one of those Passport drives here but only because somebody bought me it as a present last Christmas. The MyBook drives are a pile of junk in my opinion. They're not reliable and they are actually very slow. We also have one of the MyBook Studio Edition drives here which is a 2TB drive that has 1394B, USB2 and SATA interfaces. To be fair, that drive has given us reasonably good performance and the only reason it's kind of held together by tape and blew is that it was dropped on one occasion as we were carrying it from point A to point B. But I will say this about the large models, the power supplies are absolutely dreadful. They die more frequently than the drives. On 19 Aug 2011, at 18:59, Sarah Alawami wrote: Really? I've had nothing but good luck in the 4 years I've used western digital drives. I own 3 of them now actually. Also I don't remember seeing hidden partition. I just reformatted the whole thing when I got it and that was that. Now the other drive you mentioned. all of those I had died with in a year of my buying them and I lost a lot of stuff so for me the western digital drives are what I use and hopefully unless something comes along that's better is what I will continue to use. My studio is very quiet because of them. On Aug 19, 2011, at 9:03 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > > We have a couple of these things and, to be honest, they're really nothing special. We've also had more trouble with WD drives than any other computing component. Seagate drives are faster, slicker, more reliable and more Mac compatible. > > The thing I hate about the WD drives is that there's always a hidden partition on them which you can't re-format. Horrible! > > Gordon > > > On 19 Aug 2011, at 16:55, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > I love these little drives. Wish I had one but ah well. it works. I had a chance to use one and it was whisper quiet. > > Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive > > The My Passport Essential gives you plenty of hard drive space in a compact and lightweight device, making it much more convenient to keep your important information as close as your pocket. > > http://onj.me/104 > <--- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net ---> > > To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access at mac-access.net > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: > > or at the public Mail Archive: > . > Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: > > > The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! > > Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: > > > <--- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net ---> > > To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access at mac-access.net > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: > > or at the public Mail Archive: > . > Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: > > > The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! > > Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: > <--- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net ---> To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access at mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: or at the public Mail Archive: . Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Fri Aug 19 19:17:27 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 13:17:27 -0500 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> I use the 4 TB NAS server, have had it for over 2 years, and it hasn't missed a beat! I'm able to write windows and Mac stuff to this drive. So I guess it depends on the drive, or the person. Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians -----Original Message----- From: techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com [mailto:techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com] On Behalf Of Gordon Smith Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 1:09 PM To: Technology Enthusiasm Subject: Re: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive Hi Sarah I have moved this from Mac Access because it isn't Apple specific so it doesn't belong on that list really. The newer drives have that hidden partition on them, whereas the old ones did not. They just allowed you to delete the software if you didn't want it. I've been using WD drives for about 15 years up until a couple of years ago. In the good old days, they were excellent. But the new ones are a disaster. Lynne and I have had 3 of them die in the last 12 months alone. Not portable ones I grant you that. I do actually have one of those Passport drives here but only because somebody bought me it as a present last Christmas. The MyBook drives are a pile of junk in my opinion. They're not reliable and they are actually very slow. We also have one of the MyBook Studio Edition drives here which is a 2TB drive that has 1394B, USB2 and SATA interfaces. To be fair, that drive has given us reasonably good performance and the only reason it's kind of held together by tape and blew is that it was dropped on one occasion as we were carrying it from point A to point B. But I will say this about the large models, the power supplies are absolutely dreadful. They die more frequently than the drives. On 19 Aug 2011, at 18:59, Sarah Alawami wrote: Really? I've had nothing but good luck in the 4 years I've used western digital drives. I own 3 of them now actually. Also I don't remember seeing hidden partition. I just reformatted the whole thing when I got it and that was that. Now the other drive you mentioned. all of those I had died with in a year of my buying them and I lost a lot of stuff so for me the western digital drives are what I use and hopefully unless something comes along that's better is what I will continue to use. My studio is very quiet because of them. On Aug 19, 2011, at 9:03 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > > We have a couple of these things and, to be honest, they're really nothing special. We've also had more trouble with WD drives than any other computing component. Seagate drives are faster, slicker, more reliable and more Mac compatible. > > The thing I hate about the WD drives is that there's always a hidden partition on them which you can't re-format. Horrible! > > Gordon > > > On 19 Aug 2011, at 16:55, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > I love these little drives. Wish I had one but ah well. it works. I had a chance to use one and it was whisper quiet. > > Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive > > The My Passport Essential gives you plenty of hard drive space in a compact and lightweight device, making it much more convenient to keep your important information as close as your pocket. > > http://onj.me/104 > <--- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net ---> > > To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access at mac-access.net > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: > > or at the public Mail Archive: > . > Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: > > > The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! > > Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: > > > <--- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net ---> > > To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access at mac-access.net > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: > > or at the public Mail Archive: > . > Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: > > > The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! > > Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: > <--- Mac Access At Mac Access Dot Net ---> To reply to this post, please address your message to mac-access at mac-access.net You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Mac-Access forum at either the list's own dedicated web archive: or at the public Mail Archive: . Subscribe to the list's RSS feed from: The Mac-Access mailing list is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free! Please remember to update your membership options periodically by visiting the list website at: _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 19:20:05 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 19:20:05 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <603641AD-BAAB-4961-AD87-B8CADC47C20F@mac-access.net> Hi Now you're talking a totally different product. I wouldn't deny for a second that WD does still make quality hardware at the top of the market. So yes I can totally believe that. On 19 Aug 2011, at 19:17, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: I use the 4 TB NAS server, have had it for over 2 years, and it hasn't missed a beat! I'm able to write windows and Mac stuff to this drive. So I guess it depends on the drive, or the person. From mstores at indiana.edu Fri Aug 19 19:27:07 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 14:27:07 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <20110819142707.cflur3juk8wkcksg@webmail.iu.edu> Hello, I bought a WD Drive last year, and it does have a hidden partition. In addition, it says you have to install this organizing software in order to use it. I found the software to be inaccessible, and I also found you did not have to install it to use the drive. Other than that, though, I've had no problems with the drive. I got it to store books and music. It's a desktop version, but still small enough to move if I need to. Quoting Gordon Smith : > Hi Sarah > > I have moved this from Mac Access because it isn't Apple specific so > it doesn't belong on that list really. > > The newer drives have that hidden partition on them, whereas the old > ones did not. They just allowed you to delete the software if you > didn't want it. > > I've been using WD drives for about 15 years up until a couple of > years ago. In the good old days, they were excellent. But the new > ones are a disaster. Lynne and I have had 3 of them die in the last > 12 months alone. Not portable ones I grant you that. I do actually > have one of those Passport drives here but only because somebody > bought me it as a present last Christmas. > > The MyBook drives are a pile of junk in my opinion. They're not > reliable and they are actually very slow. We also have one of the > MyBook Studio Edition drives here which is a 2TB drive that has > 1394B, USB2 and SATA interfaces. To be fair, that drive has given us > reasonably good performance and the only reason it's kind of held > together by tape and blew is that it was dropped on one occasion as > we were carrying it from point A to point B. > > But I will say this about the large models, the power supplies are > absolutely dreadful. They die more frequently than the drives. > From mstores at indiana.edu Fri Aug 19 19:29:09 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 14:29:09 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> It wouldn't depend on the person. If your drive conks out on you, it's not your fault. smile. Maybe different storing environments or conditions of use perhaps... Mary Quoting Kliph&Sharrie : > I use the 4 TB NAS server, have had it for over 2 years, and it hasn't > missed a beat! I'm able to write windows and Mac stuff to this drive. So I > guess it depends on the drive, or the person. > > Kliphton SR > (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 > (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com > (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians > > > From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 19:39:10 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 19:39:10 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <20110819142707.cflur3juk8wkcksg@webmail.iu.edu> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <20110819142707.cflur3juk8wkcksg@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: Hi Mary I'm guessing you have a MyBook drive. Now, before we go any further I wouldn't deny that it's always going to be the case that some of them last forever, while others die very quickly. It's also completely fair to say that it can depend upon how much stress you put these things under. And it's also fair to say that WD does offer a very good product warranty on their hardware. I don't want you to think I'm knocking this stuff for the sake of it, far from it. I'd be the first to admit that I could have just been unlucky. But as Lynne will tell you I think, we've lost some pretty valuable data before now as a result of those WD drives dying on us. Not the least of which was a copy of a boot disk which we could have done with right now actually as our Asus NetBook is flat on its face because of some strange Windows issue that's killed it. I can't even get it to recover, which is odd because I took what I thought was every possible precaution. But getting back to the point. I have to admit that their NAS servers do look nice and I'm going to look to see what the prices are like in comparison to, for instance, the Promise drives. The Promise drives have the advantage of having a Thunderbolt interface now, which makes a lot of difference to us since our machine is thunderbolt-ready. But we will see. That's a different discussion. Yes, the hidden partition is definitely there, even on the new Passport drives. It's only small but that's not the point, it shouldn't be like that. You can't get rid of that partition because it's hard coded, so to speak. But no, you definitely do not need to install their software to use the drives. Gordon On 19 Aug 2011, at 19:27, Mary Stores wrote: I bought a WD Drive last year, and it does have a hidden partition. In addition, it says you have to install this organizing software in order to use it. I found the software to be inaccessible, and I also found you did not have to install it to use the drive. Other than that, though, I've had no problems with the drive. I got it to store books and music. It's a desktop version, but still small enough to move if I need to. From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 19:41:10 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 19:41:10 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> I have to admit that comment did puzzle me a bit. :) On 19 Aug 2011, at 19:29, Mary Stores wrote: It wouldn't depend on the person. If your drive conks out on you, it's not your fault. smile. Maybe different storing environments or conditions of use perhaps... From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Fri Aug 19 20:56:09 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 14:56:09 -0500 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive Message-ID: <201108191956.p7JJu925026174@x.it.okstate.edu> I don't think I have ever had a drive fail in a way in which the hidden partition would have been of any use at all had there been one. I had an 80-gigabyte Maxtor anda nother 300 GB Maxtor both fail without warning by just simply refusing to read or write any data. It was as if you had wiped the platters clean. I suspect that the electronics module failed because you could still hear the drive motor running normally and you could also hear the heads move if you tried to check the disk. Had there been a hidden partition, it would have gone away, also so that drive would still just be the warm expensive brick it became. I think those hidden partitions are only good if the corruption is due to software issues. Martin From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 19 21:06:07 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 21:06:07 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <201108191956.p7JJu925026174@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108191956.p7JJu925026174@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Hi Martin The hidden partitions, or actually I should call them protected partitions, not just hidden, contain the WD software for Windows & Mac, plus the manuals. You see the Windows software if you're running Windows and the Mac software if Mac. But you cannot delete those partitions no matter what you do. Now, it's only fair to say that not every WD drive I've ever had has failed. In fact, the most common thing that seems to die is the power supply. WD seems to under-rate the supplies. although I doubt that the supplies themselves are manufactured by WD. Again, I am trying to be utterly fair here, I have had Maxtor drives and one Seagate drive which have failed. But the vast majority of failures seem to be WD in our case. Over the last couple of years we've had at least 4 or 5 drives bite the dust. Gordon On 19 Aug 2011, at 20:56, Martin McCormick wrote: I don't think I have ever had a drive fail in a way in which the hidden partition would have been of any use at all had there been one. I had an 80-gigabyte Maxtor anda nother 300 GB Maxtor both fail without warning by just simply refusing to read or write any data. It was as if you had wiped the platters clean. I suspect that the electronics module failed because you could still hear the drive motor running normally and you could also hear the heads move if you tried to check the disk. Had there been a hidden partition, it would have gone away, also so that drive would still just be the warm expensive brick it became. I think those hidden partitions are only good if the corruption is due to software issues. Martin _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Fri Aug 19 23:11:30 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 17:11:30 -0500 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <603641AD-BAAB-4961-AD87-B8CADC47C20F@mac-access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <603641AD-BAAB-4961-AD87-B8CADC47C20F@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <00bd01cc5ebc$f34a30d0$d9de9270$@gmail.com> I thought hard drives were hard ware also, this is just a bigger kind. Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians -----Original Message----- From: techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com [mailto:techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com] On Behalf Of Gordon Smith Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 1:20 PM To: Technology Enthusiasm Subject: Re: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive Hi Now you're talking a totally different product. I wouldn't deny for a second that WD does still make quality hardware at the top of the market. So yes I can totally believe that. On 19 Aug 2011, at 19:17, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: I use the 4 TB NAS server, have had it for over 2 years, and it hasn't missed a beat! I'm able to write windows and Mac stuff to this drive. So I guess it depends on the drive, or the person. _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Sat Aug 20 02:49:08 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 20:49:08 -0500 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> What I meant by that comment was. It could have to do with the care you handle it with, dropping, bumping, or flinging it around on there desk. Or how big or small the files you are writing to the drive. JMO, I've been using these WD drives and NAS storage devices for over 6 years, when the one that I had did fale because I dropped it, they replaced it no questions asked. So if anything there customer service is great! Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians On Aug 19, 2011, at 1:41 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > I have to admit that comment did puzzle me a bit. :) > > On 19 Aug 2011, at 19:29, Mary Stores wrote: > > It wouldn't depend on the person. If your drive conks out on you, it's not your fault. smile. Maybe different storing environments or conditions of use perhaps... > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From christopherh40 at gmail.com Sat Aug 20 09:59:38 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 09:59:38 +0100 Subject: Deep Freeze Message-ID: <4E4F777A.1050403@gmail.com> Hello all. I would like to spread the word about this very cool system utility to protect your pc from unauthorized changes by reverting them upon the next reboot. www.faronics.com. It is quite accessible, even with NVDA, but you do need to use your screen review commands. However there are some keyboard shortcuts, like shift-ctrl-alt-f6 to bring up the log on dialogue to log into Deep Freeze. Once logged in you can press alt-a to focus to the status tab and to focus on the group of radio buttons, which has boot from frozen selected. Once you tell Deep Freeze what to do you can either click ok or you can press alt-r to apply and reboot. Chat soon. -- Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 12:38:28 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 12:38:28 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <00bd01cc5ebc$f34a30d0$d9de9270$@gmail.com> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <603641AD-BAAB-4961-AD87-B8CADC47C20F@mac-access.net> <00bd01cc5ebc$f34a30d0$d9de9270$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <9694B0AE-EE43-4AF7-997F-E10D974D2052@mac-access.net> Nobody suggested otherwise. On 19 Aug 2011, at 23:11, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: I thought hard drives were hard ware also, this is just a bigger kind. From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 12:40:53 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 12:40:53 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> We have had good customer services from WD, no dispute there. But given that Gordon is a professional in the field of technology, I think he should know how to handle a hard drive, and how not too. :) On 20 Aug 2011, at 02:49, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: What I meant by that comment was. It could have to do with the care you handle it with, dropping, bumping, or flinging it around on there desk. Or how big or small the files you are writing to the drive. JMO, I've been using these WD drives and NAS storage devices for over 6 years, when the one that I had did fale because I dropped it, they replaced it no questions asked. So if anything there customer service is great! From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Sat Aug 20 15:03:43 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 09:03:43 -0500 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> Even professionals make mistakes. And based on prier posts, well? Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians -----Original Message----- From: techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com [mailto:techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 6:41 AM To: Technology Enthusiasm Subject: Re: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive We have had good customer services from WD, no dispute there. But given that Gordon is a professional in the field of technology, I think he should know how to handle a hard drive, and how not too. :) On 20 Aug 2011, at 02:49, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: What I meant by that comment was. It could have to do with the care you handle it with, dropping, bumping, or flinging it around on there desk. Or how big or small the files you are writing to the drive. JMO, I've been using these WD drives and NAS storage devices for over 6 years, when the one that I had did fale because I dropped it, they replaced it no questions asked. So if anything there customer service is great! _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 15:55:15 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 15:55:15 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello Nobody suggested anything to the contrary; but I don't see why you're twisting everything anybody says to you. This is supposed to be a dissucion list, not an argument list. If you want to argue perhaps this isn't the place. On 20 Aug 2011, at 15:03, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: Even professionals make mistakes. And based on prier posts, well? Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians -----Original Message----- From: techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com [mailto:techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 6:41 AM To: Technology Enthusiasm Subject: Re: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive We have had good customer services from WD, no dispute there. But given that Gordon is a professional in the field of technology, I think he should know how to handle a hard drive, and how not too. :) On 20 Aug 2011, at 02:49, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: What I meant by that comment was. It could have to do with the care you handle it with, dropping, bumping, or flinging it around on there desk. Or how big or small the files you are writing to the drive. JMO, I've been using these WD drives and NAS storage devices for over 6 years, when the one that I had did fale because I dropped it, they replaced it no questions asked. So if anything there customer service is great! _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Sat Aug 20 16:03:16 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 10:03:16 -0500 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Wasn't arguing, just pointing things out. but since my observation are being taking the wrong way, I will just shut my mouth, or stop my finger!lol Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians On Aug 20, 2011, at 9:55 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello > > Nobody suggested anything to the contrary; but I don't see why you're twisting everything anybody says to you. This is supposed to be a dissucion list, not an argument list. If you want to argue perhaps this isn't the place. > > On 20 Aug 2011, at 15:03, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: > > Even professionals make mistakes. And based on prier posts, well? > > Kliphton SR > (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 > (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com > (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com > [mailto:techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel > Smith > Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 6:41 AM > To: Technology Enthusiasm > Subject: Re: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive > > We have had good customer services from WD, no dispute there. But given that > Gordon is a professional in the field of technology, I think he should know > how to handle a hard drive, and how not too. :) > > On 20 Aug 2011, at 02:49, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: > > What I meant by that comment was. It could have to do with the care you > handle it with, dropping, bumping, or flinging it around on there desk. Or > how big or small the files you are writing to the drive. JMO, I've been > using these WD drives and NAS storage devices for over 6 years, when the one > that I had did fale because I dropped it, they replaced it no questions > asked. So if anything there customer service is great! > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus > and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web > pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From tsiegel at softcon.com Sat Aug 20 16:21:14 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 11:21:14 -0400 Subject: More Windows Queries In-Reply-To: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> Message-ID: There is indeed a 64-bit version of windows xp. I have both the 32- bit and the 64-bit version. The problem is: Most things (such as drivers for hardware, and screen readers) don't support the 64-bit version of windows xp. Jaws, window eyes, and system access 32 do not support the 64-bit version of xp, though there is one that does, though I don't remember which one it is. I had the 64-bit version of xp installed for a while, and had to remove it, due to lack of drivers and screen reader support. And, yes, there are different activation keys for the 32 and 64-bit versions of xp. hth. From tsiegel at softcon.com Sat Aug 20 16:33:17 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 11:33:17 -0400 Subject: What's in a hard drive? In-Reply-To: <201108191528.p7JFSrqw024354@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108191528.p7JFSrqw024354@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <1986E136-06C8-48DD-A31C-A09E6E646988@softcon.com> Your post reminded me of something that happened several years ago. My sister was in need of a computer, so I loaned her my spari 286 machine. These things were workhorses, and I never had a lick of trouble out of this thing in the 10 or so years I had it, these things took a beating, and kept on working. Well, 3 months after my sister got ahold of it, it quit working. I couldn't figure out for the life of me why, since of all the machines I'd loaned her, each and every one got toasted in various ways, and none of them ever worked for longer than a year. I'd expected this one to last considerably longer. Well, after some initial investigations, and some questioning, I discovered she'd decided the hd needed cleaned. Why on earth she came to this conclusion I have no idea, it had been working just fine, but since both her and her husband both smoked, I guess she figured it needed cleaned to get rid of the smoke. Well, the upshot of it is that she actually took apart the hard drive, cleaned it, (claiming it had lots of scratches on it) and put it back together. After hearing this, I exclaimed. Aha, that's the problem, those hard drives should only be taken apart in a clean room, and never in an average house, especially one filled with smoke particles. Her response was that the machine worked after she put it back together, so it had to be something else. I promptly informed her about how hds worked, and probably what happened was that initially it worked, until a speck of dust or smoke, or ash, or something else got in, and crashed the read/write heads. She of course didn't believe me, and still claimed my computer was junk. Needless to say, I've never loaned her another computer, and have never, never, ever fixed one of her computers ever again. It's absolutely mind boggling how some people think. From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Sat Aug 20 16:40:49 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 11:40:49 -0400 Subject: More Windows Queries In-Reply-To: References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <488A0E99-45EA-48A2-8E4E-6C373021FCA3@Mac-Access.net> On Aug 20, 2011, at 11:21 AM, Travis Siegel wrote: > There is indeed a 64-bit version of windows xp. I have both the 32-bit and the 64-bit version. The problem is: Most things (such as drivers for hardware, and screen readers) don't support the 64-bit version of windows xp. Jaws, window eyes, and system access 32 do not support the 64-bit version of xp, though there is one that does, though I don't remember which one it is. > I had the 64-bit version of xp installed for a while, and had to remove it, due to lack of drivers and screen reader support. > > And, yes, there are different activation keys for the 32 and 64-bit versions of xp. > hth. > Hi List, This discussion reminds me that my version of Windows 7 is the 32 bit version. I bought it to put on my Mac Book. did I make a good decision to get the 32 or should I have the 64 bit version? I'll be using JAWS. As I essentially purchased a license from my school I could probably work out a change if I needed to. Eric > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Sat Aug 20 16:52:32 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 11:52:32 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <0FDB6FEB-6266-472D-9752-DDB3F68AC755@Mac-Access.net> On Aug 20, 2011, at 11:03 AM, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: > Wasn't arguing, just pointing things out. but since my observation are being taking the wrong way, I will just shut my mouth, or stop my finger!lol Hi folks, As I have three external WD drives I've been reading this thread with interest. I have had know mechanical problems but I am a low volume user. What I wanted to get back to is that darn hidden partitian on one of my WD Passport drives. Is there any way I can keep that darn thing off my desk top! I can't eject it. I didn't see it on the log in table. I don't like having to go past it every time I work on my desk top. I keep my desk top neat and only the most important things there. Having that thing there just to have the useless WD manuals drives me a bit nuts! Eric Caron From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 16:56:16 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 16:56:16 +0100 Subject: 64-Bit Windows XP In-Reply-To: References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hello Travis I believe Window-Eyes supports XP and later 64-bit. If only we had a key that worked with it, I would probably have been willing to buy that. But I'm relatively new to the Windows technical stuff so I really don't know what supports what and what doesn't. Lynne On 20 Aug 2011, at 16:21, Travis Siegel wrote: There is indeed a 64-bit version of windows xp. I have both the 32-bit and the 64-bit version. The problem is: Most things (such as drivers for hardware, and screen readers) don't support the 64-bit version of windows xp. Jaws, window eyes, and system access 32 do not support the 64-bit version of xp, though there is one that does, though I don't remember which one it is. I had the 64-bit version of xp installed for a while, and had to remove it, due to lack of drivers and screen reader support. And, yes, there are different activation keys for the 32 and 64-bit versions of xp. hth. From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 16:59:52 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 16:59:52 +0100 Subject: What's in a hard drive? In-Reply-To: <1986E136-06C8-48DD-A31C-A09E6E646988@softcon.com> References: <201108191528.p7JFSrqw024354@x.it.okstate.edu> <1986E136-06C8-48DD-A31C-A09E6E646988@softcon.com> Message-ID: Hello Travis Well I'm bound to say I'm a little surprised at this. I mean; taking a hard drive to pieces is no small matter. How did she get the drive out of the machine let alone get it to pieces? I think I could get a drive out of a machine now, but only because I've been shown how. But as for taking one to pieces, I wouldn't know where to start. Lynne On 20 Aug 2011, at 16:33, Travis Siegel wrote: Your post reminded me of something that happened several years ago. My sister was in need of a computer, so I loaned her my spari 286 machine. These things were workhorses, and I never had a lick of trouble out of this thing in the 10 or so years I had it, these things took a beating, and kept on working. Well, 3 months after my sister got ahold of it, it quit working. I couldn't figure out for the life of me why, since of all the machines I'd loaned her, each and every one got toasted in various ways, and none of them ever worked for longer than a year. I'd expected this one to last considerably longer. Well, after some initial investigations, and some questioning, I discovered she'd decided the hd needed cleaned. Why on earth she came to this conclusion I have no idea, it had been working just fine, but since both her and her husband both smoked, I guess she figured it needed cleaned to get rid of the smoke. Well, the upshot of it is that she actually took apart the hard drive, cleaned it, (claiming it had lots of scratches on it) and put it back together. After hearing this, I exclaimed. Aha, that's the problem, those hard drives should only be taken apart in a clean room, and never in an average house, especially one filled with smoke particles. Her response was that the machine worked after she put it back together, so it had to be something else. I promptly informed her about how hds worked, and probably what happened was that initially it worked, until a speck of dust or smoke, or ash, or something else got in, and crashed the read/write heads. She of course didn't believe me, and still claimed my computer was junk. Needless to say, I've never loaned her another computer, and have never, never, ever fixed one of her computers ever again. It's absolutely mind boggling how some people think. _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From tsiegel at softcon.com Sat Aug 20 17:01:27 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 12:01:27 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: References: <201108191956.p7JJu925026174@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <26CC0EB5-5812-4022-BB46-F8F126911767@softcon.com> On Aug 19, 2011, at 4:06 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi Martin > > The hidden partitions, or actually I should call them protected > partitions, not just hidden, contain the WD software for Windows & > Mac, plus the manuals. You see the Windows software if you're > running Windows and the Mac software if Mac. But you cannot delete > those partitions no matter what you do. Not to be contrary here, but you most certainly delete the partitions, it's not difficult, and I had a case recently where we were trying to restore an hp laptop, and it very happily deleted itself during the restore phase, because apparently, the install program expected to see 2 partitions, (a c: and a d: drive) and it didn't bother to check if they were actual partitions, or the (supposedly) protected restore partition. We'd used fdisk, to clear out all the old partitions, so there would be only a single c: drive, because this person didn't like having a c: and a d: drive, she wanted everything on a single drive. We'd used fdisk, deleted the two c: and d: partitions, rebuilt it as a single partition, and then booted into the recovery partition, and told it to do it's recovery process. Well, the folks at hp (in their infinite wisdom) happily removed the first two partitions on the disk, assuming (wrongly in this case) that they were the c: and d: drives. Shortly after that, the recovery process halted, claiming it couldn't find a required file. Rebooting with our boot cd, we discovered there was no longer any recovery partition, the recovery program had just blindly removed the first two partitions on the disk, and hadn't bothered to make sure they were regular partitions first. This of course made the computer useless, and we could no longer fix the machine. A call to hp ran into a brick wall (as expected) stating that they could do nothing, because they did not have the computer i their posession. Repeated requests for a recovery cd were met with stonewalling, and just plain denials that it was necessary. Finally, I found an iso image online, downloaded it, burned it to a dvd, and installed her os from scratch, and she got her computer back in working order. Of course, the hd failed again shortly afterwords, but that's anoother story. It's just absolutely mind boggling how so many companies not only use recovery partitions, but absolutely refuse to believe that the recovery partition could be damaged, comprimised, or damaged in any way. How it's possible for otherwise intelligent people to completely miss the fact that recovery partitions are subject to exactly the same things as regular partitions, and sometimes get irretrievably damaged is beyond me, but yet, they persist in this behavior, and I for one am very disappointed that apple has gone this route. Sure, it's cheaper for the company in question, but the headaches it causes can't be worth the effort it saves. Apple of all companies, one that is usually highly prized for their technical ability, and one that constantly inovates, instead of following the crowd, strikes me as absolutely insane for them to finally go this route, but since nobody asked me, I guess that opinion remains my own. :) From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 17:03:04 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 17:03:04 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Your observations on matters of technology are welcome. On 20 Aug 2011, at 16:03, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: Wasn't arguing, just pointing things out. but since my observation are being taking the wrong way, I will just shut my mouth, or stop my finger!lol From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 17:08:42 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 17:08:42 +0100 Subject: More Windows Queries In-Reply-To: <488A0E99-45EA-48A2-8E4E-6C373021FCA3@Mac-Access.net> References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> <488A0E99-45EA-48A2-8E4E-6C373021FCA3@Mac-Access.net> Message-ID: Hello Eric If you bought direct from Microsoft, (as I have just done), the same key works for 32 and 64-bit versions. We plan to put 7 on our MacBook Pro now that it has enough memory and so on, but we'll try the 64 bit version first. As for your decision, I suppose that's dependent on what you want to do with it. There will I' sure be more technically informed people than I offer their opinions. But my only real comment would be that now Lion is native 64-bit you might be better with the 64-bit version of Windows as well. If, that is, you plan to run Fusion. On 20 Aug 2011, at 16:40, Eric Caron wrote: This discussion reminds me that my version of Windows 7 is the 32 bit version. I bought it to put on my Mac Book. did I make a good decision to get the 32 or should I have the 64 bit version? I'll be using JAWS. As I essentially purchased a license from my school I could probably work out a change if I needed to. From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 17:14:15 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 17:14:15 +0100 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <0FDB6FEB-6266-472D-9752-DDB3F68AC755@Mac-Access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> <0FDB6FEB-6266-472D-9752-DDB3F68AC755@Mac-Access.net> Message-ID: Hello Eric You can't erase the hidden partition unfortunately. As for the mechanics of the things, as Gordon's just pointed out to me, we have had similar problems with a couple of Maxtor drives as well. So maybe it's more accurate to say it's the luck of the draw. We have an 8GB Promise server enclosure which uses 3.5 inch WD drives at the moment actually. But the advantage of those systems is that you can remove the SATA drives and replace them individually. In fact you can even hot-swap them since the server uses RAID5 array. Lynne On 20 Aug 2011, at 16:52, Eric Caron wrote: ? As I have three external WD drives I've been reading this thread with interest. I have had know mechanical problems but I am a low volume user. What I wanted to get back to is that darn hidden partitian on one of my WD Passport drives. Is there any way I can keep that darn thing off my desk top! I can't eject it. I didn't see it on the log in table. I don't like having to go past it every time I work on my desk top. I keep my desk top neat and only the most important things there. Having that thing there just to have the useless WD manuals drives me a bit nuts! Eric Caron _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From christopherh40 at gmail.com Sat Aug 20 17:33:52 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 17:33:52 +0100 Subject: 64-Bit Windows XP In-Reply-To: References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4E4FE1F0.9010603@gmail.com> No. No screen reader apart from NVDA and System Access works on XP 64 bit. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 20/08/2011 16:56, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Travis > > I believe Window-Eyes supports XP and later 64-bit. If only we had a key that worked with it, I would probably have been willing to buy that. But I'm relatively new to the Windows technical stuff so I really don't know what supports what and what doesn't. > > Lynne > > On 20 Aug 2011, at 16:21, Travis Siegel wrote: > > There is indeed a 64-bit version of windows xp. I have both the 32-bit and the 64-bit version. The problem is: Most things (such as drivers for hardware, and screen readers) don't support the 64-bit version of windows xp. Jaws, window eyes, and system access 32 do not support the 64-bit version of xp, though there is one that does, though I don't remember which one it is. > I had the 64-bit version of xp installed for a while, and had to remove it, due to lack of drivers and screen reader support. > > And, yes, there are different activation keys for the 32 and 64-bit versions of xp. > hth. > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 20 18:36:59 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 18:36:59 +0100 Subject: 64-bit access In-Reply-To: <4E4FE1F0.9010603@gmail.com> References: <40EBCD3F-38E0-45F5-9247-3CE080A86EE7@mac-access.net> <4E4FE1F0.9010603@gmail.com> Message-ID: <18ED50D9-0E6A-4D81-8602-056A1B70BBCE@mac-access.net> Hello Chris On 20 Aug 2011, at 17:33, chris hallsworth wrote: ^No. No screen reader apart from NVDA and System Access works on XP 64 bit. Are you sure about that? I'm not saying you're wrong; I just thought I remembered seeing that on the GW website. Lynne From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Sat Aug 20 18:55:14 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 13:55:14 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <26CC0EB5-5812-4022-BB46-F8F126911767@softcon.com> References: <201108191956.p7JJu925026174@x.it.okstate.edu> <26CC0EB5-5812-4022-BB46-F8F126911767@softcon.com> Message-ID: On Aug 20, 2011, at 12:01 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: >> Hi Martin >> >> The hidden partitions, or actually I should call them protected partitions, not just hidden, contain the WD software for Windows & Mac, plus the manuals. You see the Windows software if you're running Windows and the Mac software if Mac. But you cannot delete those partitions no matter what you do. > Not to be contrary here, but you most certainly delete the partitions, it's not difficult, and I had a case recently where we were trying to restore an hp laptop, and it very happily deleted itself during the restore phase, because apparently, the install program expected to see 2 partitions, (a c: and a d: drive) and it didn't bother to check if they were actual partitions, or the (supposedly) protected restore partition. > We'd used fdisk, to clear out all the old partitions, so there would be only a single c: drive, because this person didn't like having a c: and a d: drive, she wanted everything on a single drive. > We'd used fdisk, deleted the two c: and d: partitions, rebuilt it as a single partition, and then booted into the recovery partition, and told it to do it's recovery process. > W Travis, If you are saying the WD drive can be reformatted to get rid of the extra partition can you give simple directions? I prefer my Mac to do it but I could use my old XP machine in a pinch. I don't have Win 7 on the Mac yet. eric Caron From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sat Aug 20 19:00:57 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 13:00:57 -0500 Subject: What's in a hard drive? Message-ID: <201108201800.p7KI0vPp030709@x.it.okstate.edu> You may at least be aware of web sites and publications like "The Anarchist Cookbook" which are aimed at folks who want to generally cause mayhem for whatever twisted reason turns them on. Maybe they hate the government or some company or their neighbors, etc. You can read all about how to build various bombs and home-made weapons or commit sabotage if you don't blow yourself to kingdom come, first. I am no great student of that sort of thing so I may have missed something, but if I were going to tell someone how to stealthily destroy electronics right in plain sight, I would advise them to smoke cigarettes around the equipment. These need to be the plain tobacco variety because if you smoked pot, you might forget why you were doing it and stop too soon, but plain tobacco smoke is a God-send for the saboteur. When I was an electronics technician with our Audio Visual department, all my shop mates and I absolutely hated to work on equipment that had been around smokers. The smoke particles are a few microns in size and float in the air. The nicotine in the smoke makes a sticky film on any surface it touches so the particles along with good old dust now have some goo to help them stick to both horizontal and vertical surfaces. Since the gunk is airborne, it goes everywhere the air goes and fans help propagate the disgusting sludge in to any place open to the air. It goes in to sockets and eventually makes them intermittent. It goes in to controls and makes volume controls scratchy and intermittent much sooner than they would get that way with no smoke around. Switches fill with crud and get harder to move or they also stop working properly. Yes, cigarette smoke is fantastic for slowly ruining electronics so if you break the hermetic seal on a disk drive in a smoky environment, it almost guarantees failure. Travis Siegel writes: > Your post reminded me of something that happened several years ago. > > My sister was in need of a computer, so I loaned her my spari 286 machine. > These things were workhorses, and I never had a lick of trouble out of > this > thing in the 10 or so years I had it, these things took a beating, and > kept > on working. Well, 3 months after my sister got ahold of it, it quit > working. I couldn't figure out for the life of me why, since of all the > machines I'd loaned her, each and every one got toasted in various ways, > and none of them ever worked for longer than a year. I'd expected this one > to last considerably longer. Well, after some initial investigations, and > some questioning, I discovered she'd decided the hd needed cleaned. Why on > earth she came to this conclusion I have no idea, it had been working just > fine, but since both her and her husband both smoked, I guess she figured > it needed cleaned to get rid of the smoke. From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sat Aug 20 19:38:02 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 13:38:02 -0500 Subject: What's in a hard drive? Message-ID: <201108201838.p7KIc2c0030854@x.it.okstate.edu> "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > Hello Travis > > Well I'm bound to say I'm a little surprised at this. I mean; taking a > hard drive to pieces is no small matter. How did she get the drive out of > the machine let alone get it to pieces? I think I could get a drive out > of a machine now, but only because I've been shown how. But as for taking > one to pieces, I wouldn't know where to start. You start by not intending to repair it, but to totally destroy it (smile.) The flash drive I replaced it with is not physically the same size as a standard electromagnetic drive so I thought it would be possible to strip off everything from the chassis and then use the old chassis to physically support the new drive. You can certainly buy adaptors to make the flash drive fit a standard bay, but I didn't know what it would look like so didn't know I needed them until it arrived. The old drive is rubbish anyway, so why not? In case you are curious, the biggest problem is dealing with those security screws that are purposely not compatible with any known wrench or screw driver one has around. I was able to loosen most of them by wedging a small screwdriver in to the strange head and twisting while wondering if the screw would loosen before the small screw driver bent. There was another security screw holding the head rack pivot to the post and I accidentally loosened it while trying to push the post out of its hole. The disk platters, themselves were on a shaft that was a press fit in to the chassis so a hammer and punch knocked that assembly out. I now have an empty chassis that I can most likely use to secure the new flash drive so that it doesn't just flop around loose and short out something. I am curious as to how things are made, anyway, so this was an interesting exercise, but there was no plan at all of fixing or using the old drive again. Martin From eric_caron at mac-access.net Sun Aug 21 01:29:44 2011 From: eric_caron at mac-access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 20:29:44 -0400 Subject: WD hidden Partition removal success Message-ID: <1C21CBF6-2A34-4E14-AD37-2F6576548782@mac-access.net> Dear list, Sorry this is not in the original thread as I seemed to have deleted it! But I have great news for any of you that wanted that little partition to not keep mounting itself on the desk top. Mine is now gone! It turns out that at least in my case if you run the WD App and go to settings then to software settings there is a preference area and I was able to uncheck a box and no longer does the partitian show up! I did follow up on Travis's info and it sounds like there is one option on the Windows side to reformat and get the storage space back, but this solution is much easier and the space gain is minimal in my situation. So, I have the app in my apps folder for future use. I copied the files from the partition to another area in case I ever want them and, Hurray that silly partition no longer shows up on my desktop! Hope this helps others who want it gone! eric Caron P. S>. Hope this message only appears once. I re sent it once because it didn't seem to show up! From mstores at indiana.edu Sun Aug 21 04:53:08 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 23:53:08 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <20110820235308.89ah7ss4gkw4w4gs@webmail.iu.edu> I think he was speaking in general terms here. He said depends on the person... not depends on a single person specificly. Mary Quoting "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" : > We have had good customer services from WD, no dispute there. But > given that Gordon is a professional in the field of technology, I > think he should know how to handle a hard drive, and how not too. :) > From mstores at indiana.edu Sun Aug 21 04:55:33 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 23:55:33 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> <016a01cc5e9c$4173d0c0$c45b7240$@gmail.com> <20110819142909.bbu8zz6thwos8okg@webmail.iu.edu> <4D527C57-761E-431B-8DB2-33150C949CDE@mac-access.net> <701DA168-9942-4836-9052-2A5FA0E32971@gmail.com> <5D45ADEE-9ACF-4CC6-BB3B-925B817B4836@mac-access.net> <009901cc5f41$f94c4560$ebe4d020$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20110820235533.texvs64204kk8cg4@webmail.iu.edu> I take what I said back in my previous post, I guess. No other choice. Mary Quoting Kliph&Sharrie : > Even professionals make mistakes. And based on prier posts, well? > > Kliphton SR > (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 > (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com > (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com > [mailto:techno-chat-bounces at tft-bbs.com] On Behalf Of Mrs. Lynnette Annabel > Smith > Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 6:41 AM > To: Technology Enthusiasm > Subject: Re: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive > > We have had good customer services from WD, no dispute there. But given that > Gordon is a professional in the field of technology, I think he should know > how to handle a hard drive, and how not too. :) From lynne at mac-access.net Sun Aug 21 15:39:55 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2011 15:39:55 +0100 Subject: What's in a hard drive? In-Reply-To: <201108201838.p7KIc2c0030854@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108201838.p7KIc2c0030854@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <140A97D2-9568-4F9B-9F63-7030FD25ECD6@mac-access.net> Hello Martin On 20 Aug 2011, at 19:38, Martin McCormick wrote: ? You start by not intending to repair it, but to totally destroy it (smile.) Yes, but what's the point? If somebody non-technical even bothered to open a computer, let alone taking the drives or other components out, it's nothing short of flagrant vandalism. As far as I am concerned the only motivation for flagrant vandalism is spite, possibly born out of some vindictive pleasure, jealousy or a desire to exact revenge or vengeance. Obviously these are non-technical issues so I won't pursue the discussion of them here. But all the same, other than the benefit of the exercise I fail to see what anybody gets out of wanten distraction of properly. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Sun Aug 21 15:43:22 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2011 15:43:22 +0100 Subject: WD hidden Partition removal success In-Reply-To: <1C21CBF6-2A34-4E14-AD37-2F6576548782@mac-access.net> References: <1C21CBF6-2A34-4E14-AD37-2F6576548782@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hello Eric I saw that a while ago but it doesn't kill the partition as far as I know. I'll have another look at it because even getting rid of the icon would be nice. Lynne On 21 Aug 2011, at 01:29, Eric Caron wrote: Dear list, Sorry this is not in the original thread as I seemed to have deleted it! But I have great news for any of you that wanted that little partition to not keep mounting itself on the desk top. Mine is now gone! It turns out that at least in my case if you run the WD App and go to settings then to software settings there is a preference area and I was able to uncheck a box and no longer does the partitian show up! I did follow up on Travis's info and it sounds like there is one option on the Windows side to reformat and get the storage space back, but this solution is much easier and the space gain is minimal in my situation. So, I have the app in my apps folder for future use. I copied the files from the partition to another area in case I ever want them and, Hurray that silly partition no longer shows up on my desktop! Hope this helps others who want it gone! eric Caron P. S>. Hope this message only appears once. I re sent it once because it didn't seem to show up! _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Sun Aug 21 17:59:21 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2011 12:59:21 -0400 Subject: WD hidden Partition removal success In-Reply-To: References: <1C21CBF6-2A34-4E14-AD37-2F6576548782@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hi Lynne and others, I had to look around a lot to find the check box. In my case after running the software it was under software settings then under preferences in the WD app. This does not remove the partition but just keeps it from showing up. It has been working for me even after restarting my computer. My Desk top is now mine again! I did read somewhere on the Web to look under hardware set up on the WD smart ware. I wasted a lot of time looking there. for me it was under the software setting. good luck with this! I would be very proud to have found something you and Gordon could use! Eric Caron On Aug 21, 2011, at 10:43 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Eric > > I saw that a while ago but it doesn't kill the partition as far as I know. I'll have another look at it because even getting rid of the icon would be nice. > > Lynne > > On 21 Aug 2011, at 01:29, Eric Caron wrote: > > Dear list, > > Sorry this is not in the original thread as I seemed to have deleted it! But I have great news for any of you that wanted that little partition to not keep mounting itself on the desk top. Mine is now gone! > > It turns out that at least in my case if you run the WD App and go to settings then to software settings there is a preference area and I was able to uncheck a box and no longer does the partitian show up! I did follow up on Travis's info and it sounds like there is one option on the Windows side to reformat and get the storage space back, but this solution is much easier and the space gain is minimal in my situation. > > So, I have the app in my apps folder for future use. I copied the files from the partition to another area in case I ever want them and, Hurray that silly partition no longer shows up on my desktop! > > Hope this helps others who want it gone! > > eric Caron > > > P. S>. Hope this message only appears once. I re sent it once because it didn't seem to show up! > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From support at mac-access.net Sun Aug 21 22:25:02 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2011 22:25:02 +0100 Subject: List Migration Message-ID: Hello everybody As you may or may not know, Gordon and I are planning to gradually phase out the tft-bbs.* domains, in favour of more synonymous ones which reflect our current activities. In the case of "tft-bbs.com", it will mean that, when it happens, we will need to migrate our two mailing lists, "Just-Chat" and "Techno-Chat" to a new domain. We have a couple of things in mind for this, and it won't cause too much disruption. However, what we would like to know is this; does anybody on list have any objection to being moved over automatically to the new home of the list? If so, please do let us know and we will discuss the options with you. If not, we will migrate all of the members when we are ready and then you will receive welcome packets when you are subscribed. Again, please do let us know if you have any objection. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Sun Aug 21 22:57:30 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2011 17:57:30 -0400 Subject: List Migration In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <33A226B7-EB33-41CC-8319-B5DC91526306@Mac-Access.net> Hi Lynne, Do what ever is easiest for you folks then just let me know if I need to do anything to keep the list coming. Also, What is the Just Chat list? Eric C. On Aug 21, 2011, at 5:25 PM, Gordon & Lynne Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > As you may or may not know, Gordon and I are planning to gradually phase out the tft-bbs.* domains, in favour of more synonymous ones which reflect our current activities. In the case of "tft-bbs.com", it will mean that, when it happens, we will need to migrate our two mailing lists, "Just-Chat" and "Techno-Chat" to a new domain. > > We have a couple of things in mind for this, and it won't cause too much disruption. However, what we would like to know is this; does anybody on list have any objection to being moved over automatically to the new home of the list? If so, please do let us know and we will discuss the options with you. If not, we will migrate all of the members when we are ready and then you will receive welcome packets when you are subscribed. > > Again, please do let us know if you have any objection. > > Lynne > > ------------------------------ > > Gordon & Lynne Smith, > > Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: > > with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sun Aug 21 23:06:05 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sun, 21 Aug 2011 23:06:05 +0100 Subject: List Migration In-Reply-To: <33A226B7-EB33-41CC-8319-B5DC91526306@Mac-Access.net> References: <33A226B7-EB33-41CC-8319-B5DC91526306@Mac-Access.net> Message-ID: Hello Eric We want to make this as simple a switch-over as possible. Just Chat, which has its website at is a general chat group. Lynne On 21 Aug 2011, at 22:57, Eric Caron wrote: Do what ever is easiest for you folks then just let me know if I need to do anything to keep the list coming. Also, What is the Just Chat list? From support at mac-access.net Mon Aug 22 01:14:18 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2011 01:14:18 +0100 Subject: New Member Welcome Message-ID: <2221D67A-E721-447A-9C36-9D8A4AC981C9@mac-access.net> Hello everybody It is traditional when new members join the Techno-Chat group that Gordon and I try to welcome the new member(s) personally. In keeping with that tradition, we are delighted to welcome: Candie Stiles to our number. Anything related to technology is open for discussion in this group. Members frequently post links to interesting articles in this group. Whilst the primary function of Techno-chat is discussion, we recognise that these articles are often of value. That is why we encourage members to post links, rather than the full articles themselves, to the group. This way, members have the option of whether to follow up the articles, or to discard them. We hope that you will find Techno-Chat a pleasant, friendly and worthwhile place to be. if you have any list-related queries, please don't hesitate to contact either Gordon and myself, support at tft-bbs.co.uk or our very able and capable assistant list controller Mary Stores, mstores at indiana.edu and we'll be pleased to help you. Lynne ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From support at mac-access.net Mon Aug 22 10:59:37 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2011 10:59:37 +0100 Subject: Plans For The Future Of Techno-Chat Message-ID: <7F0102CE-8C78-4085-BB3B-8B61A598D45E@mac-access.net> Hi all As I think we've told you before, the domain on which this list is based, (tft-bbs.com) is one of the domains we intend to drop when it expires. Thus, we need to move Techno Chat over to another domain and I took the first steps towards doing so last night. There's another advantage in doing this; it will make the list's website more simple to access. If anybody has any problem with being moved, now is the time to let us know. We plan to bulk import all email addresses subscribed to this list at the time over to the new group. That may happen today, as I have already secured the domain we wanted. Following the move, this list may be found at: and its website may be found at: although the actual subscription to the list will be different. I'll let you know more about that later. Meanwhile if anybody has any questions or comments regarding the move, please let us know. We are very willing to discuss; although the decision regarding the list has been made. Gordon ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, ------------------------------ From tsiegel at softcon.com Mon Aug 22 14:47:02 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2011 09:47:02 -0400 Subject: Review: WD My Passport Essential portable hard drive In-Reply-To: <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> References: <527387A6-2E5F-4627-8761-1C0CC5E5699B@mac-access.net> <021384AE-ECB5-48B3-8CF3-84CDBBD4DFEA@gmail.com> <8149739F-7EE1-4126-BA45-B6A9D4EB4687@mac-access.net> Message-ID: On Aug 19, 2011, at 2:09 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > But I will say this about the large models, the power supplies are > absolutely dreadful. They die more frequently than the drives. Unfortunately, this seems to be a common problem. I've found the lacie external drives to be of excellent quality, especially the ones that are built specifically for the mac minis. The only problem is I broke one of the pins off one of the power adapters some time ago, and I can't seem to find a replacement. Apple doesn't stock them directly even though I bought the drive in the apple store. Lacie's web site is not accessible enough for me to determine which power supply is the proper one for my drive, so at the moment, I'm reduced to running one or the other, but never both at once, which severely cuts into my storage capabilities. But, otherwise, they're excellent drives, and haven't given me any trouble at all, and I've had them running constantly for the last 2 or 3 years. They do cost a bit more, because of their unique design. They're designed to sit under the mac mini, which makes the mini appear thicker, and they have firewire ports on them. I have managed to burn out one of the firewire ports on one of them, but that was not the fault of the drive, I think it happened when doing an inordinate amount of swapping around a few months ago, and they got tired of all the restarts. :) But, as I said above, other than that, these drives have been the perfect workhorses, and have worked flawlessly. From support at mac-access.net Mon Aug 22 18:11:47 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2011 18:11:47 +0100 Subject: Subscription Confirmation Please Message-ID: <963FF86E-5BE2-4939-839E-F0A5338E8457@mac-access.net> Hi all I'm in the process of preparing the new reciprocal list which will replace this one when done. If you still wish to be a member of this group when it changes to the new host, could you please send a private message to clearly specifying the E-Mail address you wish to use for membership. I could just use a dump of the subscribed addresses, but We would prefer to only subscribe those who still wish to be subscribed. If we don't get confirmation of your address you'll need to re-subscribe yourself at a later time. I anticipate the current list being removed and the new one taking its place either later today or early tomorrow. For your references, the new address will be: The same policies will apply, I will do my best to preserve the current list configuration. Thank you. ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, ------------------------------ From lynne at mac-access.net Thu Aug 25 02:09:41 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 02:09:41 +0100 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? Message-ID: <565898BB-7574-4FF4-AA3D-3AB5E0845435@mac-access.net> Hello everybody I keep seeing these mentions on the net about "Jambox" and I am starting to wonder what they are. I understand they're something to do with audio; but that's as much as I know. I will try a google but I wondered if anybody in here knew any more. Lynne From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Thu Aug 25 04:32:33 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2011 23:32:33 -0400 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? In-Reply-To: <565898BB-7574-4FF4-AA3D-3AB5E0845435@mac-access.net> References: <565898BB-7574-4FF4-AA3D-3AB5E0845435@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <8FB0583D-B5ED-4DDB-89CF-B81F4184467C@Mac-Access.net> Hi Lynne, I don't own one but my understanding is that it is a small but powerful blue tooth speaker. I believe it also handels phone calls. it is ideal for use with iPhone and such and I have read it has very good sound especially for its size. It is by the same people that do the Jawbone bluetooth earphone. I'm sure others know more. Best, Eric Caron On Aug 24, 2011, at 9:09 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I keep seeing these mentions on the net about "Jambox" and I am starting to wonder what they are. I understand they're something to do with audio; but that's as much as I know. > > I will try a google but I wondered if anybody in here knew any more. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu Aug 25 12:03:30 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 06:03:30 -0500 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? Message-ID: <201108251103.p7PB3UId059920@x.it.okstate.edu> It sounds like the term has evolved. Many years ago, a jam box was another word for those portable tape player-radio combinations one used to see and sometimes hear whether you wanted to or not on city streets and school grounds. They were also called boom boxes because the better ones had pretty good base. The not so better ones just sounded loud and distorted. They ran on 6 to 8 D-cell batteries so if a tornado came by, you could hang on to your boom box and stay on the ground. Eric Caron writes: > Hi Lynne, > > I don't own one but my understanding is that it is a small but > powerful blue tooth speaker. I believe it also handels phone calls. it > is ideal for use with iPhone and such and I have read it has very good > sound especially for its size. It is by the same people that do the > Jawbone bluetooth earphone. I'm sure others know more. > > Best, > > Eric Caron > > On Aug 24, 2011, at 9:09 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > > > Hello everybody > > > > I keep seeing these mentions on the net about "Jambox" and I am > starting to wonder what they are. I understand they're something to do > with audio; but that's as much as I know. > > > > I will try a google but I wondered if anybody in here knew any more. > > > > Lynne > > > > > > > > ======================================= > > > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated > web pages located at > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > at either of the following websites: > > > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > > Or: > > > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > > > > --------------------------------------- > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated > web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > > From gordon at mac-access.net Thu Aug 25 12:47:04 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 12:47:04 +0100 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? In-Reply-To: <8FB0583D-B5ED-4DDB-89CF-B81F4184467C@Mac-Access.net> References: <565898BB-7574-4FF4-AA3D-3AB5E0845435@mac-access.net> <8FB0583D-B5ED-4DDB-89CF-B81F4184467C@Mac-Access.net> Message-ID: <3641E353-4F9C-4574-92ED-B22139B0462F@mac-access.net> Hello Eric Thanks. I just googled it and came up with the Jawbone website. The pictures are nice, it looks like a really nice piece of equipment and Gordon says the specs look to be excellent Definitely something to consider for the not too distant future; if, that is, I can find a UK supplier. Maybe Amazon might sell them. Lynne On 25 Aug 2011, at 04:32, Eric Caron wrote: ? I don't own one but my understanding is that it is a small but powerful blue tooth speaker. I believe it also handels phone calls. it is ideal for use with iPhone and such and I have read it has very good sound especially for its size. It is by the same people that do the Jawbone bluetooth earphone. I'm sure others know more. From mstores at indiana.edu Thu Aug 25 14:35:05 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 09:35:05 -0400 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? In-Reply-To: <201108251103.p7PB3UId059920@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108251103.p7PB3UId059920@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <20110825093505.968zxi6etc8o4wcw@webmail.iu.edu> I have to say, I am familiar with Martin's definition. I remember my first jambox I got was when I was 9 years old. I think my dad paid $8 for it. It couldn't even really stand up if you put it on the ground. But I loved that radio. One of my fondest memories is taking it out in the back yard, leaning it against a tree, and listening to Live Aid. lol Mary Quoting Martin McCormick : > It sounds like the term has evolved. Many years ago, a > jam box was another word for those portable tape player-radio > combinations one used to see and sometimes hear whether you > wanted to or not on city streets and school grounds. They were > also called boom boxes because the better ones had pretty good > base. The not so better ones just sounded loud and distorted. > > They ran on 6 to 8 D-cell batteries so if a tornado came > by, you could hang on to your boom box and stay on the ground. > From gordon at mac-access.net Thu Aug 25 15:22:36 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 15:22:36 +0100 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? In-Reply-To: <20110825093505.968zxi6etc8o4wcw@webmail.iu.edu> References: <201108251103.p7PB3UId059920@x.it.okstate.edu> <20110825093505.968zxi6etc8o4wcw@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: <08C5E33C-DE4E-41A7-AE25-D68AFB70C71A@mac-access.net> Hi Mary I just discovered that Apple is selling the Jawbone Jambox and I'm gonna try and persuade she who makes the choices, but she who sometimes is very generous not only to me but to others as well as she's sent stuff overseas in order to help people before now. Anyway, to the point. I'm gonna try and persuade her to get me one. Incidentally mary, Live Aid was an experience. I was there, quite close to the stage. We got really good positions and the sound system was amazing. Gordon On 25 Aug 2011, at 14:35, Mary Stores wrote: I have to say, I am familiar with Martin's definition. I remember my first jambox I got was when I was 9 years old. I think my dad paid $8 for it. It couldn't even really stand up if you put it on the ground. But I loved that radio. One of my fondest memories is taking it out in the back yard, leaning it against a tree, and listening to Live Aid. lol Mary Quoting Martin McCormick : > It sounds like the term has evolved. Many years ago, a > jam box was another word for those portable tape player-radio > combinations one used to see and sometimes hear whether you > wanted to or not on city streets and school grounds. They were > also called boom boxes because the better ones had pretty good > base. The not so better ones just sounded loud and distorted. > > They ran on 6 to 8 D-cell batteries so if a tornado came > by, you could hang on to your boom box and stay on the ground. > ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu Aug 25 16:28:43 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 10:28:43 -0500 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? Message-ID: <201108251528.p7PFShlp061325@x.it.okstate.edu> We used to see a bunch of those when I worked for Audio Visual. We repaired equipment at cost for employees of the university and for public schools who sent their gear to us because they could not get it repaired locally. I saw some pretty good jam or boom boxes and a few of those could double as a physical workout program if one decided to carry them around. They had handles and batteries, therefore they were officially portable. One box came in from a staff member who said that his 8-year-old son decided to get back at his 12 or 13-year-old sister who actually owned the box by slamming his fist in to the cassette drive buttons. Those buttons were locked up as tight as if they were made of stone. A couple in the middle were slightly depressed but you couldn't budge them by trying to press anything. We all wondered if they could be unstuck. I tackled that boom box one day and removed the back half of the case which exposed the electronics and cassette mechanism. The buttons on most cassette decks pushed levers and slides which moved various parts of the mechanism depending on what you pressed. You are only supposed to push one button at a time except for recording, so this kid had made several things try to occupy the same space at the same time. I wasn't sure what I was going to do but I noticed that one of the buttons caused one of the levers to wiggle ever so little when pressed. I started there and kind of kept working things back and forth gently until things loosened a bit. Suddenly, with a snap, the mechanism unstuck and everything popped in to its rightful place. That darned mechanism was made mostly of plastic including many of the levers and there was not a thing broken after I got it unjammed. I'd like to say I knew just what to do, but it was more luck than skill. So, I guess I turned a jammed box in to just a jam box. It played tapes and all just fine after the beating it had gotten. Mary Stores writes: > I have to say, I am familiar with Martin's definition. I remember my first > jambox I got was when I was 9 years old. I think my dad paid $8 for it. It > couldn't even really stand up if you put it on the ground. But I loved > that > radio. One of my fondest memories is taking it out in the back yard, > leaning it against a tree, and listening to Live Aid. lol From lynne at mac-access.net Thu Aug 25 17:44:09 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 17:44:09 +0100 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? In-Reply-To: <201108251528.p7PFShlp061325@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108251528.p7PFShlp061325@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <2D3512BC-AF03-49B4-8905-8F0762D6DBCA@mac-access.net> Hi Martin Well, I found out what the modern day Jambox is which, to be honest, was my only query. :) Apparently Apple sets the Jawbone Jambox, so when funds allow I might look at one of those. But your message brings up another point. I wonder why they used that name if there are so many definitions of it out there and so many pieces of equipment with that name. Lynne From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu Aug 25 17:52:42 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 11:52:42 -0500 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? Message-ID: <201108251652.p7PGqgsq061703@x.it.okstate.edu> "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > But your message brings up another point. I wonder why they used that > name if there are so many definitions of it out there and so many pieces > of equipment with that name. Well, I don't know, but if you use one of those, a bluetooth transmitter and a MP3 player, anything from an ipad to one of those palm-sized marvels like the Zenstone, you've got a functional equivalent of the old jam box which could be carried around and used the same way. Maybe that's what they were thinking about. From gordon at mac-access.net Thu Aug 25 20:13:19 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 20:13:19 +0100 Subject: I am curious; What's a "Jambox"? In-Reply-To: <201108251652.p7PGqgsq061703@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108251652.p7PGqgsq061703@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <0FAEF869-D7B7-4AE0-B779-343E80AD3B01@mac-access.net> That, Martin, is exactly how the Jambox from Jawbone works. Gordon On 25 Aug 2011, at 17:52, Martin McCormick wrote: "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > But your message brings up another point. I wonder why they used that > name if there are so many definitions of it out there and so many pieces > of equipment with that name. Well, I don't know, but if you use one of those, a bluetooth transmitter and a MP3 player, anything from an ipad to one of those palm-sized marvels like the Zenstone, you've got a functional equivalent of the old jam box which could be carried around and used the same way. Maybe that's what they were thinking about. ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From support at mac-access.net Fri Aug 26 08:03:25 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2011 08:03:25 +0100 Subject: List Archives Successfully Merged Message-ID: <84ED5BC3-057A-48F1-8630-ED6BD45B3A61@mac-access.net> Hi all I'm pleased to be able to tell you that I've managed to merge the archives of the old list with those of the new list with the same name. I'm posting about this because a couple of people have written to us asking about the archives. Also, I've just heard back from the administrators of the mail-archive.com facility to tell me that they are also merging our lists. So the old lists are once again available to view if anybody wants to do so. And finally, the RSS feed is included in the merge. We plan on building our own RSS feed, when I get around to doing that particular job. It will require a considerable amount of work but it's a challenge for me when I feel up to it. I'm kind of running on empty just at the moment, as is my poor long-suffering other haf. Neither of us has slept for 3 nights now and poor Lynne is supposed to be going into work this morning. To be honest I'm not happy about her driving in that condition. Anyway, I am rambling. The point of this post was to let you know that the list archives are being rectified. Gordon ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ ------------------------------ Gordon & Lynne Smith, Are you an iOS or Mac OS fan? If so, consider joining our vibrant community of fellow-enthusiasts. To join our forum, send a message to: with the word "subscribe" [no quotes] in the subject line of your message. Or else, visit: ------------------------------ From gordon at mac-access.net Fri Aug 26 08:53:06 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2011 08:53:06 +0100 Subject: RSS Feed Query Message-ID: <19D83E32-46D2-4B9B-A9EC-7F6B17FC07DD@mac-access.net> Hi all I'm just curious; has anybody tried the RSS feed of this list? I was just thinking last night, as to whether there's any benefit in an RSS feed as I'm planning to try and implement our own solution internally when I get the opportunity. I know there are a few people on list who do use RSS quite regularly, so I'd appreciate any input now that the list has its own proper home, so to speak. Gordon From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Fri Aug 26 16:22:44 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2011 10:22:44 -0500 Subject: Gas Discharge Devices Message-ID: <201108261522.p7QFMi4k066742@x.it.okstate.edu> There was an amateur radio event recently in Oklahoma City that I attended which had a large flea market in which all sorts of things were out there for sale. One man had boxes of mostly new parts that one could buy for a few Dollars and they were decent parts so I bought one of the boxes. As I was sorting through it later to put all the parts in drawers and bottles, I ran across about a half-dozen neon lamps and wondered how many younger amateurs these days know what these things can do. They are kind of an echo of days mostly gone by, but they are interesting little devices. I will describe them as looking kind of like small clear Christmas lights. The bulbs are about the size of a Braille cell, as one fellow I used to know, described it. They are pointed on one end where the glass was sealed and have two bare wires coming out the base where they can be soldered in to a circuit. They've been around for maybe a hundred years and used to be used in anything that needed a little orange-colored light to tell you if it was on. Basically, they went where we presently see LED's. A coffee pot, toaster or other appliance made during most of the 20TH century may have had one to signal that it was on or heating. They were popular because they drew only 1 twenty-fifth of a Watt and, if properly current-limited, they lasted the life of the device. Another common use was in circuit testers to warn electricians that a line was live or verify that power was being applied. They are almost the color of school buses, life jackets and anything else that is supposed to be bright orange and get your attention. Even some night lights used a few neon bulbs to faintly light someone's way. If that's all they did, there wouldn't be much point in writing this, but they are a class of electronic devices called gas discharge tubes. Those are light bulb-like devices that have almost a total vacuum in them except for a little bit of neon, argon or some other rare gas. If you read then for continuity with an ohm meter, they don't show any continuity at all. They look just like an open circuit. If you put enough voltage across them, however, they ionize suddenly when you reach a critical voltage called the breakdown voltage. The gas begins to conduct electricity because electrons are being knocked out of their orbits in the atoms of neon or whatever gas is there. Each electron then tries to fall back in to orbit and it is this going in and out of orbit that releases light energy to make the bulb glow. The breakdown effect makes a lot of weird circuits possible which is what makes these bulbs interesting to play around with. If you gradually lower the voltage across the bulb, it will eventually de-ionize and go out so what a person sees is the light gets dimmer as you drop the voltage but then comes a point where it goes dark just like someone turned it off. The breakdown voltage is higher than the voltage needed to keep it drawing current so it is possible to put a voltage on a neon bulb that is a little too low for it to light, but almost high enough. If you do anything to increase the voltage, it suddenly comes on and stays that way. The other interesting thing is that the voltage across a lit neon bulb stays about the same even if you try to feed in more voltage. The current goes up fast and if there is no limiting resistor, the bulb will quickly fail. This effect has made them useful for voltage regulators. I am not going to bore everybody with much more of this, but things from elevator buttons in the sixties or so, older electric organs and tons of other pieces of industrial and consumer gear from the fifties and sixties used those little bulbs for more than just small orange lights. Martin From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 27 21:45:14 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2011 21:45:14 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? Message-ID: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> Hi all I just read on a document in a local magazine here which talks about things like consumer services, (including the Internet), that DropBox says in the small print of their service agreement that everything that you put on their servers they automatically assume ownership of the rights to. They are advising consumers not to put items which contain highly personal data on their services because even after you have deleted them, they still retain copies. Drop Box apparently claim that even their own employees can't see the content of files. But according to this article, that isn't strictly true. that isn't absolutely true. I can't deny this has me concerned and I think I'm off now to delete all of our personal records. At least until I find a reliable way to encrypt them. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat Aug 27 21:46:48 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 06:46:48 +1000 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> References: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4E5957B8.8030601@internode.on.net> No hoax, this issue was addressed several months ago. On 28/08/2011 6:45 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hi all > > I just read on a document in a local magazine here which talks about things like consumer services, (including the Internet), that DropBox says in the small print of their service agreement that everything that you put on their servers they automatically assume ownership of the rights to. They are advising consumers not to put items which contain highly personal data on their services because even after you have deleted them, they still retain copies. > > Drop Box apparently claim that even their own employees can't see the content of files. But according to this article, that isn't strictly true. that isn't absolutely true. I can't deny this has me concerned and I think I'm off now to delete all of our personal records. At least until I find a reliable way to encrypt them. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net From gordon at mac-access.net Sat Aug 27 21:49:58 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2011 21:49:58 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <4E5957B8.8030601@internode.on.net> References: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> <4E5957B8.8030601@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <846CBAA7-A4A2-4A60-B9EF-084620A4A2D5@mac-access.net> So why is it printed in a local consumer magazine which has nothing to gain by printing hoax or bogus stories? They're not saying anybody has infiltrated personal data, they are just saying that they could. Lynne On 27 Aug 2011, at 21:46, Dane Trethowan wrote: No hoax, this issue was addressed several months ago. On 28/08/2011 6:45 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hi all > > I just read on a document in a local magazine here which talks about things like consumer services, (including the Internet), that DropBox says in the small print of their service agreement that everything that you put on their servers they automatically assume ownership of the rights to. They are advising consumers not to put items which contain highly personal data on their services because even after you have deleted them, they still retain copies. > > Drop Box apparently claim that even their own employees can't see the content of files. But according to this article, that isn't strictly true. that isn't absolutely true. I can't deny this has me concerned and I think I'm off now to delete all of our personal records. At least until I find a reliable way to encrypt them. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 27 21:50:33 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2011 21:50:33 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <846CBAA7-A4A2-4A60-B9EF-084620A4A2D5@mac-access.net> References: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> <4E5957B8.8030601@internode.on.net> <846CBAA7-A4A2-4A60-B9EF-084620A4A2D5@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <0A8F2D2C-1837-49B6-993A-7DF615BB1F3A@mac-access.net> Oopse! forgot to change accounts again. On 27 Aug 2011, at 21:49, Gordon Smith wrote: So why is it printed in a local consumer magazine which has nothing to gain by printing hoax or bogus stories? They're not saying anybody has infiltrated personal data, they are just saying that they could. Lynne On 27 Aug 2011, at 21:46, Dane Trethowan wrote: No hoax, this issue was addressed several months ago. On 28/08/2011 6:45 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hi all > > I just read on a document in a local magazine here which talks about things like consumer services, (including the Internet), that DropBox says in the small print of their service agreement that everything that you put on their servers they automatically assume ownership of the rights to. They are advising consumers not to put items which contain highly personal data on their services because even after you have deleted them, they still retain copies. > > Drop Box apparently claim that even their own employees can't see the content of files. But according to this article, that isn't strictly true. that isn't absolutely true. I can't deny this has me concerned and I think I'm off now to delete all of our personal records. At least until I find a reliable way to encrypt them. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat Aug 27 21:52:04 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 06:52:04 +1000 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <846CBAA7-A4A2-4A60-B9EF-084620A4A2D5@mac-access.net> References: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> <4E5957B8.8030601@internode.on.net> <846CBAA7-A4A2-4A60-B9EF-084620A4A2D5@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4E5958F4.9050507@internode.on.net> Can't speak for the consumer magazine but what I can say for certain is that they haven't read the Dropbox FAQ section and licence agreement updates as I have, in other words its sloppy research - if none at all - and they've just copied a story from someone else which was written quite some time ago. On 28/08/2011 6:49 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > So why is it printed in a local consumer magazine which has nothing to gain by printing hoax or bogus stories? They're not saying anybody has infiltrated personal data, they are just saying that they could. > > Lynne > > On 27 Aug 2011, at 21:46, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > No hoax, this issue was addressed several months ago. > > > > On 28/08/2011 6:45 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hi all >> >> I just read on a document in a local magazine here which talks about things like consumer services, (including the Internet), that DropBox says in the small print of their service agreement that everything that you put on their servers they automatically assume ownership of the rights to. They are advising consumers not to put items which contain highly personal data on their services because even after you have deleted them, they still retain copies. >> >> Drop Box apparently claim that even their own employees can't see the content of files. But according to this article, that isn't strictly true. that isn't absolutely true. I can't deny this has me concerned and I think I'm off now to delete all of our personal records. At least until I find a reliable way to encrypt them. >> >> Lynne >> >> >> >> ======================================= >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: >> >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> Or: >> >> you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: >> >> >> --------------------------------------- -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net From lynne at mac-access.net Sat Aug 27 23:59:56 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2011 23:59:56 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <4E5958F4.9050507@internode.on.net> References: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> <4E5957B8.8030601@internode.on.net> <846CBAA7-A4A2-4A60-B9EF-084620A4A2D5@mac-access.net> <4E5958F4.9050507@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <40A0B500-86E8-44F0-80C3-D6482BCF6B62@mac-access.net> Hello Dane I'm not arguing, and I am not saying you're wrong. But this argil was, as far as I know, written very recently. It certainly only came out a couple of weeks ago. But that said, sometimes the council around here aren't too on the ball, that much is true. But they seemed to be implying in this article that you have to read the small print, not just the online blurb. Lynne On 27 Aug 2011, at 21:52, Dane Trethowan wrote: Can't speak for the consumer magazine but what I can say for certain is that they haven't read the Dropbox FAQ section and licence agreement updates as I have, in other words its sloppy research - if none at all - and they've just copied a story from someone else which was written quite some time ago. From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun Aug 28 00:02:29 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 09:02:29 +1000 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <40A0B500-86E8-44F0-80C3-D6482BCF6B62@mac-access.net> References: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> <4E5957B8.8030601@internode.on.net> <846CBAA7-A4A2-4A60-B9EF-084620A4A2D5@mac-access.net> <4E5958F4.9050507@internode.on.net> <40A0B500-86E8-44F0-80C3-D6482BCF6B62@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4E597785.8030104@internode.on.net> I've already answered the question so take it or leave it. On 28/08/2011 8:59 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > I'm not arguing, and I am not saying you're wrong. But this argil was, as far as I know, written very recently. It certainly only came out a couple of weeks ago. But that said, sometimes the council around here aren't too on the ball, that much is true. > > But they seemed to be implying in this article that you have to read the small print, not just the online blurb. > > Lynne > > On 27 Aug 2011, at 21:52, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Can't speak for the consumer magazine but what I can say for certain is that they haven't read the Dropbox FAQ section and licence agreement updates as I have, in other words its sloppy research - if none at all - and they've just copied a story from someone else which was written quite some time ago. > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sun Aug 28 03:58:54 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sat, 27 Aug 2011 21:58:54 -0500 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? Message-ID: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> You might see if pgp exists for the MAC. PGP stands for Pretty Good Privacy and has been around on Unix systems for many years. The price is right as it is free and the encryption method is good enough that the US forbade export of the algorithm for many years. Of course, any good security requires you to do your part and use a strong password, but it is secure and has stood the test of time. From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun Aug 28 04:01:12 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 13:01:12 +1000 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <4E59AF78.3030004@internode.on.net> I'd recommend Truecrypt if you're going down that path, PGP is now marketed by Symantec. On 28/08/2011 12:58 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: > You might see if pgp exists for the MAC. PGP stands for > Pretty Good Privacy and has been around on Unix systems for many > years. The price is right as it is free and the encryption > method is good enough that the US forbade export of the > algorithm for many years. > > Of course, any good security requires you to do your > part and use a strong password, but it is secure and has stood > the test of time. > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net From gordon at mac-access.net Sun Aug 28 09:38:47 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 09:38:47 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <5FD98232-9BAE-472B-B1ED-C6DB3086D848@mac-access.net> Hi Martin Yes, we know all about PGP. We used to run a pGP server on the front end of our mail server actually but we ditched it because of the horrendous prices. The problem with PGP from my perspective is the fact that it returns unknown mime types to those not using it. Therefore, they can't read your messages. No, I don't think we'll end up going that route this time I'm afraid. Gordon Gordon On 28 Aug 2011, at 03:58, Martin McCormick wrote: You might see if pgp exists for the MAC. PGP stands for Pretty Good Privacy and has been around on Unix systems for many years. The price is right as it is free and the encryption method is good enough that the US forbade export of the algorithm for many years. Of course, any good security requires you to do your part and use a strong password, but it is secure and has stood the test of time. ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Sun Aug 28 09:40:05 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 09:40:05 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <4E59AF78.3030004@internode.on.net> References: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> <4E59AF78.3030004@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Dane is correct. PGP is now one of the expanding Symantec group which, by definition, puts me off. Gordon On 28 Aug 2011, at 04:01, Dane Trethowan wrote: I'd recommend Truecrypt if you're going down that path, PGP is now marketed by Symantec. On 28/08/2011 12:58 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: > You might see if pgp exists for the MAC. PGP stands for > Pretty Good Privacy and has been around on Unix systems for many > years. The price is right as it is free and the encryption > method is good enough that the US forbade export of the > algorithm for many years. > > Of course, any good security requires you to do your > part and use a strong password, but it is secure and has stood > the test of time. > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- -- Dane Trethowan From Melton Victoria Australia skype callto:grtdane12 MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Sun Aug 28 09:47:26 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 09:47:26 +0100 Subject: Anybody Fancy Contributing? Message-ID: Hi everybody As you have doubtless noticed, Techno-Chat is now out on its own, so to speak. Meaning that it's under the "Techno-Chat Dot Net" banner, instead of the old "TFT BBs" banner which, when it expires, will not be renewed. In fact, tft-bbs.com is now largely redundant as the only facility it offers is an old website which is no longer under development. So, the plan is to expand Techno-Chat if possible, along the same lines as we are doing with Mac Access. It occurred to us that maybe some might be interested in producing articles or even podcasts related to their uses of technology, or their interests in same. You know the type of things, radio, computing, medical stuff, anything with an emphasis on technology would be most welcome. The Techno-Chat website isn't yet up in the public domain. But we aim to rectify that situation shortly. I'm not expecting a rush of responses, if I'm totally honest. But if anybody is interested, their contributions will be gratefully received. Gordon From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun Aug 28 09:55:39 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 18:55:39 +1000 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: References: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> <4E59AF78.3030004@internode.on.net> Message-ID: The thing that worries me about PGP now is its security. I just can't see a company like Symantec selling something like PGP without them keeping some sort of tool for cracking PGP codes, I thought about purchasing PGP for Mac but the name of Symantec and my above worry put me off which is why I opted for Truecrypt, nice open source software which is updated regularly, its accessible on the Mac and under Windows, with LYNUX etc but most importantly it seems very secure with various encription methods and options at your fingertips. On 28/08/2011, at 6:40 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Dane is correct. PGP is now one of the expanding Symantec group which, by definition, puts me off. > > Gordon > > > > On 28 Aug 2011, at 04:01, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I'd recommend Truecrypt if you're going down that path, PGP is now marketed by Symantec. > > > > On 28/08/2011 12:58 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: >> You might see if pgp exists for the MAC. PGP stands for >> Pretty Good Privacy and has been around on Unix systems for many >> years. The price is right as it is free and the encryption >> method is good enough that the US forbade export of the >> algorithm for many years. >> >> Of course, any good security requires you to do your >> part and use a strong password, but it is secure and has stood >> the test of time. >> >> ======================================= >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: >> >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> Or: >> >> you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: >> >> >> --------------------------------------- > > -- > Dane Trethowan > From Melton Victoria Australia > skype callto:grtdane12 > MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- From christopherh40 at gmail.com Sun Aug 28 11:09:19 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 11:09:19 +0100 Subject: Anybody Fancy Contributing? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4E5A13CF.1080405@gmail.com> Hi Gordon and all. Well I have done some podcasts of my own. I have done a short series on Total Recorder, one on a fairly unheard of screen reader called Cobra, a couple on NVDA (but not using the latest version I must admit), and one about JAWS Tandem which I did as part of my finals at university. If any or all of you are interested in any or all of them, please shout. I can always upload them to my Dropbox folder and share the links publicly. I have a pro 50 account, paid yearly. So won't run out of space that easily smiles. Look forward to your offers. Chat soon. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 28/08/2011 09:47, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi everybody > > As you have doubtless noticed, Techno-Chat is now out on its own, so to speak. Meaning that it's under the "Techno-Chat Dot Net" banner, instead of the old "TFT BBs" banner which, when it expires, will not be renewed. In fact, tft-bbs.com is now largely redundant as the only facility it offers is an old website which is no longer under development. > > So, the plan is to expand Techno-Chat if possible, along the same lines as we are doing with Mac Access. It occurred to us that maybe some might be interested in producing articles or even podcasts related to their uses of technology, or their interests in same. You know the type of things, radio, computing, medical stuff, anything with an emphasis on technology would be most welcome. > > The Techno-Chat website isn't yet up in the public domain. But we aim to rectify that situation shortly. I'm not expecting a rush of responses, if I'm totally honest. But if anybody is interested, their contributions will be gratefully received. > > Gordon > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > From christopherh40 at gmail.com Sun Aug 28 11:43:35 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 11:43:35 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> References: <448F4507-9A14-4083-9FFC-1ECE9CB6983A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4E5A1BD7.3000705@gmail.com> I would say don't believe in the press. They are only doing this to unnecessarily scare users. Mind you I would not put personal records on Dropbox anyway but not because of Dropbox but in case my machine gets hacked or I need to take it in for servicing for example. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 27/08/2011 21:45, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hi all > > I just read on a document in a local magazine here which talks about things like consumer services, (including the Internet), that DropBox says in the small print of their service agreement that everything that you put on their servers they automatically assume ownership of the rights to. They are advising consumers not to put items which contain highly personal data on their services because even after you have deleted them, they still retain copies. > > Drop Box apparently claim that even their own employees can't see the content of files. But according to this article, that isn't strictly true. that isn't absolutely true. I can't deny this has me concerned and I think I'm off now to delete all of our personal records. At least until I find a reliable way to encrypt them. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > From christopherh40 at gmail.com Sun Aug 28 11:46:28 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 11:46:28 +0100 Subject: Banter Bay Message-ID: <4E5A1C84.4080906@gmail.com> Hello all. I would like to spread the word about this free fully accessible chat client with a difference. How it works is you specify some criteria about yourself. With the click of a button it continually looks for friends with similar criteria to you, such as age or interests. Once it has found a match you can start chatting to them. As I say the program is fully accessible and is apparently quite a new service. So please do all you can to spread the word about this program. The URL is www.banterbay.com. Enjoy. Chat soon. -- Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird From lynne at mac-access.net Sun Aug 28 12:27:32 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 12:27:32 +0100 Subject: Windows Email clients, which is the best? Message-ID: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Recently I installed Windows 7 as a VM on our MacBook because our Asus NetBook has gone into stupid mode whining about hardware changes for some reason. So, I'm looking for opinions as to which email client to go for and, for that matter, how best to handle things like Word documents. I'm not interested in Excel or PowerPoint so I really can't see much point in buying Microsof Office. We do have a programme called Jarte Plus, (I think that's the right name), assuming we can still download it. I think that handles Word document files and we do have NoteTab Pro although I'm not sure if we have the latest Windows 7 64-bit compatible version. I meant to mention that actually, we are 64-bit, and the difference is astonishing. The virtual machine, configured with 4GB of RAM is out-performing most of the real PC's we've ever had, including the Asus NetBook we have which, as I said, is a brick at the moment because it's whining at us to insert a Windows 7 DVD to repair it. But, of course, you can't use a bog-standard one, it has to be the one containing the Asus drivers. We don't have a bootable DVD to insert so that's the end of that it would seem. Anyway, I am getting off the point. I welcome people's views regarding whether to go for Windows Live Mail or Thunderbird, or maybe there is a different one. Gordon mentioned Forge Agent, which has the advantage of also being a news groups reader. So I welcome opinions. Lynne From gordon at mac-access.net Sun Aug 28 13:00:23 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 13:00:23 +0100 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: References: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> <4E59AF78.3030004@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <7ADD6A29-0616-4A33-ABB2-65220555B5DE@mac-access.net> Hi Dane That's a dangerous assumption to make. PGP is pretty secure, and how are they supposed to get hold of your key if you opt not to submit it to their servers? I do agree with you though about the name Symantec being off-putting. It's the reason, or part of it, why we are not going that route. I confess though that Lynne didn't find TrueCrypt as strait forward as you apparently did. I personally haven't tried it yet, and whether I do or not I'm not sure. I'm not sure it's really worth the hassle On 28 Aug 2011, at 09:55, Dane Trethowan wrote: The thing that worries me about PGP now is its security. I just can't see a company like Symantec selling something like PGP without them keeping some sort of tool for cracking PGP codes, I thought about purchasing PGP for Mac but the name of Symantec and my above worry put me off which is why I opted for Truecrypt, nice open source software which is updated regularly, its accessible on the Mac and under Windows, with LYNUX etc but most importantly it seems very secure with various encription methods and options at your fingertips. On 28/08/2011, at 6:40 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Dane is correct. PGP is now one of the expanding Symantec group which, by definition, puts me off. > > Gordon > > > > On 28 Aug 2011, at 04:01, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I'd recommend Truecrypt if you're going down that path, PGP is now marketed by Symantec. > > > > On 28/08/2011 12:58 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: >> You might see if pgp exists for the MAC. PGP stands for >> Pretty Good Privacy and has been around on Unix systems for many >> years. The price is right as it is free and the encryption >> method is good enough that the US forbade export of the >> algorithm for many years. >> >> Of course, any good security requires you to do your >> part and use a strong password, but it is secure and has stood >> the test of time. >> >> ======================================= >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: >> >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> Or: >> >> you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: >> >> >> --------------------------------------- > > -- > Dane Trethowan > From Melton Victoria Australia > skype callto:grtdane12 > MSN: grtdane at dane-trethowan.net > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Sun Aug 28 13:02:34 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 13:02:34 +0100 Subject: Anybody Fancy Contributing? In-Reply-To: <4E5A13CF.1080405@gmail.com> References: <4E5A13CF.1080405@gmail.com> Message-ID: <6F64F376-7CF6-4B72-94C1-3AF127011AA8@mac-access.net> Hi Chris We're certainly interested. We could offer you your own Podcast room on the site, which would give you the publicity whilst also helping us. HWrite us privately if you want to join in. Gordon On 28 Aug 2011, at 11:09, chris hallsworth wrote: Hi Gordon and all. Well I have done some podcasts of my own. I have done a short series on Total Recorder, one on a fairly unheard of screen reader called Cobra, a couple on NVDA (but not using the latest version I must admit), and one about JAWS Tandem which I did as part of my finals at university. If any or all of you are interested in any or all of them, please shout. I can always upload them to my Dropbox folder and share the links publicly. I have a pro 50 account, paid yearly. So won't run out of space that easily smiles. Look forward to your offers. Chat soon. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 28/08/2011 09:47, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi everybody > > As you have doubtless noticed, Techno-Chat is now out on its own, so to speak. Meaning that it's under the "Techno-Chat Dot Net" banner, instead of the old "TFT BBs" banner which, when it expires, will not be renewed. In fact, tft-bbs.com is now largely redundant as the only facility it offers is an old website which is no longer under development. > > So, the plan is to expand Techno-Chat if possible, along the same lines as we are doing with Mac Access. It occurred to us that maybe some might be interested in producing articles or even podcasts related to their uses of technology, or their interests in same. You know the type of things, radio, computing, medical stuff, anything with an emphasis on technology would be most welcome. > > The Techno-Chat website isn't yet up in the public domain. But we aim to rectify that situation shortly. I'm not expecting a rush of responses, if I'm totally honest. But if anybody is interested, their contributions will be gratefully received. > > Gordon > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From tsiegel at softcon.com Sun Aug 28 16:53:37 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 11:53:37 -0400 Subject: Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: References: <201108280258.p7S2ws2W074679@x.it.okstate.edu> <4E59AF78.3030004@internode.on.net> Message-ID: On Aug 28, 2011, at 4:40 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Dane is correct. PGP is now one of the expanding Symantec group > which, by definition, puts me off. While it may be true that symantec has a pgp implementation, pgp itself is opensource, therefore, it's owned by nobody. Phil Zimmerman, the inventor of pgp released it as freeware initially, but after threats from the us government to incarcerate him for having the product out in the public, he then released the source, and put it out as freeware as well, to thwart the government officials. Every since then, there's been several releases of the program by several different organizations, (including one by the government themselves) all of which have claimed ownership of the product, but none of which in actuality own anything at all. I'm sure they'll all argue with you (and me) if such is mentioned to them, but the plain fact of the matter is that since it was released as freeware, source included, for anyone to do whatever they like with it (yes, I had a copy of the original distribution) then nobody (and that includes the government and commercial companies) can claim ownership of the product itself. This is why you'll see the entities in question claiming ownership of particular versions, not pgp as a whole (of course, in some cases, you need to dig fairly deep into their licenses to find it), but regardless, unless you're specifically tied to a certain version of pgp, there's nothing preventing you from downloading the source, and compiling your own copy from source, which would then be yours w/no strings attached. Of course, it's been several years since I've done this, and I don't know where the original source can be found now, and of course it won't have all the bells and whistles that have been added by others, but it will still do the job in most cases. So, you see, you can still use pgp, without being tied to symantec, the us government, or any other user/entity if you so desire. From christopherh40 at gmail.com Sun Aug 28 17:31:39 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 17:31:39 +0100 Subject: Windows Email clients, which is the best? In-Reply-To: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> References: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4E5A6D6B.1090302@gmail.com> I use Thunderbird for e-mail and Jarte for word processing. So if you cannot download Jarte Plus again you can download Jarte and still be able to do Word documents. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 28/08/2011 12:27, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Recently I installed Windows 7 as a VM on our MacBook because our Asus NetBook has gone into stupid mode whining about hardware changes for some reason. > > So, I'm looking for opinions as to which email client to go for and, for that matter, how best to handle things like Word documents. I'm not interested in Excel or PowerPoint so I really can't see much point in buying Microsof Office. We do have a programme called Jarte Plus, (I think that's the right name), assuming we can still download it. I think that handles Word document files and we do have NoteTab Pro although I'm not sure if we have the latest Windows 7 64-bit compatible version. I meant to mention that actually, we are 64-bit, and the difference is astonishing. > > The virtual machine, configured with 4GB of RAM is out-performing most of the real PC's we've ever had, including the Asus NetBook we have which, as I said, is a brick at the moment because it's whining at us to insert a Windows 7 DVD to repair it. But, of course, you can't use a bog-standard one, it has to be the one containing the Asus drivers. We don't have a bootable DVD to insert so that's the end of that it would seem. > > Anyway, I am getting off the point. I welcome people's views regarding whether to go for Windows Live Mail or Thunderbird, or maybe there is a different one. Gordon mentioned Forge Agent, which has the advantage of also being a news groups reader. So I welcome opinions. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > From gordon at mac-access.net Sun Aug 28 19:38:25 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 19:38:25 +0100 Subject: Windows Email clients, which is the best? In-Reply-To: <4E5A6D6B.1090302@gmail.com> References: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> <4E5A6D6B.1090302@gmail.com> Message-ID: <47E4D9ED-71C2-4F99-B6F5-6F5D28FEB235@mac-access.net> Hi Chris We do have a license for Jate Plus, so hopefully we can still use that product. I have to give the authors credit, it is a well-written and nicely designed product. There are some good things available in the Windows market and that's one of them. I'll have to find out whether it's 64-bit compatible. Gordon On 28 Aug 2011, at 17:31, chris hallsworth wrote: I use Thunderbird for e-mail and Jarte for word processing. So if you cannot download Jarte Plus again you can download Jarte and still be able to do Word documents. Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird On 28/08/2011 12:27, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Recently I installed Windows 7 as a VM on our MacBook because our Asus NetBook has gone into stupid mode whining about hardware changes for some reason. > > So, I'm looking for opinions as to which email client to go for and, for that matter, how best to handle things like Word documents. I'm not interested in Excel or PowerPoint so I really can't see much point in buying Microsof Office. We do have a programme called Jarte Plus, (I think that's the right name), assuming we can still download it. I think that handles Word document files and we do have NoteTab Pro although I'm not sure if we have the latest Windows 7 64-bit compatible version. I meant to mention that actually, we are 64-bit, and the difference is astonishing. > > The virtual machine, configured with 4GB of RAM is out-performing most of the real PC's we've ever had, including the Asus NetBook we have which, as I said, is a brick at the moment because it's whining at us to insert a Windows 7 DVD to repair it. But, of course, you can't use a bog-standard one, it has to be the one containing the Asus drivers. We don't have a bootable DVD to insert so that's the end of that it would seem. > > Anyway, I am getting off the point. I welcome people's views regarding whether to go for Windows Live Mail or Thunderbird, or maybe there is a different one. Gordon mentioned Forge Agent, which has the advantage of also being a news groups reader. So I welcome opinions. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Mon Aug 29 05:03:35 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Sun, 28 Aug 2011 23:03:35 -0500 Subject: Windows Email clients, which is the best? In-Reply-To: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> References: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> Message-ID: You don't have to buy the whole Microsoft suite. You can buy outlook, and word individually. and under a hundred bucks. I use excell for my business, so I got the whole suite. but I love the features that outlook has. Calendar, contacts, and eamil all in one spot. that is the only thing that apple mail is missing, oh the power of word also. JMO. Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians On Aug 28, 2011, at 6:27 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Recently I installed Windows 7 as a VM on our MacBook because our Asus NetBook has gone into stupid mode whining about hardware changes for some reason. > > So, I'm looking for opinions as to which email client to go for and, for that matter, how best to handle things like Word documents. I'm not interested in Excel or PowerPoint so I really can't see much point in buying Microsof Office. We do have a programme called Jarte Plus, (I think that's the right name), assuming we can still download it. I think that handles Word document files and we do have NoteTab Pro although I'm not sure if we have the latest Windows 7 64-bit compatible version. I meant to mention that actually, we are 64-bit, and the difference is astonishing. > > The virtual machine, configured with 4GB of RAM is out-performing most of the real PC's we've ever had, including the Asus NetBook we have which, as I said, is a brick at the moment because it's whining at us to insert a Windows 7 DVD to repair it. But, of course, you can't use a bog-standard one, it has to be the one containing the Asus drivers. We don't have a bootable DVD to insert so that's the end of that it would seem. > > Anyway, I am getting off the point. I welcome people's views regarding whether to go for Windows Live Mail or Thunderbird, or maybe there is a different one. Gordon mentioned Forge Agent, which has the advantage of also being a news groups reader. So I welcome opinions. > > Lynne > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 29 09:24:50 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 09:24:50 +0100 Subject: Windows Email clients, which is the best? In-Reply-To: References: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> Message-ID: hi Kliphton You gotta be joking! 100 Bucks for Outlook, absolutely no way! If Lynne is even thinking of doing this, she can forget it! Yes, I'd never claim that Apple Mail is perfect by any means. But the in actual fact, it is possible to use Exchange accounts with Apple nail. But just out of interest, can you be more specific regarding why Apple Mail doesn't work for you? Actually I notice this a lot, how many people on the mac Access list are still using outlook under Windows. But buying Outlook for 100 Dollars, whatever that equates too in Pounds GBP, is absolutely not an option. Apart from anything else, unless they've changed their behaviour recently, I see Outlook as a security breech because of the fact that address book data etc. get covertly re-transmitted all over the place. Websites use cookies to access the Outlook address book and that's one method by which spammers gain access to email addresses and, for all I know, passwords as well. That was certainly the case with every version of Outlook Express I ever tried. I can't comment as to Outlook 2003 upwards. Gordon On 29 Aug 2011, at 05:03, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: You don't have to buy the whole Microsoft suite. You can buy outlook, and word individually. and under a hundred bucks. I use excell for my business, so I got the whole suite. but I love the features that outlook has. Calendar, contacts, and eamil all in one spot. that is the only thing that apple mail is missing, oh the power of word also. JMO. From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 29 09:30:05 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 09:30:05 +0100 Subject: Nuance Voices for Windows Message-ID: <39E87DA7-FD3B-4DD8-9A6A-14866650214D@mac-access.net> Hi all Anybody know where you can obtain the Nuance voice set for Windows without all the other junk? For instance, next up.com requires that you buy their TextAloud programme in order to have the voices. I don't want that heap of junk, I have no use for it. Actually I'd much prefer InfoVox but I can only find one UK reseller and he's not the best person to deal with sometimes. So the only voices remaining are the Nuance ones. I had them on our NetBook, but can't gain access to that at the moment as it's severely broken. Gordon From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Mon Aug 29 14:24:52 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 08:24:52 -0500 Subject: PGP was Is This True About Dropbox? Message-ID: <201108291324.p7TDOqDB081745@x.it.okstate.edu> The GNU version is called gpg and is still free. What you can do is to encrypt whole files which could be anything from a text file of a recipe for beer to the VM file for your entire machine. gpg wouldn't care, it's all just bytes as far as it is concerned. Use a strong key or at least maybe a whole line of text, spaces and all, and that would keep somebody busy for more days than they probably have on Earth. They won't know the length of your key nor anything else about it so unless the combination to the safe for Fort Knox or the launch codes to start atomic war are there, nobody is going to be interested much in it. I heard, once, that the NSA and CIA, the American agencies for domestic and international intelligence have said that so much ordinary traffic is now encrypted that they must use extraordinary measures to crack things they are interested in. They have supercomputers and, I am sure, can eventually crack any pgp-based encryption, but even most governments around the world don't have those resources. Be smart, of course, and don't tempt fate, but I would trust a pgp encrypted file on Dropbox or painted on the outside of the building, here, but what worries me about all this cloud stuff is human errors and what I call "suit wars." Human errors don't need much explanation, but what I mean by "suit wars" is deliberate reduction or stoppage of service due to business squabbles that are not the fault of the end user. Somebody cries foul. The switch goes Off. There are not always warnings. I think of a proverb I once read that goes, "Trust in God, but tie up your camel." Martin From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 29 14:48:18 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 14:48:18 +0100 Subject: PGP was Is This True About Dropbox? In-Reply-To: <201108291324.p7TDOqDB081745@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108291324.p7TDOqDB081745@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <8B24A604-0322-41EF-8AFA-EAC840D3B683@mac-access.net> Hi Martin Actually, GPG was released years ago as a rival product to PGP. Some disaffected programmers got together to form a rival group when PGP fell into the hands of the commercial people. I've never personally used it, but it is nice to a see it's still alive and kicking. Gordon On 29 Aug 2011, at 14:24, Martin McCormick wrote: The GNU version is called gpg and is still free. What you can do is to encrypt whole files which could be anything from a text file of a recipe for beer to the VM file for your entire machine. gpg wouldn't care, it's all just bytes as far as it is concerned. Use a strong key or at least maybe a whole line of text, spaces and all, and that would keep somebody busy for more days than they probably have on Earth. They won't know the length of your key nor anything else about it so unless the combination to the safe for Fort Knox or the launch codes to start atomic war are there, nobody is going to be interested much in it. I heard, once, that the NSA and CIA, the American agencies for domestic and international intelligence have said that so much ordinary traffic is now encrypted that they must use extraordinary measures to crack things they are interested in. They have supercomputers and, I am sure, can eventually crack any pgp-based encryption, but even most governments around the world don't have those resources. Be smart, of course, and don't tempt fate, but I would trust a pgp encrypted file on Dropbox or painted on the outside of the building, here, but what worries me about all this cloud stuff is human errors and what I call "suit wars." Human errors don't need much explanation, but what I mean by "suit wars" is deliberate reduction or stoppage of service due to business squabbles that are not the fault of the end user. Somebody cries foul. The switch goes Off. There are not always warnings. I think of a proverb I once read that goes, "Trust in God, but tie up your camel." Martin ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Mon Aug 29 16:53:00 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 10:53:00 -0500 Subject: Windows Email clients, which is the best? In-Reply-To: References: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <8C0F84C3-6E88-47AB-A65E-4333DE686FF4@gmail.com> Well,, I was talking about outlook and Microsoft word together for a hundred bucks, still a little ridiculous if you ask me. And apple mail does work for me. I just use outlook when I'm on the windows side, and to send out group emails. outlook handls distribution lists a little better than apple mail. but I use apple mail for most of my email tasks. As for the cookies you are concerned about the internet using. I don't think it can gain access unless you give it permission too. I could be wrong though. But I've never had my address book spammed. Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians On Aug 29, 2011, at 3:24 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > hi Kliphton > > You gotta be joking! 100 Bucks for Outlook, absolutely no way! If Lynne is even thinking of doing this, she can forget it! > > Yes, I'd never claim that Apple Mail is perfect by any means. But the in actual fact, it is possible to use Exchange accounts with Apple nail. But just out of interest, can you be more specific regarding why Apple Mail doesn't work for you? Actually I notice this a lot, how many people on the mac Access list are still using outlook under Windows. But buying Outlook for 100 Dollars, whatever that equates too in Pounds GBP, is absolutely not an option. Apart from anything else, unless they've changed their behaviour recently, I see Outlook as a security breech because of the fact that address book data etc. get covertly re-transmitted all over the place. Websites use cookies to access the Outlook address book and that's one method by which spammers gain access to email addresses and, for all I know, passwords as well. > > That was certainly the case with every version of Outlook Express I ever tried. I can't comment as to Outlook 2003 upwards. > > Gordon > > On 29 Aug 2011, at 05:03, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: > > You don't have to buy the whole Microsoft suite. You can buy outlook, and word individually. and under a hundred bucks. I use excell for my business, so I got the whole suite. but I love the features that outlook has. Calendar, contacts, and eamil all in one spot. that is the only thing that apple mail is missing, oh the power of word also. JMO. > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- From mstores at indiana.edu Mon Aug 29 17:21:25 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 12:21:25 -0400 Subject: Student studying Arabic Message-ID: <20110829122125.j6gt8sgz40wwowsc@webmail.iu.edu> Hi guys, I don't know if you would happen to know the answer for this, but we have a stucent here who just enrolled. He's going to need to read stuff in Arabic. He is a JAWS user and has purchased the US version of JAWS. Freedom gave me a link to download speech synthesis for 28 supported languages (they count British as one of them....seriously!) Does anyone have any ideas on Arabic speech synthesis? Thanks, Mary From christopherh40 at gmail.com Mon Aug 29 17:33:31 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 17:33:31 +0100 Subject: Good news for NVDA and Eloquence fans Message-ID: <4E5BBF5B.8060108@gmail.com> Hello all. There is some good news for people who like not only NVDA but Eloquence as well. Press enter to activate the following link. http://www.nvda-project.org/blog/EloquenceAvailabilityInterest -- Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Mon Aug 29 17:54:29 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 11:54:29 -0500 Subject: Student studying Arabic Message-ID: <201108291654.p7TGsTFv082740@x.it.okstate.edu> I don't know much detail, here, but I do know that Arabic is a right-to-left language so the speech is only one thing that will need adjustment. Does Windows have a boot manager or something like BootCamp that lets you decide which OS to boot into? You might set up half the drive for the Arabic version of Windows which would make the keyboard just like what you need in an Arabic-speaking land and then install the Arabic JAWS there if possible. The other half of the drive would be the standard Windows and American JAWS. I really know very little about Windows so there might be some sort of master configuration file that sets language, keyboard and maybe even messages so if one could swap the American setup out with the Arabic setup, then you could use one version of Windows for both modes of operation. What I wonder is whether Windows has something like the Unix concept of a locale. It's a library of rules that govern time and date display, your keyboard and other conventions for displaying or entering data. Just some thoughts and good luck. Mary Stores writes: > Hi guys, > > > I don't know if you would happen to know the answer for this, but we have > a > stucent here who just enrolled. He's going to need to read stuff in > Arabic. > He is a JAWS user and has purchased the US version of JAWS. Freedom gave > me > a link to download speech synthesis for 28 supported languages (they count > British as one of them....seriously!) Does anyone have any ideas on Arabic > speech synthesis? > > > Thanks, > > Mary > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated > web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > > From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 29 18:06:50 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 18:06:50 +0100 Subject: Windows & OS X general observations In-Reply-To: <8C0F84C3-6E88-47AB-A65E-4333DE686FF4@gmail.com> References: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> <8C0F84C3-6E88-47AB-A65E-4333DE686FF4@gmail.com> Message-ID: <6CAD3A96-11A2-4268-A4EE-E02C0735C588@mac-access.net> Hi You mean you don't know you've had your address book hijacked. It's inherent with Outlook, (express, at least), that's why I used the word "covertly". It's done without the user knowing anything about it. I would be the first to admit that Apple Mail is far from perfect. For instance you can't send return receipts using Apple mail and that, to me at least, is really silly. Actually the customer liaison that Apple doesn't do is one of the things that irritates me. They have a road map, and that's it, they stick to it rigidly. Little things like, for instance, cut and paste objects, the inability to turn off the "trash", little things like that bug me. So all those people who accuse me of being "In love with Apple", as one person put it, they're totally wrong. And yes, I do give Microsoft credit where it is due. For instance, I am very very impressed with the stability of Windows 7 64-bit. It beats the pants off the 32-bit version in a lot of ways. Obviously it is faster, but it's also more stable. Gordon On 29 Aug 2011, at 16:53, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: Well,, I was talking about outlook and Microsoft word together for a hundred bucks, still a little ridiculous if you ask me. And apple mail does work for me. I just use outlook when I'm on the windows side, and to send out group emails. outlook handls distribution lists a little better than apple mail. but I use apple mail for most of my email tasks. As for the cookies you are concerned about the internet using. I don't think it can gain access unless you give it permission too. I could be wrong though. But I've never had my address book spammed. Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians On Aug 29, 2011, at 3:24 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > hi Kliphton > > You gotta be joking! 100 Bucks for Outlook, absolutely no way! If Lynne is even thinking of doing this, she can forget it! > > Yes, I'd never claim that Apple Mail is perfect by any means. But the in actual fact, it is possible to use Exchange accounts with Apple nail. But just out of interest, can you be more specific regarding why Apple Mail doesn't work for you? Actually I notice this a lot, how many people on the mac Access list are still using outlook under Windows. But buying Outlook for 100 Dollars, whatever that equates too in Pounds GBP, is absolutely not an option. Apart from anything else, unless they've changed their behaviour recently, I see Outlook as a security breech because of the fact that address book data etc. get covertly re-transmitted all over the place. Websites use cookies to access the Outlook address book and that's one method by which spammers gain access to email addresses and, for all I know, passwords as well. > > That was certainly the case with every version of Outlook Express I ever tried. I can't comment as to Outlook 2003 upwards. > > Gordon > > On 29 Aug 2011, at 05:03, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: > > You don't have to buy the whole Microsoft suite. You can buy outlook, and word individually. and under a hundred bucks. I use excell for my business, so I got the whole suite. but I love the features that outlook has. Calendar, contacts, and eamil all in one spot. that is the only thing that apple mail is missing, oh the power of word also. JMO. > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 29 18:17:16 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 18:17:16 +0100 Subject: Student studying Arabic In-Reply-To: <20110829122125.j6gt8sgz40wwowsc@webmail.iu.edu> References: <20110829122125.j6gt8sgz40wwowsc@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: Hi Mary Sorry, but that's just pathetic. Counting British English as a separate language I mean. Honestly, I've never heard of anything so darn stupid in all my life! It's a bit like saying Australian English, New Zealand English, and Caribbean English are different languages. I bet they do say that actually, they're just stupid enough. or then again, maybe they're not stupid, it's another way of ripping off the consumer and Freedom Scientific excels in that respect. I'm sorry I couldn't answer your question, but I just had to comment on this. Gordon On 29 Aug 2011, at 17:21, Mary Stores wrote: Hi guys, I don't know if you would happen to know the answer for this, but we have a stucent here who just enrolled. He's going to need to read stuff in Arabic. He is a JAWS user and has purchased the US version of JAWS. Freedom gave me a link to download speech synthesis for 28 supported languages (they count British as one of them....seriously!) Does anyone have any ideas on Arabic speech synthesis? Thanks, Mary ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From mstores at indiana.edu Mon Aug 29 18:25:48 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 13:25:48 -0400 Subject: Student studying Arabic In-Reply-To: References: <20110829122125.j6gt8sgz40wwowsc@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: <20110829132548.lu38y2plk0ck8kgk@webmail.iu.edu> You're right, Gordon. The first flag on the RealSpeak Solo Direct page for Freedom is an Australian flag. lol At least these supported so-called languages are free. Mary Quoting Gordon Smith : > Hi Mary > > Sorry, but that's just pathetic. Counting British English as a > separate language I mean. Honestly, I've never heard of anything so > darn stupid in all my life! It's a bit like saying Australian > English, New Zealand English, and Caribbean English are different > languages. I bet they do say that actually, they're just stupid > enough. > From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 29 18:29:12 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 18:29:12 +0100 Subject: Student studying Arabic In-Reply-To: <20110829132548.lu38y2plk0ck8kgk@webmail.iu.edu> References: <20110829122125.j6gt8sgz40wwowsc@webmail.iu.edu> <20110829132548.lu38y2plk0ck8kgk@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: <00DC7B72-FC33-4981-AAC5-73727132430A@mac-access.net> Hi Mary I'm laughing! Just out of interest though, are these synthesisers only for use with JFW? I'm looking for some of those but I need generic SAPI5. I'm willing to buy them, if need be. But honestly that just makes me laugh, calling different variations of English different "languages". Gordon On 29 Aug 2011, at 18:25, Mary Stores wrote: You're right, Gordon. The first flag on the RealSpeak Solo Direct page for Freedom is an Australian flag. lol At least these supported so-called languages are free. Mary Quoting Gordon Smith : > Hi Mary > > Sorry, but that's just pathetic. Counting British English as a > separate language I mean. Honestly, I've never heard of anything so > darn stupid in all my life! It's a bit like saying Australian > English, New Zealand English, and Caribbean English are different > languages. I bet they do say that actually, they're just stupid > enough. > ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From christopherh40 at gmail.com Mon Aug 29 21:13:52 2011 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 21:13:52 +0100 Subject: Microsoft Overhauls Windows Explorer in Windows 8 Message-ID: <4E5BF300.6050902@gmail.com> I thought I would share the following that i have copied and pasted from another list. Microsoft Overhauls Windows Explorer in Windows 8 By Ian Paul, PCWorld Aug 24, 2011 6:13 AM Microsoft Overhauls Windows Explorer in Windows 8Hold onto your socks Windows 8 fans, because Microsoft is adding some new enhancements to its file manager application, Windows Explorer, in the next version of its popular operating system. And the first Explorer feature Microsoft wants to show off is (drumroll please): the new copy dialog. Huh? I know, I know, copying functions may elicit yawns from many of you, but copying, moving, renaming and deleting files are the most oft-used features of Windows Explorer. Microsoft says these four basic functions account for 50 percent of all Explorer usage in Windows 7. That means there's a lot of file management going on for the average Windows 7 user every day. So while these changes may not be as exciting as say, a brand new touch-centric overlay, improvements to the way Windows handles copying could improve your overall OS experience, as long as you're into copying multiple files that is. This One's For The Multitaskers Microsoft's copying overhaul doesn't really improve much for people who typically move around one file or folder at a time or are used to handling small text files. But if you find yourself moving around large amounts of data such as photos and videos, then Windows 8 aims to make your copying experience easier. Microsoft says it had three goals for its new copy dialog: move all copy jobs into one window, simplify the UI and give you more control over any operations in progress. Here's what you have to look forward to when copying files in Windows 8. Copy Central Instead of having multiple windows open for each file, Windows 8 will automatically merge all copy jobs into one central window. The basic view shows you how many items are being copied in each job, their source and destination folders, and a progress bar. There are also pause and cancel buttons if you'd like to speed up one copy job by putting the other on hold or cancel one altogether. The source and destination folders are also clickable so you can open up those folders directly from the copy dialog. If you want more details about your copy job, click on the "More details" disclosure button at the bottom of the window. Opening this up shows you a new real-time throughput graph, speed of data transfer, time remaining and how much data is left to transfer. Microsoft also says it has improved its time estimates for how long it takes for a copy job to finish, but didn't go into detail about what those improvements are. The Windows maker did point out that getting a precise time estimate is nearly impossible. There are just too many variables to account for, according to Microsoft, such as whether you're anti-virus program will start scanning files on your hard drive halfway through the transfer. Microsoft also warned that while the new copy dialog offers detailed information it was not designed to be a benchmarking tool. Filename Collisions Windows 7 Conflict Resolution Dialog Windows 8 has a new way to handle alerts when you are about to copy a file with the same name as another file in your destination folder, a problem Microsoft calls a filename collision. This can happen if you maintain a separate folder for editing photos and don't bother to change the filename. Or, you receive a revised copy of a contract via email and dump it into your contracts folder. Before Windows 8 lets you overwrite your old file, you'll be met with three choices that are somewhat similar to Windows 7: replace all the old files in the destination folder, skip copying the new files or choose the files to keep in the destination folder. Windows 8 Conflict Resolution Dialog If you choose the latter, a new dialog pops up showing you the files you want to copy in the left column and the files with the same name in the destination folder on the right. The dialog shows the file names, dates that each file was created, and each file's size. You can also hover over each file to see its location or you can double click on a file to open it. When you're ready to choose the files you want to keep, just click the check boxes next to the files, press "Continue" and you're done. If you don't click a check box next to one of your two colliding files, Windows 8 errs on the side of caution and keeps your old version intact. New Windows 8 Start Icon? Beyond the new copying features, online sleuths have been trying to glean other tidbits of information from Microsoft's new Windows 8 demo. UK-based blog My Microsoft Life believes it saw a new Windows start icon at the beginning of the video below, but it's hard to say for sure. Keep an eye on the screen behind Microsoft's Alex Simons and let us know what you think in the comments. Microsoft also has a larger version of the copy dialog video to get a better look at the screen. -- Chris Hallsworth Sent from Thunderbird From gordon at mac-access.net Mon Aug 29 22:12:26 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 22:12:26 +0100 Subject: Microsoft Overhauls Windows Explorer in Windows 8 In-Reply-To: <4E5BF300.6050902@gmail.com> References: <4E5BF300.6050902@gmail.com> Message-ID: <109050FB-955A-4DC5-B702-CCE8A6C3E13F@mac-access.net> Hey, I can't wait! How am I gonna sleep at night, knowing what Microsoft is doing here? Gosh, it's so thrilling, so exciting, I can't wait, I'm bouncing up and down on my chair, I just can't wait ? Oh, please gimme gimme gimme now! I ?. I?.. I?..! Well, ok not really, in actual fact this is nothing new if it's really what they are working on. Good lord, they must be utterly desperate! I mean, wow! Is that really all they can come up with? Well all I can say is bully for Microsoft. This kind of functionality is already available actually in Take Command 11, as far as I'm aware. But even if it isn't, it's hardly going to revolutionise the world of personal computing now is it! What they should be doing is a complete rewrite. They need to get risk of all that obsolete code, get rid of the old file format systems and get rid of the stupid concept of the registry. I really and truly don't think this will set the world on fire. I'm sorry to sound so pessimistic, but that's how I feel having read this. Gordon From skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com Tue Aug 30 07:11:30 2011 From: skhleirpehctcoens7284 at gmail.com (Kliph&Sharrie) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 01:11:30 -0500 Subject: Windows & OS X general observations In-Reply-To: <6CAD3A96-11A2-4268-A4EE-E02C0735C588@mac-access.net> References: <8C9C7E7A-3C0D-4929-B2F0-7909EB6394AF@mac-access.net> <8C0F84C3-6E88-47AB-A65E-4333DE686FF4@gmail.com> <6CAD3A96-11A2-4268-A4EE-E02C0735C588@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <0C39B7A9-5C5B-4D96-86ED-F551BA90B68D@gmail.com> Totally agree about the stability. But I haven't used outlook express in ages, has to of been 5 years? Outlook 2010, and 2007 has been very secure for me. At least I've never gotten any messages from my contacts saying they've been spammed or harassed. But hey, no program is perfect. Kliphton SR (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians On Aug 29, 2011, at 12:06 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi > > You mean you don't know you've had your address book hijacked. It's inherent with Outlook, (express, at least), that's why I used the word "covertly". It's done without the user knowing anything about it. > > I would be the first to admit that Apple Mail is far from perfect. For instance you can't send return receipts using Apple mail and that, to me at least, is really silly. > > Actually the customer liaison that Apple doesn't do is one of the things that irritates me. They have a road map, and that's it, they stick to it rigidly. > > Little things like, for instance, cut and paste objects, the inability to turn off the "trash", little things like that bug me. So all those people who accuse me of being "In love with Apple", as one person put it, they're totally wrong. And yes, I do give Microsoft credit where it is due. For instance, I am very very impressed with the stability of Windows 7 64-bit. It beats the pants off the 32-bit version in a lot of ways. Obviously it is faster, but it's also more stable. > > Gordon > > > On 29 Aug 2011, at 16:53, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: > > Well,, I was talking about outlook and Microsoft word together for a hundred bucks, still a little ridiculous if you ask me. And apple mail does work for me. I just use outlook when I'm on the windows side, and to send out group emails. outlook handls distribution lists a little better than apple mail. but I use apple mail for most of my email tasks. As for the cookies you are concerned about the internet using. I don't think it can gain access unless you give it permission too. I could be wrong though. But I've never had my address book spammed. > Kliphton SR > (twitter&Skype) kliphton72 > (Marriage Blog) http://cm-i-t-real-world.blogspot.com > (Marriage group) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/committed-married-christians > > > > On Aug 29, 2011, at 3:24 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > >> hi Kliphton >> >> You gotta be joking! 100 Bucks for Outlook, absolutely no way! If Lynne is even thinking of doing this, she can forget it! >> >> Yes, I'd never claim that Apple Mail is perfect by any means. But the in actual fact, it is possible to use Exchange accounts with Apple nail. But just out of interest, can you be more specific regarding why Apple Mail doesn't work for you? Actually I notice this a lot, how many people on the mac Access list are still using outlook under Windows. But buying Outlook for 100 Dollars, whatever that equates too in Pounds GBP, is absolutely not an option. Apart from anything else, unless they've changed their behaviour recently, I see Outlook as a security breech because of the fact that address book data etc. get covertly re-transmitted all over the place. Websites use cookies to access the Outlook address book and that's one method by which spammers gain access to email addresses and, for all I know, passwords as well. >> >> That was certainly the case with every version of Outlook Express I ever tried. I can't comment as to Outlook 2003 upwards. >> >> Gordon >> >> On 29 Aug 2011, at 05:03, Kliph&Sharrie wrote: >> >> You don't have to buy the whole Microsoft suite. You can buy outlook, and word individually. and under a hundred bucks. I use excell for my business, so I got the whole suite. but I love the features that outlook has. Calendar, contacts, and eamil all in one spot. that is the only thing that apple mail is missing, oh the power of word also. JMO. >> >> >> >> ======================================= >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: >> >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> Or: >> >> you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: >> >> >> --------------------------------------- > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- From d.griffith at btinternet.com Tue Aug 30 11:51:17 2011 From: d.griffith at btinternet.com (David Griffith) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 11:51:17 +0100 Subject: Boot camp slow Message-ID: <8495E0ED06064AACA5F14167AA60BCC9@6ffd52c138504d6> Dear list My first posting here. I managed to install windows 7 on my I-Mac via boot camp yesterday with sighted help. However now booting into either Mac or windows Operating system takes an age. I regret having lost the lovely fast start up time of the Mac. I cannot see what is happening on the screen as it boots up. I actually switched back to the Mac by going into the boot camp applet in control panel in Windows 7. Despite this the boot up was still far longer than before. Is there any way of stopping the boot up process being so slow? Is it waiting for a key press on a screen I cannot see? Regards David Griffith __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 6420 (20110829) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Tue Aug 30 14:44:11 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 08:44:11 -0500 Subject: Microsoft Overhauls Windows Explorer in Windows 8 Message-ID: <201108301344.p7UDiBOU087738@x.it.okstate.edu> 100% Agree! One of the reasons I abandoned Windows about ten years ago was that I could see it was becoming the world's largest collection of patches, tweaks and cluges. There's just no system to it. It's all about making it work today and to Hell with tomorrow. A true built-in screen reader would also be necessary to change my mind. I don't care if they license it from Freedom and sell everybody a copy of JAWS for two Dollars or what they do, but until it becomes something useful out of the box for the masses, it is worthless in my books. I'm sorry, but that's how I think of anything to do with Microsoft and Windows. They can still get religion and get on the wagon, so to speak, but I don't see any evidence of that any time soon. O yes, that earthquake on the East Coast last week was some hackers getting a sneak preview of all the fantastic wonders to soon be coming out of Redmond any day now! Gordon, try to contain yourself. The Earth just can't take this sort of kinetic abuse much longer. Martin Gordon Smith writes: > Hey, I can't wait! How am I gonna sleep at night, knowing what Microsoft > is doing here? Gosh, it's so thrilling, so exciting, I can't wait, I'm > bouncing up and down on my chair, I just can't wait ? Oh, please gimme > gimme gimme now! I ?. I?.. I?..! From mstores at indiana.edu Tue Aug 30 15:01:19 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 10:01:19 -0400 Subject: New member welcome Message-ID: <20110830100119.mohcuyhrks0844go@webmail.iu.edu> Hello, When new members join the list, it's traditional that we send out a welcome. So welcome to David Griffith! We hope you find this list useful. If you have any problems or questions about the list that the list policy has not answered for you, please feel freee to contact Gordon and Lynne Smith, the list controllers at support at mac-access.net, or Mary Stores, the assistant list controller at mstores at indiana.edu. Mary From gordon at mac-access.net Tue Aug 30 15:43:05 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 15:43:05 +0100 Subject: Boot camp slow In-Reply-To: <8495E0ED06064AACA5F14167AA60BCC9@6ffd52c138504d6> References: <8495E0ED06064AACA5F14167AA60BCC9@6ffd52c138504d6> Message-ID: <19AD086D-806C-45E0-B8D3-9B140FD05D13@mac-access.net> David The reason for this is most likely you're running Boot Camp 3 which isn't really compatible with Lion. You need Boot Camp 4, as I mentioned the other day on our sister list. Gordon On 30 Aug 2011, at 11:51, David Griffith wrote: Dear list My first posting here. I managed to install windows 7 on my I-Mac via boot camp yesterday with sighted help. However now booting into either Mac or windows Operating system takes an age. I regret having lost the lovely fast start up time of the Mac. I cannot see what is happening on the screen as it boots up. I actually switched back to the Mac by going into the boot camp applet in control panel in Windows 7. Despite this the boot up was still far longer than before. Is there any way of stopping the boot up process being so slow? Is it waiting for a key press on a screen I cannot see? Regards David Griffith __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 6420 (20110829) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Tue Aug 30 15:52:52 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 15:52:52 +0100 Subject: Microsoft Overhauls Windows Explorer in Windows 8 In-Reply-To: <201108301344.p7UDiBOU087738@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201108301344.p7UDiBOU087738@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <771EDC27-B276-471C-ABA8-9E1F38B90465@mac-access.net> Hi Martin Well, let's just say that I need a version of Windows for testing purposes at work. But for me, Boot Camp is a waste of space. By the way, for the benefit of David, who just joined us. David, you can talk about Toot Camp on the other group. The only thing you can't discuss is the configuration of Windows itself. For instance, you can't discuss JFW, Window-Eyes or whatever. But the configuration of Boot Camp itself is fine ono the other list. I hope that makes things a bit more clear. BC 4 is necessary I think for Lion because it's a 64-bit boot loader. Lion boots into 64-bit mode natively I personally use Fusion with Windows 7 64-bit. That's lightning fast actually under that configuration on our MacBook Pro. I'm going to install it on one of our Intel I7 quad core machines shortly, just to see what happens. Gordon On 30 Aug 2011, at 14:44, Martin McCormick wrote: 100% Agree! One of the reasons I abandoned Windows about ten years ago was that I could see it was becoming the world's largest collection of patches, tweaks and cluges. There's just no system to it. It's all about making it work today and to Hell with tomorrow. A true built-in screen reader would also be necessary to change my mind. I don't care if they license it from Freedom and sell everybody a copy of JAWS for two Dollars or what they do, but until it becomes something useful out of the box for the masses, it is worthless in my books. I'm sorry, but that's how I think of anything to do with Microsoft and Windows. They can still get religion and get on the wagon, so to speak, but I don't see any evidence of that any time soon. O yes, that earthquake on the East Coast last week was some hackers getting a sneak preview of all the fantastic wonders to soon be coming out of Redmond any day now! Gordon, try to contain yourself. The Earth just can't take this sort of kinetic abuse much longer. Martin Gordon Smith writes: > Hey, I can't wait! How am I gonna sleep at night, knowing what Microsoft > is doing here? Gosh, it's so thrilling, so exciting, I can't wait, I'm > bouncing up and down on my chair, I just can't wait ? Oh, please gimme > gimme gimme now! I ?. I?.. I?..! ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Tue Aug 30 15:55:27 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 15:55:27 +0100 Subject: New member welcome In-Reply-To: <20110830100119.mohcuyhrks0844go@webmail.iu.edu> References: <20110830100119.mohcuyhrks0844go@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: <1B52A22A-A751-4C04-B058-36EB32C75CBF@mac-access.net> Hi Mary Hey, I missed this didn't I! Sorry David. Lynne usually picks this sort of thing up, but she missed it this time because she's been out mall day. But Mary, you're getting quite good at this t game aren't you, LOL! Gordon On 30 Aug 2011, at 15:01, Mary Stores wrote: Hello, When new members join the list, it's traditional that we send out a welcome. So welcome to David Griffith! We hope you find this list useful. If you have any problems or questions about the list that the list policy has not answered for you, please feel freee to contact Gordon and Lynne Smith, the list controllers at support at mac-access.net, or Mary Stores, the assistant list controller at mstores at indiana.edu. Mary ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: --------------------------------------- From mstores at indiana.edu Tue Aug 30 16:19:19 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 11:19:19 -0400 Subject: New member welcome Message-ID: <20110830111919.7uv14536rj4ksk00@webmail.iu.edu> Hello, When a new member joins the list, it's traditional that a message gets sent out. So welcome to Daniel McGee! If you have any questions or problems that cannot be answered by the list policy, please feel free to contact the list moderators, Gordon and Lynne Smith at support at mac-access.net. You can also contact the assistant list controller, Mary Stores at mstores at indiana.edu. We hope you find this list to be useful. Mary From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Tue Aug 30 16:32:37 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 11:32:37 -0400 Subject: How to Back up a Bootcamp partition? In-Reply-To: <1B52A22A-A751-4C04-B058-36EB32C75CBF@mac-access.net> References: <20110830100119.mohcuyhrks0844go@webmail.iu.edu> <1B52A22A-A751-4C04-B058-36EB32C75CBF@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hi folks, I now have a working Windows 7 partition on my Macbook. I currently use Carbon Copy Cloner to back up my Mac HD. I also have Time machine running as well. I don't want to have to go through the process of getting Windows up again. How do I best back up this Bootcamp partition so that if I have a Hard disk disaster I can not only restore my Macintosh HD with Carbon Copy Cloner but also put that Bootcamp partition back? Can I simply use CCC and back it up to a partition? If I do that and copy it back would it work the same or no longer be bootable? Eric Caron From eric_caron at Mac-Access.net Tue Aug 30 16:37:19 2011 From: eric_caron at Mac-Access.net (Eric Caron) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 11:37:19 -0400 Subject: Back to the Mac from Bootcamp Message-ID: <108B5326-80F9-4D7F-A0EA-6FE06D34B83B@Mac-Access.net> Hi folks, When in Bootcamp and in Win 7 how do I find the place to quickly get booted back to Mac? I remember Apple sets up something nice to get us back quickly but I couldn't find it in my new installation. Eric Caron From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue Aug 30 16:20:25 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 08:20:25 -0700 Subject: Good news for NVDA and Eloquence fans In-Reply-To: <4E5BBF5B.8060108@gmail.com> References: <4E5BBF5B.8060108@gmail.com> Message-ID: <03ADE111-78C7-4EF9-9BD7-6F9A6D346BDA@gmail.com> There was talk on it on the nvda lists but I'm worried. If a lot of people say they will support it and don't pay up that will be bad news for the debs who sunk how ever much it is for the license. Take care all. On Aug 29, 2011, at 9:33 AM, chris hallsworth wrote: > Hello all. > There is some good news for people who like not only NVDA but Eloquence as well. Press enter to activate the following link. > http://www.nvda-project.org/blog/EloquenceAvailabilityInterest > -- > > Chris Hallsworth > Sent from Thunderbird > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- From d.griffith at btinternet.com Tue Aug 30 23:51:52 2011 From: d.griffith at btinternet.com (David Griffith) Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 23:51:52 +0100 Subject: Boot camp slow In-Reply-To: <19AD086D-806C-45E0-B8D3-9B140FD05D13@mac-access.net> References: <8495E0ED06064AACA5F14167AA60BCC9@6ffd52c138504d6> <19AD086D-806C-45E0-B8D3-9B140FD05D13@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <8A76F2D2-5B1C-4B28-943F-0DA09E448ABC@btinternet.com> David Griffith d.griffith at btinternet.com Checking my version of Boot Camp it says that it is version 4.0. Basically I think I am getting a white screen which lasts for about 2 -3 minutes then the screen goes dark and the boot into Windows begins. Researching this on Google I see that this may be a problem with copies of Windows 7 that are not properly activated. My copy is a legal copy of Windows 7 though. I installed it last week in VM Fusion and everything is now running fine there. As this is crippling the Mac OS Lion start up as well I may have to get rid of the boot camp partition. Are there any other suggestions before I the this drastic step? Regards David Griffith. On 30 Aug 2011, at 15:43, Gordon Smith wrote: > David > > The reason for this is most likely you're running Boot Camp 3 which isn't really compatible with Lion. You need Boot Camp 4, as I mentioned the other day on our sister list. > > Gordon > > > On 30 Aug 2011, at 11:51, David Griffith wrote: > > Dear list > > My first posting here. > I managed to install windows 7 on my I-Mac via boot camp yesterday with > sighted help. > However now booting into either Mac or windows Operating system takes an > age. I regret having lost the lovely fast start up time of the Mac. > I cannot see what is happening on the screen as it boots up. I actually > switched back to the Mac by going into the boot camp applet in control panel > in Windows 7. Despite this the boot up was still far longer than before. > Is there any way of stopping the boot up process being so slow? > Is it waiting for a key press on a screen I cannot see? > > Regards > > David Griffith > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature > database 6420 (20110829) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- From gordon at mac-access.net Wed Aug 31 05:58:53 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 05:58:53 +0100 Subject: Boot camp slow In-Reply-To: <8A76F2D2-5B1C-4B28-943F-0DA09E448ABC@btinternet.com> References: <8495E0ED06064AACA5F14167AA60BCC9@6ffd52c138504d6> <19AD086D-806C-45E0-B8D3-9B140FD05D13@mac-access.net> <8A76F2D2-5B1C-4B28-943F-0DA09E448ABC@btinternet.com> Message-ID: <719151C3-23BF-46B4-BB5C-0D60A8C9A583@mac-access.net> Hi David Then it seems that Apple has updated Boot Camp as part of Lion which, although it makes sense, I confess I wasn't aware of. But I'm out of suggestions as I don't run BC here as I consider it a waste of space. To be honest I prefer to run Windows, on the rare occasions where I need to do so, as a virtual machine. I really see no point wasting 40GB and upwards on a partition whose contents I don't often use. But that's just me, perhaps you need Windows more than we do. But if your machine has the hardware to handle it, I would stick with the recommendation I gave you elsewhere before you even bought your Mac. Gordon On 30 Aug 2011, at 23:51, David Griffith wrote: David Griffith d.griffith at btinternet.com Checking my version of Boot Camp it says that it is version 4.0. Basically I think I am getting a white screen which lasts for about 2 -3 minutes then the screen goes dark and the boot into Windows begins. Researching this on Google I see that this may be a problem with copies of Windows 7 that are not properly activated. My copy is a legal copy of Windows 7 though. I installed it last week in VM Fusion and everything is now running fine there. As this is crippling the Mac OS Lion start up as well I may have to get rid of the boot camp partition. Are there any other suggestions before I the this drastic step? Regards David Griffith. On 30 Aug 2011, at 15:43, Gordon Smith wrote: > David > > The reason for this is most likely you're running Boot Camp 3 which isn't really compatible with Lion. You need Boot Camp 4, as I mentioned the other day on our sister list. > > Gordon > > > On 30 Aug 2011, at 11:51, David Griffith wrote: > > Dear list > > My first posting here. > I managed to install windows 7 on my I-Mac via boot camp yesterday with > sighted help. > However now booting into either Mac or windows Operating system takes an > age. I regret having lost the lovely fast start up time of the Mac. > I cannot see what is happening on the screen as it boots up. I actually > switched back to the Mac by going into the boot camp applet in control panel > in Windows 7. Despite this the boot up was still far longer than before. > Is there any way of stopping the boot up process being so slow? > Is it waiting for a key press on a screen I cannot see? > > Regards > > David Griffith > > > __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature > database 6420 (20110829) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. > > http://www.eset.com > > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- > > > ======================================= > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: > > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > Or: > > you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: > > > --------------------------------------- ======================================= The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group at either of the following websites: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html Or: you may also subscribe to this list via RSS. The feed is at: ---------------------------------------