From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 1 04:15:20 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2011 20:15:20 -0700 Subject: Transmac, I'm stumped! In-Reply-To: References: <4DBB6A49.3090908@internode.on.net> <5817680A-B41B-412D-A854-2060A4DE6FAD@gmail.com> Message-ID: Yeah I know. but I was thinking that feature would also not work with trans mac as i could not get it to do it even during the trial of 10 minutes lol! Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On Apr 30, 2011, at 1:21 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hi Sarah > > This has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Boot Camp. It's a Windows utility which you run under Microsoft Windows on a PC. > > On 30 Apr 2011, at 05:28, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > I know with the latest bootcamp update pasting to the mac drive was not possible. I'm hoping that that didn't also go to the mactrans update. > > Take care. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On Apr 29, 2011, at 6:47 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> Hi! >> >> Okay, just purchased the Transmac utility and I've been able to copy from a Mac drive however the standard shortcut combination of ctrl-C to copy files to the clipboard doesn't seem to work in transmac on my windows computer, I had to select all the files and use the "Copy to" command in the context menu and then select the directory on my Windows drive where I wanted the files copied, is this standard procedure? >> >> And now to the really odd thing, if I select files from a Windows directory to paste back to a folder on my Mac drive I can't seem to paste them and nore can I find an option for pasting in any of the context menus, what am I missing here? >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 1 04:18:39 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2011 20:18:39 -0700 Subject: Dane's Missing Message; [Sherlock, Where Are You When We Need You?] :-) In-Reply-To: <38207B2F-7363-42C5-9878-9B1195147347@mac-access.net> References: <9B1F29C9-F43B-45CC-9E2E-539C577ED886@internode.on.net> <4DBB6886.6020504@internode.on.net> <8F1E4368-1384-4105-9066-BE22E4196371@internode.on.net> <38207B2F-7363-42C5-9878-9B1195147347@mac-access.net> Message-ID: sorry. I was hungry. Hey I can't help it. I wanted to eat that message for a late snack. lol! anyway watch for a delayed message that might be sent to yoru inbox. I sent some messages earlier and I got a delayed message thing and it said it would try for 2 more days. We'll see if it gets sent. If not Ill resend but yeah. It's like the server is not responding some how or is timing out someware. Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On Apr 30, 2011, at 1:26 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 30 Apr 2011, at 17:02, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? Odd! because its in the sent folder here so who knows. > > I am not disputing you sent it and I'm definitely not accusing you of being a liar. Conversely, I am not in any way mis-informing you. We have both checked our mail folders and the server logs; that message did not arrive here. So somewhere it has been eaten. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sun May 1 22:15:57 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sun, 01 May 2011 16:15:57 -0500 Subject: SqueezeBox Problem; we finally found the cause! Message-ID: <201105012115.p41LFvPr049737@x.it.okstate.edu> I am glad you finally figured out the problem. I also attempted to answer the request for a ping, but I had accidentally set something wrong on the system and the attempt to reply bounced, just stupidity on my part but, by the time I discovered what happened, it was several hours later and I figured you had gotten other replies by then. "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > Well; just shows that we should have thought to look in the least likely > places after ruling out the obvious. Gordon decided that, since we'd > ruled out the possible it was time to start checking out the impossible. Yup. Sometimes when you hear thundering hoof beats, it is zebras, not horses. From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sun May 1 22:59:06 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sun, 01 May 2011 16:59:06 -0500 Subject: Dane's Missing Message; [Sherlock, Where Are You When We Need You?] :-) Message-ID: <201105012159.p41Lx6w1050002@x.it.okstate.edu> Most systems keep some sort of log that shows all mailer activity. The name and location of the log or logs varies from one system to another, but there is usually a log file that shows the tracks of every single message you sent out and every one you received. The log will usually have a time and date stamp on each entry and then you can read the sender's address and, if it failed to be received, a line stating why it was not received. One of the systems I am in charge of sends text messages to pagers or cellular phones when something goes wrong and on occasion, we have had people miss the message. One can look in the sendmail log and see if messages actually left the system at the time they should have or if nothing happened which means that the automation that sent the mail is broken. The mailer log will even note if somebody made a port-25 connection to your system and then dropped it without sending anything so these logs are handy if you can get them. Martin From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun May 1 23:04:08 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 08:04:08 +1000 Subject: Dane's Missing Message; [Sherlock, Where Are You When We Need You?] :-) In-Reply-To: <201105012159.p41Lx6w1050002@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105012159.p41Lx6w1050002@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Indeed, that's how I know the message is in my sent folder . On 02/05/2011, at 7:59 AM, Martin McCormick wrote: > Most systems keep some sort of log that shows all mailer > activity. The name and location of the log or logs varies from > one system to another, but there is usually a log file that > shows the tracks of every single message you sent out and every > one you received. > > The log will usually have a time and date stamp on each > entry and then you can read the sender's address and, if it > failed to be received, a line stating why it was not received. > > One of the systems I am in charge of sends text messages > to pagers or cellular phones when something goes wrong and on > occasion, we have had people miss the message. One can look in > the sendmail log and see if messages actually left the system at > the time they should have or if nothing happened which means > that the automation that sent the mail is broken. > > The mailer log will even note if somebody made a port-25 > connection to your system and then dropped it without sending > anything so these logs are handy if you can get them. > > Martin > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 2 11:56:13 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 11:56:13 +0100 Subject: Dane's Missing Message; [Sherlock, Where Are You When We Need You?] :-) In-Reply-To: <201105012159.p41Lx6w1050002@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105012159.p41Lx6w1050002@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <4D81EFAA-9CF2-459F-9A25-B07913B7440C@mac-access.net> Hello Martin As an experience system administrator of OSX Servers, Gordon knew precisely where to look to find the details of this problem. The fact is that the message just didn't arrive. I'm not saying it wasn't sent; it just didn't hit our server. But it's really a mute point now, much a-do about nothingh. :) On 1 May 2011, at 22:59, Martin McCormick wrote: Most systems keep some sort of log that shows all mailer activity. The name and location of the log or logs varies from one system to another, but there is usually a log file that shows the tracks of every single message you sent out and every one you received. From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 2 12:33:01 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 21:33:01 +1000 Subject: Google Web Browser is Accessible with NVDA Message-ID: Subject line says it all. Sorry, I can't remember the name of the Google Web Browser and I haven't tried it myself, information comes from someone I know on Twitter so thought I'd mention it as others may wish to give the Google Web Browser a test drive. I know little about it and don't know what's so special about it . From tsiegel at softcon.com Mon May 2 15:10:29 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 09:10:29 -0500 Subject: Google Web Browser is Accessible with NVDA In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1D504CB6-E57D-48E6-B36C-1873F733A132@softcon.com> The google web browser is called chrome. And, based on what I've seen on one of the apple mailing lists, they are working to make it vo compatible. Not sure they're going about it the right way, but we gotta give them points for trying anyhow. From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 2 17:48:41 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 17:48:41 +0100 Subject: Squeezebox Boom, Progress, at last Message-ID: Hello everybody Well; anybody who knows my husband Gordon off list will be aware probably that he is very difficult to satisfy sometimes in terms of the equipment he uses. This is particularly true when it comes to audio equipment; I can't tell you how many hi-fi, mini hi-fi and micro hi-fi systems we have tried and he's just not liked. Either the base is too bumpy, the treble is too harsh or the mid-range is too dull. Sometimes there is distortion, sometimes the speakers just sound too tinny. Whatever the problem, he just walks away, and we don't end up buying it. This afternoon, we finally got around to sitting down and having a good go at configuring the Squeezebox Boom using Sky FM as a source; we haven't yet found out how to play our own personal iTunes library and playlists; but that is going to be our next project with the Boom I think because then we could opt to listen to music or other content such as audio books. Anyway, we managed to get the box logged into our Sky FM Premium account which we opted to take out because it will fill a gap for us in terms of nigh time listening. Gordon finds it very difficult to get to sleep at night if the room is totally silent. Sometimes I have started reading books to him, sometimes it's just talking to him about absolutely anything. Sometimes it's a conversation between myself and our nurse Tracy and we just talk about anything and everything so that Gordon can listen to us and it eventually helps him get to sleep. Strange though that may sound, we have found that it's sometimes a cure for his insomnia. In my case, I can't get to sleep if there are lights flashing or shining within my visual range. So the fact that you can totally dim the display on the Boom is a plus. What I need to do is find out whether you can do this via a push button anywhere. Apart from the display the boom doesn't light up at all so that would be a help. Most hi-fi systems have flashing coloured lights all over the place and you can't dilluminate them. Hey; there's no such word as "Dilluminate", is there? :) Anyway as I've already told you, Gordon and I opted to take out a Sky FM Premium account so that we could have access to the music stuff which isn't available on the free pages. And we now have quite a few channels programmed into the favourites section of the box. I think you can even put channels into the presets by holding down a preset when the channel is playing; but that's another matter. OK, to the point. As I've already said, we got this working this afternoon and started playing a variety of channels ranging from classical, classical guitar, rock, smooth jazz, 80s, 70s and general oldies. The expression on Gordon's face when the Boom started playing told me what he thought of it. We have to admit that the sound that comes out of this little box is truly amazing, spectacular, stunning, fantastic. We have heard full-sized top of the range hi-fi systems which don't give you as good reproduction as the Boom does. The Logitech X-Y stereo technology is also totally stunning when you enable that. It makes the speakers sound as though they are far more widely spaced than they actually are, and even at high volumes there is none of the distortion to which most portable audio units are so vulnerable. Just one small gripe on the audio front. They should have angled the speakers instead of just using a classic "strait" design. That would have given you a far better stereo audio experience. In short, once these devices are configured, they are truly amazing machines. Our only slight criticism of the unit is that it's not battery-driven. The ability to use rechargeable batteries would have made it truly wireless. But that is only a small gripe. We have oodles of bandwidth on our network, as we have the box attached to a 100 M/Bit leased line. So we only choose the very highest quality streams and it really shows, the quality is stunning. Of course, the fact that the Boom is running on a wireless network gives it a bit of a bottleneck. Even on a wireless-N network you can only expect about 65 megabit out of it, rather than the full 100 megabit or, on modern interfaces, 1 gigabit on Ethernet. The boom is, I think, only a wireless-G compatible device so that reduces things still further. But it's adequate for the highest quality streams you're likely to find out there on the Internet. We will post again later with more comments on this because we still have a lot to say as we discover things and no, it won't all be praise, I'm sure. Lynne From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Mon May 2 19:49:41 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 02 May 2011 13:49:41 -0500 Subject: Squeezebox Boom, Progress, at last Message-ID: <201105021849.p42InfuT056564@x.it.okstate.edu> "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > Apart from the display the boom doesn't light up at all so that would be > a help. Most hi-fi systems have flashing coloured lights all over the > place and you can't dilluminate them. Hey; there's no such word as > "Dilluminate", is there? :) I guess you could say douse, extinguish or disable. Remember the color organs of the late sixties and early seventies? These were in keeping with psychedelic music but the idea was that you had colored lights behind a screen and each one was triggered by a different range of frequencies. Base might be red. Midrange could have been green and blue would have been all the highs but the display produced a shifting kaleidescope of color in step with the music. Some of the folks who were in to that were taking magic mushrooms and dropping acid so they could have the flashing displays and weird music as afunction of their own brain activity. I was just curious as to how they worked and found that a number of them used SCR's or Silicon Control Rectifiers to light the lamps in the display. You just wouldn't believe how many things now use those devices or a close relative of the SCR called a triac. They are really fun to play around with. Sorry to get so far off topic and glad to hear you have made great progress. From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 2 20:32:42 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 05:32:42 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox Boom, Progress, at last In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> What you said about the sound of the player didn't surprise me in the slightest , I've had my Squeezebox Boom playing for over a month now though there was a week there when I accidentally disconnected the thing from the "My Squeezebox.com" server and I couldn't work out what I'd done but that will never happen again due to changes I made and the fact that I usually set or control the Boom from my Iphone or Ipad these days. You'll have absolutely no trouble with streaming your own books, music, sound effects or whatever to the Boom though I strongly recommend using Ipeng for the Iphone or Ipad to set this up, just one hell of a lot easier. Yes, I'd like to see rechargeable batteries in this player, I believe the Touch has that system but in all events there's an unlikely "workaround", with an upgrade you can buy for Ipeng you can actually simulate a Squeezebox boom player on your Ipad. The only thing I've heard of recent times which sounds better than the Squeezebox Boom and of near same size is the Yamaha TSX-130 Desktop Hi-Fi system I have here, truly amazing but then again its one of those products where you truly "Get What You Pay For", on the Yamaha the speakers are angled and yep! that makes a real difference to stereo spacing. Both the Squeezebox Boom and Yamaha system use digital amplifiers so that pretty much explains the lack of distortion. Anyway glad you got it going, I know it was a but of a trial there and I know you were wondering whether it was all worth the while and I have to be honest, had other people who are visually impaired not put me onto the Squeezebox system then I would have been blissfully unaware of the thing, I'd seen Logitech Squeezebox systems mentioned but never given them a thought until I asked about an "Accessible Internet Radio". I'm saving to buy a Squeezebox Duet system, this system plugs into a Hi-Fi or Surround-Sound system using either an analogue or digital connection, I have quite a good Surround-Sound amp here so may as well make the best use of it I can . On 03/05/2011, at 2:48 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Well; anybody who knows my husband Gordon off list will be aware probably that he is very difficult to satisfy sometimes in terms of the equipment he uses. This is particularly true when it comes to audio equipment; I can't tell you how many hi-fi, mini hi-fi and micro hi-fi systems we have tried and he's just not liked. Either the base is too bumpy, the treble is too harsh or the mid-range is too dull. Sometimes there is distortion, sometimes the speakers just sound too tinny. Whatever the problem, he just walks away, and we don't end up buying it. > > This afternoon, we finally got around to sitting down and having a good go at configuring the Squeezebox Boom using Sky FM as a source; we haven't yet found out how to play our own personal iTunes library and playlists; but that is going to be our next project with the Boom I think because then we could opt to listen to music or other content such as audio books. > > Anyway, we managed to get the box logged into our Sky FM Premium account which we opted to take out because it will fill a gap for us in terms of nigh time listening. > > Gordon finds it very difficult to get to sleep at night if the room is totally silent. Sometimes I have started reading books to him, sometimes it's just talking to him about absolutely anything. Sometimes it's a conversation between myself and our nurse Tracy and we just talk about anything and everything so that Gordon can listen to us and it eventually helps him get to sleep. Strange though that may sound, we have found that it's sometimes a cure for his insomnia. > > In my case, I can't get to sleep if there are lights flashing or shining within my visual range. So the fact that you can totally dim the display on the Boom is a plus. What I need to do is find out whether you can do this via a push button anywhere. > > Apart from the display the boom doesn't light up at all so that would be a help. Most hi-fi systems have flashing coloured lights all over the place and you can't dilluminate them. Hey; there's no such word as "Dilluminate", is there? :) > > Anyway as I've already told you, Gordon and I opted to take out a Sky FM Premium account so that we could have access to the music stuff which isn't available on the free pages. And we now have quite a few channels programmed into the favourites section of the box. I think you can even put channels into the presets by holding down a preset when the channel is playing; but that's another matter. > > OK, to the point. As I've already said, we got this working this afternoon and started playing a variety of channels ranging from classical, classical guitar, rock, smooth jazz, 80s, 70s and general oldies. The expression on Gordon's face when the Boom started playing told me what he thought of it. We have to admit that the sound that comes out of this little box is truly amazing, spectacular, stunning, fantastic. We have heard full-sized top of the range hi-fi systems which don't give you as good reproduction as the Boom does. > > The Logitech X-Y stereo technology is also totally stunning when you enable that. It makes the speakers sound as though they are far more widely spaced than they actually are, and even at high volumes there is none of the distortion to which most portable audio units are so vulnerable. > > Just one small gripe on the audio front. They should have angled the speakers instead of just using a classic "strait" design. That would have given you a far better stereo audio experience. > > In short, once these devices are configured, they are truly amazing machines. Our only slight criticism of the unit is that it's not battery-driven. The ability to use rechargeable batteries would have made it truly wireless. But that is only a small gripe. > > We have oodles of bandwidth on our network, as we have the box attached to a 100 M/Bit leased line. So we only choose the very highest quality streams and it really shows, the quality is stunning. > > Of course, the fact that the Boom is running on a wireless network gives it a bit of a bottleneck. Even on a wireless-N network you can only expect about 65 megabit out of it, rather than the full 100 megabit or, on modern interfaces, 1 gigabit on Ethernet. > > The boom is, I think, only a wireless-G compatible device so that reduces things still further. But it's adequate for the highest quality streams you're likely to find out there on the Internet. > > We will post again later with more comments on this because we still have a lot to say as we discover things and no, it won't all be praise, I'm sure. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 2 22:57:53 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 03 May 2011 07:57:53 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox Boom, Progress, at last In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4DBF28E1.5060408@internode.on.net> Hi! Some additional comments about the Squeezebox system which I meant to make in my original reply to Lynne's message. There has only been one disappointment thus far with the system as far as I'm concerned and it is quite a disappointmnet in my view and that's the fact that the MP3 Tunes locker, web site and other software have some real accessibility issues and it would appear unfortunately - if the lack of response to my email requests to support is anything to go by - that the developers of MP3 Tunes are quite happy to let the service keep on being inaccessible, if we could access MP3 Tunes it would mean that we could stream our music collection - whatever format - to our Squeezebox players without the need of a server. I should point out that as I have at least 1 computer running all of the time round here its not such an issue to have MP3 Tunes but it still would have been nice to be able to sync my entire music library in a cloud for a cheaper rate and far more efficiently than is the case with my Dropbox arrangement. On 3/05/2011 2:48 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Well; anybody who knows my husband Gordon off list will be aware probably that he is very difficult to satisfy sometimes in terms of the equipment he uses. This is particularly true when it comes to audio equipment; I can't tell you how many hi-fi, mini hi-fi and micro hi-fi systems we have tried and he's just not liked. Either the base is too bumpy, the treble is too harsh or the mid-range is too dull. Sometimes there is distortion, sometimes the speakers just sound too tinny. Whatever the problem, he just walks away, and we don't end up buying it. > > This afternoon, we finally got around to sitting down and having a good go at configuring the Squeezebox Boom using Sky FM as a source; we haven't yet found out how to play our own personal iTunes library and playlists; but that is going to be our next project with the Boom I think because then we could opt to listen to music or other content such as audio books. > > Anyway, we managed to get the box logged into our Sky FM Premium account which we opted to take out because it will fill a gap for us in terms of nigh time listening. > > Gordon finds it very difficult to get to sleep at night if the room is totally silent. Sometimes I have started reading books to him, sometimes it's just talking to him about absolutely anything. Sometimes it's a conversation between myself and our nurse Tracy and we just talk about anything and everything so that Gordon can listen to us and it eventually helps him get to sleep. Strange though that may sound, we have found that it's sometimes a cure for his insomnia. > > In my case, I can't get to sleep if there are lights flashing or shining within my visual range. So the fact that you can totally dim the display on the Boom is a plus. What I need to do is find out whether you can do this via a push button anywhere. > > Apart from the display the boom doesn't light up at all so that would be a help. Most hi-fi systems have flashing coloured lights all over the place and you can't dilluminate them. Hey; there's no such word as "Dilluminate", is there? :) > > Anyway as I've already told you, Gordon and I opted to take out a Sky FM Premium account so that we could have access to the music stuff which isn't available on the free pages. And we now have quite a few channels programmed into the favourites section of the box. I think you can even put channels into the presets by holding down a preset when the channel is playing; but that's another matter. > > OK, to the point. As I've already said, we got this working this afternoon and started playing a variety of channels ranging from classical, classical guitar, rock, smooth jazz, 80s, 70s and general oldies. The expression on Gordon's face when the Boom started playing told me what he thought of it. We have to admit that the sound that comes out of this little box is truly amazing, spectacular, stunning, fantastic. We have heard full-sized top of the range hi-fi systems which don't give you as good reproduction as the Boom does. > > The Logitech X-Y stereo technology is also totally stunning when you enable that. It makes the speakers sound as though they are far more widely spaced than they actually are, and even at high volumes there is none of the distortion to which most portable audio units are so vulnerable. > > Just one small gripe on the audio front. They should have angled the speakers instead of just using a classic "strait" design. That would have given you a far better stereo audio experience. > > In short, once these devices are configured, they are truly amazing machines. Our only slight criticism of the unit is that it's not battery-driven. The ability to use rechargeable batteries would have made it truly wireless. But that is only a small gripe. > > We have oodles of bandwidth on our network, as we have the box attached to a 100 M/Bit leased line. So we only choose the very highest quality streams and it really shows, the quality is stunning. > > Of course, the fact that the Boom is running on a wireless network gives it a bit of a bottleneck. Even on a wireless-N network you can only expect about 65 megabit out of it, rather than the full 100 megabit or, on modern interfaces, 1 gigabit on Ethernet. > > The boom is, I think, only a wireless-G compatible device so that reduces things still further. But it's adequate for the highest quality streams you're likely to find out there on the Internet. > > We will post again later with more comments on this because we still have a lot to say as we discover things and no, it won't all be praise, I'm sure. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 3 06:21:01 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 22:21:01 -0700 Subject: Researchers use disk fragmentation to hide data Message-ID: <44A4590E-CA40-4FBB-ACFE-0E725C83A731@gmail.com> Researchers use disk fragmentation to hide data Researchers from two universities have developed an algorithm that uses disk fragmentation to hide data on a clustered file system. http://bit.ly/jxp2OD From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 3 13:28:26 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 13:28:26 +0100 Subject: Squeezebox Boom, Progress, at last In-Reply-To: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 2 May 2011, at 20:32, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? What you said about the sound of the player didn't surprise me in the slightest , I've had my Squeezebox Boom playing for over a month now though there was a week there when I accidentally disconnected the thing from the "My Squeezebox.com" server and I couldn't work out what I'd done but that will never happen again due to changes I made and the fact that I usually set or control the Boom from my Iphone or Ipad these days. When Gordon makes comments like that, I take them pretty much literally. He's very very critical sometimes of equipment and software if it doesn't do what the manufacturer claims it does. ? You'll have absolutely no trouble with streaming your own books, music, sound effects or whatever to the Boom though I strongly recommend using Ipeng for the Iphone or Ipad to set this up, just one hell of a lot easier. To be honest Dane, I don't want to go too far down the iOS range otherwise we might just as well play the things on the iPad and be done with it. ? Yes, I'd like to see rechargeable batteries in this player, I believe the Touch has that system but in all events there's an unlikely "workaround", with an upgrade you can buy for Ipeng you can actually simulate a Squeezebox boom player on your Ipad. I won't ever say never; but I doubt very much we'll be buying another player. We simply don't need one and if we can get the Boom to do what we want then that's the end of the story. I'm pretty confident now that will happen. ? The only thing I've heard of recent times which sounds better than the Squeezebox Boom and of near same size is the Yamaha TSX-130 Desktop Hi-Fi system I have here, truly amazing but then again its one of those products where you truly "Get What You Pay For", on the Yamaha the speakers are angled and yep! that makes a real difference to stereo spacing. Of course it does, that's common sense really. But we couldn't justify the outlay on one of those things given that we spend so little time up there nowadays. We only want the player for late night use, mainly to help Gordon get to sleep. ? Both the Squeezebox Boom and Yamaha system use digital amplifiers so that pretty much explains the lack of distortion. From what I've read many of those items do that now. ? Anyway glad you got it going, I know it was a but of a trial there and I know you were wondering whether it was all worth the while and I have to be honest, had other people who are visually impaired not put me onto the Squeezebox system then I would have been blissfully unaware of the thing, I'd seen Logitech Squeezebox systems mentioned but never given them a thought until I asked about an "Accessible Internet Radio". I am currently talking with Logitech by email about accessibility but they seem blissfully ignorant. They also seem very unwilling to consider the needs of the few, outweighed, I suppose by the needs of the many. ? I'm saving to buy a Squeezebox Duet system, this system plugs into a Hi-Fi or Surround-Sound system using either an analogue or digital connection, I have quite a good Surround-Sound amp here so may as well make the best use of it I can . Not something we need. We don't just "Collect" items like that and the Boom will do what we want. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 3 14:02:32 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 14:02:32 +0100 Subject: Sound Cloud In-Reply-To: <4DBF28E1.5060408@internode.on.net> References: <4DBF28E1.5060408@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Hello Dane & all On 2 May 2011, at 22:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? There has only been one disappointment thus far with the system as far as I'm concerned and it is quite a disappointmnet in my view and that's the fact that the MP3 Tunes locker, web site and other software have some real accessibility issues and it would appear unfortunately - if the lack of response to my email requests to support is anything to go by - that the developers of MP3 Tunes are quite happy to let the service keep on being inaccessible, if we could access MP3 Tunes it would mean that we could stream our music collection - whatever format - to our Squeezebox players without the need of a server. But hang on Dane; you stated on our sister list, unless I'm mistaken, that MP3Tunes.com is accessible. Don't you remember; when you said that people didn't bother reading your post? :) We have tried the website and what I saw made me believe that accessibility would indeed be an issue; so I opted not to invest money in that cloud project just now. I think a lot of things are now making use of cloud technologies and although I see a lot of potential, security bothers me quite a lot. Drop Box, for instance, isn't as secure as people would have you believe it is. And I am frankly amazed that Drop Box themselves have made claims of total security when, in fact, that is not the case. Even the transfers via their websites and links you give people to files are not secure. They use http, rather than https for their websites and although I'm not a technology expert even I appreciate the differences between the two standards. ? I should point out that as I have at least 1 computer running all of the time round here its not such an issue to have MP3 Tunes but it still would have been nice to be able to sync my entire music library in a cloud for a cheaper rate and far more efficiently than is the case with my Dropbox arrangement. I'm puzzled to be honest as how Drop BBox is of much benefit in this regard. yes; you can download your stuff, that's true. But unless I'm missing something you can't sync your music that way. Not using your Squeezebox anyway. On that last point I must be a little stupid I think because I am not seeing any way to import our collection into the Squeezebox. I have the connection to our running server, but no content shows up in the My music. Lynne From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Tue May 3 14:08:58 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Tue, 03 May 2011 08:08:58 -0500 Subject: Squeezebox Boom Another question and an Observation Message-ID: <201105031308.p43D8wAI061026@x.it.okstate.edu> What happens if the squeezebox.com server should ever go down? Things happen. Companies go out of business just like they come in to business. This is one of the issues that has always bothered me about everything needing to be connected to everything all the time to work. Does any part of that system still work if the main server is down? I guess that's the amateur radio operator in me, knowing that the dark forces of entropy are always out there gnawing at the most beautiful of things. Several years ago, I got really enthusiastic about NFS or network file system and even mounted a huge archive server's file system in another part of the country on our main Sun work station. What I got after the first few days of elation was a system that crashed every time anything crashed between here and there. Nowadays, I am more conservative about things like that and try to build every system we use to do as much as it can standing alone so that the network becomes the icing on the cake rather than the life blood. From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 3 14:52:30 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 14:52:30 +0100 Subject: Squeezebox Boom Another question and an Observation In-Reply-To: <201105031308.p43D8wAI061026@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105031308.p43D8wAI061026@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Hello Martin Whilst I think it unlikely, the same possibility had occurred to me. Logitech is a big company, however, and I think it's unlikely in this case. However, there is software available which allows you to connect the box to a server on your own machine. So you don't always have to rely on the cloud service. Lynne On 3 May 2011, at 14:08, Martin McCormick wrote: What happens if the squeezebox.com server should ever go down? Things happen. Companies go out of business just like they come in to business. This is one of the issues that has always bothered me about everything needing to be connected to everything all the time to work. Does any part of that system still work if the main server is down? I guess that's the amateur radio operator in me, knowing that the dark forces of entropy are always out there gnawing at the most beautiful of things. Several years ago, I got really enthusiastic about NFS or network file system and even mounted a huge archive server's file system in another part of the country on our main Sun work station. What I got after the first few days of elation was a system that crashed every time anything crashed between here and there. Nowadays, I am more conservative about things like that and try to build every system we use to do as much as it can standing alone so that the network becomes the icing on the cake rather than the life blood. _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Tue May 3 16:00:23 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Tue, 03 May 2011 10:00:23 -0500 Subject: Squeezebox Boom Another question and an Observation Message-ID: <201105031500.p43F0Nxw061789@x.it.okstate.edu> That is a good thing. "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" writes: > Whilst I think it unlikely, the same possibility had occurred to me. > Logitech is a big company, however, and I think it's unlikely in this > case. > > However, there is software available which allows you to connect the box > to a server on your own machine. So you don't always have to rely on the > cloud service. That is very good. When it comes to technology, one should always have Plan B, C, etc. From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 3 17:30:39 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 02:30:39 +1000 Subject: Controling from Tablet was Squeezebox Boom In-Reply-To: <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> I'mm scratching my head here somewhat when you talk of Iphones and Ipads in conjunction with Squeezebox systems, using Iphones or Ipads to control devices is common practise these days and that's why apps to do these functions were designed as they not only privde the remote control functionality but they provide bigger screens in the case of the Ipad to interact with whatever is being controlled and in the case of the Iphone the remote control apps provide far more convenience and functionality than an infra red remote controller could ever hope to achieve. If you want further proof of the trend then look around at the various luxury car models which are being sold now, Hiundai I think it is actually give the buyer of one of their luxury car models an Ipad, this is used to control the cars systems with though it would be next to useless surely when driving along . Everything about the car is controlled from the Ipad including the user guide I believe and this has some obvious disadvantages. Look at the latest television and multi media systems for a home where an Ipad or similar Android tablet is a central remote controller and interactive part, the latest Denon surround-sound receiver also can use an Iphone or Ipad for its controller so the user can see the status of the receiver not only on the TV screen should they want to bbut also on the Iphone etc.. On 3/05/2011 10:28 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 2 May 2011, at 20:32, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? What you said about the sound of the player didn't surprise me in the slightest, I've had my Squeezebox Boom playing for over a month now though there was a week there when I accidentally disconnected the thing from the "My Squeezebox.com" server and I couldn't work out what I'd done but that will never happen again due to changes I made and the fact that I usually set or control the Boom from my Iphone or Ipad these days. > > When Gordon makes comments like that, I take them pretty much literally. He's very very critical sometimes of equipment and software if it doesn't do what the manufacturer claims it does. > > ? You'll have absolutely no trouble with streaming your own books, music, sound effects or whatever to the Boom though I strongly recommend using Ipeng for the Iphone or Ipad to set this up, just one hell of a lot easier. > > To be honest Dane, I don't want to go too far down the iOS range otherwise we might just as well play the things on the iPad and be done with it. > > ? Yes, I'd like to see rechargeable batteries in this player, I believe the Touch has that system but in all events there's an unlikely "workaround", with an upgrade you can buy for Ipeng you can actually simulate a Squeezebox boom player on your Ipad. > > I won't ever say never; but I doubt very much we'll be buying another player. We simply don't need one and if we can get the Boom to do what we want then that's the end of the story. I'm pretty confident now that will happen. > > ? The only thing I've heard of recent times which sounds better than the Squeezebox Boom and of near same size is the Yamaha TSX-130 Desktop Hi-Fi system I have here, truly amazing but then again its one of those products where you truly "Get What You Pay For", on the Yamaha the speakers are angled and yep! that makes a real difference to stereo spacing. > > Of course it does, that's common sense really. But we couldn't justify the outlay on one of those things given that we spend so little time up there nowadays. We only want the player for late night use, mainly to help Gordon get to sleep. > > ? Both the Squeezebox Boom and Yamaha system use digital amplifiers so that pretty much explains the lack of distortion. > > From what I've read many of those items do that now. > > ? Anyway glad you got it going, I know it was a but of a trial there and I know you were wondering whether it was all worth the while and I have to be honest, had other people who are visually impaired not put me onto the Squeezebox system then I would have been blissfully unaware of the thing, I'd seen Logitech Squeezebox systems mentioned but never given them a thought until I asked about an "Accessible Internet Radio". > > I am currently talking with Logitech by email about accessibility but they seem blissfully ignorant. They also seem very unwilling to consider the needs of the few, outweighed, I suppose by the needs of the many. > > ? I'm saving to buy a Squeezebox Duet system, this system plugs into a Hi-Fi or Surround-Sound system using either an analogue or digital connection, I have quite a good Surround-Sound amp here so may as well make the best use of it I can. > > Not something we need. We don't just "Collect" items like that and the Boom will do what we want. > > Lynne > > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 3 17:32:34 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 02:32:34 +1000 Subject: Sound Cloud In-Reply-To: References: <4DBF28E1.5060408@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <4DC02E22.10502@internode.on.net> Yep I did state that and I did state that I could upload files to the site though it was a struggle and that improvements could be made. I also stated that the software for the system was amongst the most inaccessible software I'd ever seen. On 3/05/2011 11:02 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane& all > > On 2 May 2011, at 22:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? There has only been one disappointment thus far with the system as far as I'm concerned and it is quite a disappointmnet in my view and that's the fact that the MP3 Tunes locker, web site and other software have some real accessibility issues and it would appear unfortunately - if the lack of response to my email requests to support is anything to go by - that the developers of MP3 Tunes are quite happy to let the service keep on being inaccessible, if we could access MP3 Tunes it would mean that we could stream our music collection - whatever format - to our Squeezebox players without the need of a server. > > But hang on Dane; you stated on our sister list, unless I'm mistaken, that MP3Tunes.com is accessible. Don't you remember; when you said that people didn't bother reading your post? :) > > We have tried the website and what I saw made me believe that accessibility would indeed be an issue; so I opted not to invest money in that cloud project just now. > > I think a lot of things are now making use of cloud technologies and although I see a lot of potential, security bothers me quite a lot. Drop Box, for instance, isn't as secure as people would have you believe it is. And I am frankly amazed that Drop Box themselves have made claims of total security when, in fact, that is not the case. > > Even the transfers via their websites and links you give people to files are not secure. They use http, rather than https for their websites and although I'm not a technology expert even I appreciate the differences between the two standards. > > ? I should point out that as I have at least 1 computer running all of the time round here its not such an issue to have MP3 Tunes but it still would have been nice to be able to sync my entire music library in a cloud for a cheaper rate and far more efficiently than is the case with my Dropbox arrangement. > > I'm puzzled to be honest as how Drop BBox is of much benefit in this regard. yes; you can download your stuff, that's true. But unless I'm missing something you can't sync your music that way. Not using your Squeezebox anyway. On that last point I must be a little stupid I think because I am not seeing any way to import our collection into the Squeezebox. I have the connection to our running server, but no content shows up in the My music. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 3 17:35:35 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 02:35:35 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox Boom Another question and an Observation In-Reply-To: <201105031308.p43D8wAI061026@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105031308.p43D8wAI061026@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <4DC02ED7.6030103@internode.on.net> You have two options, you use what's in the memory of the player or you use the Squeezebox Server on your PC, Mac, Ipad etc. Yep, company's go broke but that's a chance you take with anything you buy, what happens of General Motors go broke? That's the possible end of car parts for your car and that nearly happened a couple of years ago. Thankfully there are a lot of developers out there working on the Squeezebox platform which you can see for yourself on the various forums you find at On 3/05/2011 11:08 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: > What happens if the squeezebox.com server should ever go down? > Things happen. Companies go out of business just like they come > in to business. This is one of the issues that has always > bothered me about everything needing to be connected to > everything all the time to work. > > Does any part of that system still work if the main server is > down? > > I guess that's the amateur radio operator in me, knowing > that the dark forces of entropy are always out there gnawing at > the most beautiful of things. > > Several years ago, I got really enthusiastic about NFS > or network file system and even mounted a huge archive server's > file system in another part of the country on our main Sun work > station. > > What I got after the first few days of elation was a > system that crashed every time anything crashed between here and > there. > > Nowadays, I am more conservative about things like that > and try to build every system we use to do as much as it can > standing alone so that the network becomes the icing on the cake > rather than the life blood. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 3 20:51:00 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 12:51:00 -0700 Subject: Need online storage, but Dropbox isn't quite cutting it? Wuala's got great deals and lots of space: Message-ID: <7C1F2BCD-6145-4302-843C-85456F348461@gmail.com> This sounds neat. I have not tried it yet though. http://lifehac.kr/lgNuUz From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Tue May 3 22:03:40 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Tue, 03 May 2011 16:03:40 -0500 Subject: Sound Cloud, Squeezebox Connectivity Message-ID: <201105032103.p43L3efw064030@x.it.okstate.edu> It sounds like the Squeezebox is well done and the fact that you can run server software locally makes me think the designers did a good job. I have been thinking about all this because our town recently signed on to receive service from an ambulance provider whose main office and dispatch center is in Texarkana, Texas, about 500 Miles to our Southeast. They use a system which is becoming more and more common these days called an Internet base. It is a two-way radio transceiver connected to an interface that has an Ethernet port on the network side and then emulates a local telephone line two-way radio control link on the radio side of the box. At the remote end, there is a remote console made to fit the two-way radio transceiver being used. It is connected to another box which has what works like a telephone-type control line facing the console and then an Ethernet port connected to the Internet on the network side. The dispatcher uses the radio as if she or he were right here and the sound is as good as a local connection, actually better than many because real telephone line links often sound like garbage! Anyway, I was thinking that this is all good but what if there is Armageddon, some day, and the Internet goes away for a while. Fortunately, there is a local radio link to our emergency services such as police and fire so that the actual ambulances that, of course, are right here, can be dispatched by the police and fire departments, if necessary. Until last Sunday and for the past 15 or 25 years, if anybody needed an ambulance, the 911 emergency dispatcher would simply relay the call to the fire department who ran the ambulances here. The service was good and all para medics were certified, but it was expensive and the ambulances needed to frequently go in to surrounding towns on calls because we are talking about towns that are very tiny and don't necessarily even have a police department much less any kind of ambulance service. In states like Oklahoma, rural ambulance service is a continuing thorny issue because nobody really wants to provide it. There are lots of empty miles with very few subscribers so the hard choice is to charge an arm and a leg, no pun really intended, for each call or loose money. It looks like this new system may work out well for this region as the ambulance district covers Stillwater plus all the little towns in the immediate area. I am glad they have the extra radio contact with the fire department and 911 center because if the Internet went away, they would just go back to the old system until the Internet was restored. As I said earlier, the Internet is wonderful and allows us to do and have services we never had before, but to think it can't go away is unimaginable. The American Radio Relay League adopted the slogan "when all else fails" to explain why amateur radio is necessary. When we have had large disasters, be they natural or man-made, the Internet and cellular telephone services are the first to go down and the last to return. This is due to actual destruction of facilities and also to the overloading of networks when an unusual number of people are on the phone/Internet at once. The Internet is even carrying more and more telephone traffic so the two are slowly merging in to one service. In case you wonder, this new service costs each household $5.00 or around 3 Pounds extra per month. You can not subscribe, but if you should ever get sick or hurt, it will cost several hundred Dollars more than if you ever needed the service and were subscribed. Nobody likes to pay more for anything, but the system seems fair enough so I guess this is our new normal, here. From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 3 22:43:14 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 14:43:14 -0700 Subject: Sound Cloud, Squeezebox Connectivity In-Reply-To: <201105032103.p43L3efw064030@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105032103.p43L3efw064030@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <5A439B75-EFE6-4E8A-85C8-8788D344DB91@gmail.com> OH wow that sound very interesting. you are re right about ham radio. I hope to get a radio this year from a dealer i know personally in LA and someone in another place hopefully will guide me through it lol! Now lets hope there is programing software accessible to what ever platform I'm using. wink. Take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 3, 2011, at 2:03 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: > It sounds like the Squeezebox is well done and the fact > that you can run server software locally makes me think the > designers did a good job. > > I have been thinking about all this because our town > recently signed on to receive service from an ambulance provider > whose main office and dispatch center is in Texarkana, Texas, > about 500 Miles to our Southeast. > > They use a system which is becoming more and more common > these days called an Internet base. It is a two-way radio > transceiver connected to an interface that has an Ethernet port > on the network side and then emulates a local telephone line > two-way radio control link on the radio side of the box. > > At the remote end, there is a remote console made to fit > the two-way radio transceiver being used. It is connected to > another box which has what works like a telephone-type control > line facing the console and then an Ethernet port connected to > the Internet on the network side. > > The dispatcher uses the radio as if she or he were right > here and the sound is as good as a local connection, actually > better than many because real telephone line links often sound > like garbage! > > Anyway, I was thinking that this is all good but what if > there is Armageddon, some day, and the Internet goes away for a > while. > > Fortunately, there is a local radio link to our > emergency services such as police and fire so that the actual > ambulances that, of course, are right here, can be dispatched by > the police and fire departments, if necessary. > > Until last Sunday and for the past 15 or 25 years, > if anybody needed an ambulance, the 911 emergency dispatcher > would simply relay the call to the fire department who ran the > ambulances here. > > The service was good and all para medics were certified, > but it was expensive and the ambulances needed to frequently go > in to surrounding towns on calls because we are talking about > towns that are very tiny and don't necessarily even have a > police department much less any kind of ambulance service. > > In states like Oklahoma, rural ambulance service is a > continuing thorny issue because nobody really wants to provide > it. There are lots of empty miles with very few subscribers so > the hard choice is to charge an arm and a leg, no pun really > intended, for each call or loose money. > > It looks like this new system may work out well for this > region as the ambulance district covers Stillwater plus all the > little towns in the immediate area. > > I am glad they have the extra radio contact with the > fire department and 911 center because if the Internet went > away, they would just go back to the old system until the > Internet was restored. > > As I said earlier, the Internet is wonderful and allows > us to do and have services we never had before, but to think it > can't go away is unimaginable. > > The American Radio Relay League adopted the slogan "when > all else fails" to explain why amateur radio is necessary. > > When we have had large disasters, be they natural or > man-made, the Internet and cellular telephone services are the > first to go down and the last to return. This is due to actual > destruction of facilities and also to the overloading of > networks when an unusual number of people are on the > phone/Internet at once. The Internet is even carrying more and > more telephone traffic so the two are slowly merging in to one > service. > > In case you wonder, this new service costs each > household $5.00 or around 3 Pounds extra per month. You can not > subscribe, but if you should ever get sick or hurt, it will cost > several hundred Dollars more than if you ever needed the service > and were subscribed. > > Nobody likes to pay more for anything, but the system > seems fair enough so I guess this is our new normal, here. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 01:53:32 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 10:53:32 +1000 Subject: Accessibility on mp3tunes.com Message-ID: <5DA861EA-FFE2-4215-9906-56618D940E2F@internode.on.net> Howdy! Just received a reply from the support people at mp3tunes.com regarding accessibility of their site and software. The support people both apologised for the inconvenience caused to the inaccessible nature of their site and software and said they would see what they could do about these problems in the coming days so that at least is hopeful, I'll keep you up to date with developments if they're are any but it shows yet again what a previous poster said is absolutely true, spare a couple of minutes and you can make a world of difference . From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 4 02:43:35 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 02:43:35 +0100 Subject: Controling from Tablet was Squeezebox Boom In-Reply-To: <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <24A49162-3667-4978-87A6-CDA514DF3442@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 3 May 2011, at 17:30, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? I'mm scratching my head here somewhat when you talk of Iphones and Ipads in conjunction with Squeezebox systems, using Iphones or Ipads to control devices is common practise these days and that's why apps to do these functions were designed as they not only privde the remote control functionality but they provide bigger screens in the case of the Ipad to interact with whatever is being controlled and in the case of the Iphone the remote control apps provide far more convenience and functionality than an infra red remote controller could ever hope to achieve. It isn't so much the remote control that I don't see the point of; I do take the point that accessibility, for one thing, is available when you do the controlling like this. My issue is more to do with the player itself. Why buy a Squeezebox and then play the audio via an iPhone which, as you've said yourself, produces far inferior quality audio? Granted, it might give you Internet radio; but again there are native iPhone apps which may give you that. I'm not going to get into the issue of cars, because it's not really relevant to this specific scenario. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 4 02:47:32 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 02:47:32 +0100 Subject: Need online storage, but Dropbox isn't quite cutting it? Wuala's got great deals and lots of space: In-Reply-To: <7C1F2BCD-6145-4302-843C-85456F348461@gmail.com> References: <7C1F2BCD-6145-4302-843C-85456F348461@gmail.com> Message-ID: <30577A9C-64CE-40E8-AC0D-2AB9F1762CCE@mac-access.net> Hello Sarah On 3 May 2011, at 20:51, Sarah Alawami wrote: This sounds neat. I have not tried it yet though. Do you ever sleep at all? :) Just joking here, please don't take it in any way personally. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 03:30:38 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 12:30:38 +1000 Subject: Controling from Tablet was Squeezebox Boom In-Reply-To: <24A49162-3667-4978-87A6-CDA514DF3442@mac-access.net> References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> <24A49162-3667-4978-87A6-CDA514DF3442@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DC0BA4E.7060806@internode.on.net> Pardon me, who said anything about playing squeezebox through Ipad or Iphone? Yep you could do that but for the purpose of this discussion we're talking about controlling and that's it. On 4/05/2011 11:43 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 3 May 2011, at 17:30, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? I'mm scratching my head here somewhat when you talk of Iphones and Ipads in conjunction with Squeezebox systems, using Iphones or Ipads to control devices is common practise these days and that's why apps to do these functions were designed as they not only privde the remote control functionality but they provide bigger screens in the case of the Ipad to interact with whatever is being controlled and in the case of the Iphone the remote control apps provide far more convenience and functionality than an infra red remote controller could ever hope to achieve. > > It isn't so much the remote control that I don't see the point of; I do take the point that accessibility, for one thing, is available when you do the controlling like this. My issue is more to do with the player itself. Why buy a Squeezebox and then play the audio via an iPhone which, as you've said yourself, produces far inferior quality audio? > > Granted, it might give you Internet radio; but again there are native iPhone apps which may give you that. > > I'm not going to get into the issue of cars, because it's not really relevant to this specific scenario. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 03:46:27 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 12:46:27 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox System and Ipeng, another installment Message-ID: <4DC0BE03.9060800@internode.on.net> Hi! For those using the Ipeng app to control your Squeezebox players and system you'll be interested to know that you can buy an additional plugin for Ipeng which allows your Iphone or Ipad to become a simulated Squeezebox Player. So why would you bother buying this additional plugin? I've found it handy for testing, for example I can be listening to one source on my Squeezebox Boom player whilst I can be setting up and testing another source to see how it looks or get an idea of how it will sound through my Ipad, the additional plugin is $05.00 but there's a catch, in order to use this plugin you must have the Squeezebox server running on one of your computers connected to a network, though the network doesn't matter so long as you tell Ipeng where the server is, the additional player plugin can't use the Logitech Mysqueezebox.com server due to copyright limitations and I'm lead to understand that negotiations are in progress between the Ipeng developers and Logitech at this time to remove this restriction. Anyway most of the settings you can access through say a Squeezebox Boom you can access for your Ipad Player, alarm clock, audio settings and so on. From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 4 04:04:30 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 04:04:30 +0100 Subject: Controling from Tablet was Squeezebox Boom In-Reply-To: <4DC0BA4E.7060806@internode.on.net> References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> <24A49162-3667-4978-87A6-CDA514DF3442@mac-access.net> <4DC0BA4E.7060806@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Hello Dane On 4 May 2011, at 03:30, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Pardon me, who said anything about playing squeezebox through Ipad or Iphone? Yep you could do that but for the purpose of this discussion we're talking about controlling and that's it. You did! In your original message on this thread you referred to the upgrade in-app of the iPad Squeezebox player. Lynne On 4/05/2011 11:43 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 3 May 2011, at 17:30, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? I'mm scratching my head here somewhat when you talk of Iphones and Ipads in conjunction with Squeezebox systems, using Iphones or Ipads to control devices is common practise these days and that's why apps to do these functions were designed as they not only privde the remote control functionality but they provide bigger screens in the case of the Ipad to interact with whatever is being controlled and in the case of the Iphone the remote control apps provide far more convenience and functionality than an infra red remote controller could ever hope to achieve. > > It isn't so much the remote control that I don't see the point of; I do take the point that accessibility, for one thing, is available when you do the controlling like this. My issue is more to do with the player itself. Why buy a Squeezebox and then play the audio via an iPhone which, as you've said yourself, produces far inferior quality audio? > > Granted, it might give you Internet radio; but again there are native iPhone apps which may give you that. > > I'm not going to get into the issue of cars, because it's not really relevant to this specific scenario. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 04:05:56 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 13:05:56 +1000 Subject: Controling from Tablet was Squeezebox Boom In-Reply-To: References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> <24A49162-3667-4978-87A6-CDA514DF3442@mac-access.net> <4DC0BA4E.7060806@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <4DC0C294.9070100@internode.on.net> Yes, the ability to play audio is there but in an upgrade so therefore we're talking about the standard controlling functions and only you mentioned the audio again. On 4/05/2011 1:04 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 4 May 2011, at 03:30, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? Pardon me, who said anything about playing squeezebox through Ipad or Iphone? Yep you could do that but for the purpose of this discussion we're talking about controlling and that's it. > > You did! In your original message on this thread you referred to the upgrade in-app of the iPad Squeezebox player. > > Lynne > > > > On 4/05/2011 11:43 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hello Dane >> >> On 3 May 2011, at 17:30, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >> ? I'mm scratching my head here somewhat when you talk of Iphones and Ipads in conjunction with Squeezebox systems, using Iphones or Ipads to control devices is common practise these days and that's why apps to do these functions were designed as they not only privde the remote control functionality but they provide bigger screens in the case of the Ipad to interact with whatever is being controlled and in the case of the Iphone the remote control apps provide far more convenience and functionality than an infra red remote controller could ever hope to achieve. >> >> It isn't so much the remote control that I don't see the point of; I do take the point that accessibility, for one thing, is available when you do the controlling like this. My issue is more to do with the player itself. Why buy a Squeezebox and then play the audio via an iPhone which, as you've said yourself, produces far inferior quality audio? >> >> Granted, it might give you Internet radio; but again there are native iPhone apps which may give you that. >> >> I'm not going to get into the issue of cars, because it's not really relevant to this specific scenario. >> >> Lynne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 4 05:24:12 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 05:24:12 +0100 Subject: Controling from Tablet was Squeezebox Boom In-Reply-To: <4DC0C294.9070100@internode.on.net> References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> <24A49162-3667-4978-87A6-CDA514DF3442@mac-access.net> <4DC0BA4E.7060806@internode.on.net> <4DC0C294.9070100@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <0F2EE199-8190-440E-8AF0-3956D2B3DF4D@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 4 May 2011, at 04:05, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Yes, the ability to play audio is there but in an upgrade so therefore we're talking about the standard controlling functions and only you mentioned the audio again. Wel now; there's a contradiction if ever I saw one! :) In terms of a remote control, I guess if it gives you accessibility then yes; it has to be a good thing. No dispute there. If you have no player connected to your network, however, how do you then get full control of the player? Surely you have to still have visual assistance to configure the box in the first place, do you not? But ok, let's talk about iPeng specifically and, whoever dragged audio playback into the discussion let's keep it on the level of the remote control aspect. Although I think it might be better off list. I don't have the iPad in front of me; but I didn't see the player settings part of the control when I last looked at it. Granted though it wasn't a very detailed look, I was just trying to make sure the app would run. What would also be nice I think is a desktop machine remote control for Squeezebox so that you could drive it from a Mac or a PC. I'm speaking here from the perspective of a blind person. For me personally I can just use the on-screen display but yes, I do see the point of the actual remote, when I think about it properly. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 4 05:56:10 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 05:56:10 +0100 Subject: Endingh Discusson on Squeezebox Message-ID: <4BA43DF8-C4CB-4B4A-9BA2-0368467ED99D@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Judging by Dane's Twitter entry which some may have seen, he apparently believes that I am "Whining" about the Squeezebox remote control. Fine; I'll terminate the discussion and keep my views to myself. Oh and just one more correction I feel I should make to Dane's Twitter entry. I am not a "Blind Person whining". Anyway this subject is now closed as far as I'm concerned. I'm sorry if others take the same view as Dane apparently does. I will be more careful about expressing my views in the future. Lynne From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed May 4 06:09:19 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 22:09:19 -0700 Subject: Free Android tethering apps blocked by most carriers Message-ID: Free Android tethering apps blocked by most carriers Verizon Wireless, AT&T and T-Mobile are reportedly blocking access to free phone tethering apps on their wireless networks. http://bit.ly/ijtmQH From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed May 4 06:13:00 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 22:13:00 -0700 Subject: Seagate breaks 1TB per platter barrier Message-ID: Seagate breaks 1TB per platter barrier Seagate said it has broken a previous areal density benchmark with a drive line that can hold up to 1TB of data per platter. http://bit.ly/iqe3nh From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 07:19:42 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 16:19:42 +1000 Subject: Controling from Tablet was Squeezebox Boom In-Reply-To: <0F2EE199-8190-440E-8AF0-3956D2B3DF4D@mac-access.net> References: <9AF2FD7E-4584-4A0A-B0D5-011C21F565B0@internode.on.net> <3EB35D38-8F59-4D67-9969-0E2DE49E0AC8@mac-access.net> <4DC02DAF.7020705@internode.on.net> <24A49162-3667-4978-87A6-CDA514DF3442@mac-access.net> <4DC0BA4E.7060806@internode.on.net> <4DC0C294.9070100@internode.on.net> <0F2EE199-8190-440E-8AF0-3956D2B3DF4D@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <032AF127-C741-49EA-A2EA-F8849672EADB@internode.on.net> only because you made it one yep. On 04/05/2011, at 2:24 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 4 May 2011, at 04:05, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? Yes, the ability to play audio is there but in an upgrade so therefore we're talking about the standard controlling functions and only you mentioned the audio again. > > Wel now; there's a contradiction if ever I saw one! :) In terms of a remote control, I guess if it gives you accessibility then yes; it has to be a good thing. No dispute there. If you have no player connected to your network, however, how do you then get full control of the player? Surely you have to still have visual assistance to configure the box in the first place, do you not? > > But ok, let's talk about iPeng specifically and, whoever dragged audio playback into the discussion let's keep it on the level of the remote control aspect. Although I think it might be better off list. I don't have the iPad in front of me; but I didn't see the player settings part of the control when I last looked at it. Granted though it wasn't a very detailed look, I was just trying to make sure the app would run. > > What would also be nice I think is a desktop machine remote control for Squeezebox so that you could drive it from a Mac or a PC. I'm speaking here from the perspective of a blind person. For me personally I can just use the on-screen display but yes, I do see the point of the actual remote, when I think about it properly. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 07:20:50 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 16:20:50 +1000 Subject: Endingh Discusson on Squeezebox In-Reply-To: <4BA43DF8-C4CB-4B4A-9BA2-0368467ED99D@mac-access.net> References: <4BA43DF8-C4CB-4B4A-9BA2-0368467ED99D@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <87C297F2-C3EA-402C-9FCE-52E10DEA82EB@internode.on.net> Here we go again, did I name you? No I didn't. Did I refer to anyone? No I did not. Are you the only one I'm correspondence with over Squeezebox? No you are not. On 04/05/2011, at 2:56 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Judging by Dane's Twitter entry which some may have seen, he apparently believes that I am "Whining" about the Squeezebox remote control. Fine; I'll terminate the discussion and keep my views to myself. > > Oh and just one more correction I feel I should make to Dane's Twitter entry. I am not a "Blind Person whining". > > Anyway this subject is now closed as far as I'm concerned. I'm sorry if others take the same view as Dane apparently does. I will be more careful about expressing my views in the future. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed May 4 07:27:14 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 23:27:14 -0700 Subject: Need online storage, but Dropbox isn't quite cutting it? Wuala's got great deals and lots of space: In-Reply-To: <30577A9C-64CE-40E8-AC0D-2AB9F1762CCE@mac-access.net> References: <7C1F2BCD-6145-4302-843C-85456F348461@gmail.com> <30577A9C-64CE-40E8-AC0D-2AB9F1762CCE@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <383D643C-3E8A-41C4-9165-5D3D08A17D47@gmail.com> lol. no. hehahaha! it was only lunch time here. lol! but that looks to be a pretty neat sight. Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 3, 2011, at 6:47 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > > On 3 May 2011, at 20:51, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > This sounds neat. I have not tried it yet though. > > Do you ever sleep at all? :) > > Just joking here, please don't take it in any way personally. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Wed May 4 07:27:59 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 07:27:59 +0100 Subject: Endingh Discusson on Squeezebox In-Reply-To: <87C297F2-C3EA-402C-9FCE-52E10DEA82EB@internode.on.net> References: <4BA43DF8-C4CB-4B4A-9BA2-0368467ED99D@mac-access.net> <87C297F2-C3EA-402C-9FCE-52E10DEA82EB@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <273CBEF3-EED2-466D-9C6D-7E9160D6675E@mac-access.net> Bit of a coincidence, don't you think? I'm not arrogant enough to assume I am the only one Dane, but it's a very odd timing you have to admit. We discuss that, then suddenly that post pops up on Twitter. OK; so if I'm mistaken then I apologise. But it looks kind of sus. Lynne On 4 May 2011, at 07:20, Dane Trethowan wrote: Here we go again, did I name you? No I didn't. Did I refer to anyone? No I did not. Are you the only one I'm correspondence with over Squeezebox? No you are not. On 04/05/2011, at 2:56 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Judging by Dane's Twitter entry which some may have seen, he apparently believes that I am "Whining" about the Squeezebox remote control. Fine; I'll terminate the discussion and keep my views to myself. > > Oh and just one more correction I feel I should make to Dane's Twitter entry. I am not a "Blind Person whining". > > Anyway this subject is now closed as far as I'm concerned. I'm sorry if others take the same view as Dane apparently does. I will be more careful about expressing my views in the future. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 4 07:29:28 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 07:29:28 +0100 Subject: Endingh Discusson on Squeezebox In-Reply-To: <273CBEF3-EED2-466D-9C6D-7E9160D6675E@mac-access.net> References: <4BA43DF8-C4CB-4B4A-9BA2-0368467ED99D@mac-access.net> <87C297F2-C3EA-402C-9FCE-52E10DEA82EB@internode.on.net> <273CBEF3-EED2-466D-9C6D-7E9160D6675E@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Oopse! Forgot to change accounts again; sorry. That was me, not Gordon. Lynne On 4 May 2011, at 07:27, Gordon Smith wrote: Bit of a coincidence, don't you think? I'm not arrogant enough to assume I am the only one Dane, but it's a very odd timing you have to admit. We discuss that, then suddenly that post pops up on Twitter. OK; so if I'm mistaken then I apologise. But it looks kind of sus. Lynne On 4 May 2011, at 07:20, Dane Trethowan wrote: Here we go again, did I name you? No I didn't. Did I refer to anyone? No I did not. Are you the only one I'm correspondence with over Squeezebox? No you are not. On 04/05/2011, at 2:56 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > Judging by Dane's Twitter entry which some may have seen, he apparently believes that I am "Whining" about the Squeezebox remote control. Fine; I'll terminate the discussion and keep my views to myself. > > Oh and just one more correction I feel I should make to Dane's Twitter entry. I am not a "Blind Person whining". > > Anyway this subject is now closed as far as I'm concerned. I'm sorry if others take the same view as Dane apparently does. I will be more careful about expressing my views in the future. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 07:29:45 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 16:29:45 +1000 Subject: Endingh Discusson on Squeezebox In-Reply-To: <273CBEF3-EED2-466D-9C6D-7E9160D6675E@mac-access.net> References: <4BA43DF8-C4CB-4B4A-9BA2-0368467ED99D@mac-access.net> <87C297F2-C3EA-402C-9FCE-52E10DEA82EB@internode.on.net> <273CBEF3-EED2-466D-9C6D-7E9160D6675E@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <7F1CBE39-6B4A-477C-A43F-4DD37519413A@internode.on.net> If you want to read all types of things into comments I make then you go for it, I'm talking to people about Squeezebox on 3 different lists. On 04/05/2011, at 4:27 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Bit of a coincidence, don't you think? I'm not arrogant enough to assume I am the only one Dane, but it's a very odd timing you have to admit. We discuss that, then suddenly that post pops up on Twitter. OK; so if I'm mistaken then I apologise. But it looks kind of sus. > > Lynne > > On 4 May 2011, at 07:20, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Here we go again, did I name you? No I didn't. Did I refer to anyone? No I did not. Are you the only one I'm correspondence with over Squeezebox? No you are not. > > > On 04/05/2011, at 2:56 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > >> Hello everybody >> >> Judging by Dane's Twitter entry which some may have seen, he apparently believes that I am "Whining" about the Squeezebox remote control. Fine; I'll terminate the discussion and keep my views to myself. >> >> Oh and just one more correction I feel I should make to Dane's Twitter entry. I am not a "Blind Person whining". >> >> Anyway this subject is now closed as far as I'm concerned. I'm sorry if others take the same view as Dane apparently does. I will be more careful about expressing my views in the future. >> >> Lynne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Wed May 4 15:19:16 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Wed, 04 May 2011 09:19:16 -0500 Subject: Accessible Control Technology is one of my Favorite Topics. Message-ID: <201105041419.p44EJGto068053@x.it.okstate.edu> Controls are what make any kind of electronic gear either accessible or not. When I am really annoyed, I like to say we are living in the golden age of junk control technology.About half my life so far, was lived between 1951 and 1980 and most of the controls one found on entertainment or communications devices made before about 1980 provided several redundancies when you worked the controls. They stopped turning when you reached either end of how far the control could turn. They clicked which let one know how many possible selections there were and which one you happened to be on. There were hints of how things could at least get confusing in that television channel selector knobs usually rotated continuously making some a bit hard to tell what channel they were on especially if one was in a hotel or a new town and not familiar who was on what channel, but mostly a person who was blind could learn to work just about any piece of electronic gear within reason. I wouldn't, for a minute, want to go back to the electronics of those old controls because they had terrible shortcomings. How many of you remember TV tuners that you had to wiggle back and forth to get them to stay locked on the channel? Have you got some favorite old piece of Hi Fi gear that would sound wonderful if only the controls didn't crackle and pop like a string of firecrackers any time you turned the knob? They were not built to be accessible to people who are blind, but they accidentally were accessible. Some systems today are accidentally accessible at least in part. Most TV remote controls have a number pad so just selecting a channel is, in some ways, easier than ever but any time there is an on-screen menu or multi-functioned button, there is nothing but trouble. Since manufacturers are always coming up with new ways to present their control features, it is almost a loosing battle. What was accessible in this year's model may be totally inaccessible next year because they have gone to some pointy-clicky way of doing it that has no known point of reference. Those applications for the iphone and ipad and, as Lynn suggested for a desktop, could make all the difference in the world. I have been in arguments before with those who say that they hate the idea of having to drag a computer along just to use something. Well, I don't like that either, but I am a pragmatist and, if I had to have a computer, which any of these Apple devices really are, I would be very glad to have some way in to what I was trying to use rather than counting button presses and hoping for the best. There is nothing like just knowing what selection you are on and making it happen as opposed to what amounts to educated guesses and then more guesswork to try to get back to some known state. Right now, the Apple products all lack a couple of things that could be helpful but I also understand why. They do not have an infrared transmitter that could generate remote control signals. Every manufacturer has their own proprietary standard for infrared control codes so the transmitter would have to be able to generate all these different signals in order to be useful. Some Mac's have an infrared remote receiver but it is used by the remote that actually comes with the IMac and, as far as I know is not universal. As far as the iphone and ipad go, neither one has either a transmitter nor a receiver for infrared control codes. If they did and could learn the codes like those learning remotes one can buy to control many devices from one remote, we would have a power house system for controlling anything with an infrared remote. Applications could generate codes that we told them to without the possibility of simply hitting the wrong button and silently going in to some unknown mode. An application that read control codes could tell us what code we just sent with the remote so it could work from two perspectives. I just hope we are gradually if not accidentally getting closer to systems that are manageable again. I have actually experimented a little with infrared control codes and they are not hard to generate. They are a bit harder to receive since timing is everything so your receiver must not get slowed down or confused by other events while receiving a code. For the curious, IR control codes are a little like Morse code in that they are bursts of a carrier that goes on and off in a very precise series of pulses whose timing is measured to determine what key was pressed. Having said that, everybody uses a different carrier frequency and different bit counts as well as bit rates that are all over the map. It's really fun. From tsiegel at softcon.com Wed May 4 17:41:35 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 11:41:35 -0500 Subject: Accessible Control Technology is one of my Favorite Topics. In-Reply-To: <201105041419.p44EJGto068053@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105041419.p44EJGto068053@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Martin, I agree with you completely. The sad part is though, if manufacturers would spend 15 minutes thinking of their designs before implementing them, they could build 100 percent accessible controls. How many times have you seen a product that talked, but wasn't possible for the blind user to use. A few extra minutes spent adding a few extra voice prompts in most cases would solve this problem. Or, sometimes, just adding tactile push plates (so to speak) on flat screens would go a long way towards making touchpads accessible. Our microwave is a touch pad, but all buttons always do the same thing, and just placing textured areas where buttons were would make even those completely accessible. Yet, manufacturers don't think of these things, because they're not required to, and they haven't had enough experience with visually impaired (or other disabled) folks to know that a simple change that costs literally nothing during the design phase could provide a magnitude above standard issue accessibility. It's truly sad that I can't use this travel mate I have, simply because it has voice prompts for 90 percent of the items, but not the ones that let you select categories to choose from. From gordon at mac-access.net Wed May 4 18:15:55 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 18:15:55 +0100 Subject: iPeng for iPad Message-ID: <01FF6AB0-D1E9-4C49-88FE-923677A61660@mac-access.net> Hi all Well, I guess I must have become suddenly technologically inept. Because I have no idea how you're supposed to tell whether your actual player is connected using this programme. It does not even seem all that intuitive to me. I see our Music server, but it doesn't tell us whether the player is connected and I'm guessing not because the darn website is saying the player is now "Not Connected". I don't have the staying power I used to have pre-illness. But just at this moment I'm feeling totally brassed off with the Squeezebox system in general. If I could learn to drive the darn thing I'm sure I'd feel different. And the frustrating thing is I know it's been done. Gordon From grtdane at internode.on.net Wed May 4 18:32:13 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Thu, 5 May 2011 03:32:13 +1000 Subject: iPeng for iPad In-Reply-To: <01FF6AB0-D1E9-4C49-88FE-923677A61660@mac-access.net> References: <01FF6AB0-D1E9-4C49-88FE-923677A61660@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Okay, firstly look for a button to the left of the "Next" button, this brings up the "Multi Player Controls" screen, here you'll find a list of players you have, should say something like "Squeezebox Boom", there are other controls in this screen which show or hide additional servers, that is to say these controls show or hide the additional servers that your player isn't connected to. On 05/05/2011, at 3:15 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi all > > Well, I guess I must have become suddenly technologically inept. Because I have no idea how you're supposed to tell whether your actual player is connected using this programme. It does not even seem all that intuitive to me. I see our Music server, but it doesn't tell us whether the player is connected and I'm guessing not because the darn website is saying the player is now "Not Connected". > > I don't have the staying power I used to have pre-illness. But just at this moment I'm feeling totally brassed off with the Squeezebox system in general. If I could learn to drive the darn thing I'm sure I'd feel different. And the frustrating thing is I know it's been done. > > Gordon > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed May 4 20:52:05 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 12:52:05 -0700 Subject: Best Buy Employee Canned for Tackling Laptop Thief [Crime] Message-ID: <0E2994C0-399B-430B-ACA4-0726E9BDF76F@gmail.com> Best Buy Employee Canned for Tackling Laptop Thief [Crime] At most big retailers, shoplifters are allowed to run free, because any attempt to touch them brings up the terrifying prospect of a lawsuit. But a Montana Best Buy employee wasn't having that, taking down a thief. Now he's fired. More ? http://bit.ly/iBjenS From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 4 21:59:28 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 4 May 2011 21:59:28 +0100 Subject: Squeezebox Boom Remote Message-ID: <7091C1D6-F17A-49C3-87B1-E913D791B263@mac-access.net> Hello everybody OK, I've seen the luight! Thanks in no small part to a tip I got from Dane, Gordon has now managed to figure out the workings of iPeng for iPad. We have the thing connected to our own server now playing Internet music radio; which is precisely what we wanted. OK, from there we need to figure out how to set up a music source and how to make the thing auto-connect to the server when we turn it on. We need to move the box as it's not where we want it at the moment and moving it will involve power-down. We will see what happens. But Thanks Dane for your tip. That little bit of simple instruction was all it took. Gordon at full capacity would have sorted this out I am sure. But he's far from that at the moment; and I give credit where it's due; had I not got that little tip from Dane it wouldn't have been working now/. One thing that's missing from the Boom is a wheel lock. It's very easy to knock and as far as I know you cannot lock it. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Thu May 5 17:27:10 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Fri, 06 May 2011 02:27:10 +1000 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software Message-ID: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> Subject line says everything needed really. I finally got around to purchasing the Windows version of this software having previously purchased the version of Prism Video File Converter for the Mac. I'm extremely pleased to report that software for both platforms is extremely accessible and contains many usable and useful features, Prism would have to be the best Video Format converter I've used thus far and puts the otehr accessible converter software I know of for the Mac - Movavi - to absolute shame. You can download a trial version of the Prism Video File Converter software or purchase from From lynne at mac-access.net Thu May 5 22:50:30 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Thu, 5 May 2011 22:50:30 +0100 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> Hello Dane & all I confess I'm aways suspicious of sites selling software which aren't the home page of the product producers. This one is in Australia so how does it benefit the majority of members of this group who, I thin, are outside of the boundaries of Australia? I'm not suggesting any wrong-doing, I'm just asking a question. But I'm glad that you're happy with what you've bought. We'll have to try the software out and see if it's any better than what we had. That said, we don't do a great deal of format conversions because we tend to rip our video ourselves and it's always in the format we want anyway. But be that as it may I'm glad you're happy. Lynne On 5 May 2011, at 17:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: Subject line says everything needed really. I finally got around to purchasing the Windows version of this software having previously purchased the version of Prism Video File Converter for the Mac. I'm extremely pleased to report that software for both platforms is extremely accessible and contains many usable and useful features, Prism would have to be the best Video Format converter I've used thus far and puts the otehr accessible converter software I know of for the Mac - Movavi - to absolute shame. You can download a trial version of the Prism Video File Converter software or purchase from _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 6 00:05:51 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 5 May 2011 16:05:51 -0700 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> Message-ID: What are the benefits of video conversion? I'm new at this video thing on all platforms but I perform a lot and need to get my performances out there lol! and video is the only thing for me right now. so what are the benefits of this? take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 5, 2011, at 2:50 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane & all > > I confess I'm aways suspicious of sites selling software which aren't the home page of the product producers. This one is in Australia so how does it benefit the majority of members of this group who, I thin, are outside of the boundaries of Australia? > > I'm not suggesting any wrong-doing, I'm just asking a question. But I'm glad that you're happy with what you've bought. We'll have to try the software out and see if it's any better than what we had. That said, we don't do a great deal of format conversions because we tend to rip our video ourselves and it's always in the format we want anyway. > > But be that as it may I'm glad you're happy. > > Lynne > > On 5 May 2011, at 17:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Subject line says everything needed really. > > I finally got around to purchasing the Windows version of this software having previously purchased the version of Prism Video File Converter for the Mac. > > I'm extremely pleased to report that software for both platforms is extremely accessible and contains many usable and useful features, Prism would have to be the best Video Format converter I've used thus far and puts the otehr accessible converter software I know of for the Mac - Movavi - to absolute shame. > > You can download a trial version of the Prism Video File Converter software or purchase from > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 00:21:52 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 00:21:52 +0100 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4A7785A5-C18E-4D88-9C4E-423D6BEA146F@mac-access.net> Hello Sarah It's all to do with compression and compatibility. Some formats have higher resolutions than others. Some formats are compress while others are not. Some formats are unilaterally compatible whilst others are not. But you don't always need a converter if ripping or creating video yourself. Just choose the format you prefer and then use it. M4v, MOV and MPEG seem to be the most commonly used but although I'm not sure if it is still the case, there was a time when you had difficulty with MPEG format video on the Mac platform. The only way to play those files was using something like VLC or convert using a converter to another format. What I will add on this subject, very briefly, is that VLC in general produces far better result when playing video on the Mac than iTunes does, even when you have iTunes in full screen mode. The picture is sharper, the resolution is better and the images are much clearer. VLC is, of course, cross-platform so you might get equally good results under Windows and maybe LINUX. I haven't tried VLC under Windows, and don't plan too. I do, however, plan to try Winamp to see how it copes with video like this nowadays. It used to be dreadful at one time but hopefully it has improved. Lynne On 6 May 2011, at 00:05, Sarah Alawami wrote: What are the benefits of video conversion? I'm new at this video thing on all platforms but I perform a lot and need to get my performances out there lol! and video is the only thing for me right now. so what are the benefits of this? take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 5, 2011, at 2:50 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane & all > > I confess I'm aways suspicious of sites selling software which aren't the home page of the product producers. This one is in Australia so how does it benefit the majority of members of this group who, I thin, are outside of the boundaries of Australia? > > I'm not suggesting any wrong-doing, I'm just asking a question. But I'm glad that you're happy with what you've bought. We'll have to try the software out and see if it's any better than what we had. That said, we don't do a great deal of format conversions because we tend to rip our video ourselves and it's always in the format we want anyway. > > But be that as it may I'm glad you're happy. > > Lynne > > On 5 May 2011, at 17:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Subject line says everything needed really. > > I finally got around to purchasing the Windows version of this software having previously purchased the version of Prism Video File Converter for the Mac. > > I'm extremely pleased to report that software for both platforms is extremely accessible and contains many usable and useful features, Prism would have to be the best Video Format converter I've used thus far and puts the otehr accessible converter software I know of for the Mac - Movavi - to absolute shame. > > You can download a trial version of the Prism Video File Converter software or purchase from > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 6 02:37:10 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 11:37:10 +1000 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <10C72730-8E18-4363-8447-AD8F1CB45697@internode.on.net> Okay, why would one have bought the excellent OTS Djay software because it had an Australian web site? I have several products from this company including the very nice Express Talk vOIP software and CD Burn Express, all have done as claimed and all are extremely accessible. When I've had tech support issues they've been dealt with so given all that? Well I don't care where the company is, so long as I get what I paid for and get what I purchased. On 06/05/2011, at 7:50 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane & all > > I confess I'm aways suspicious of sites selling software which aren't the home page of the product producers. This one is in Australia so how does it benefit the majority of members of this group who, I thin, are outside of the boundaries of Australia? > > I'm not suggesting any wrong-doing, I'm just asking a question. But I'm glad that you're happy with what you've bought. We'll have to try the software out and see if it's any better than what we had. That said, we don't do a great deal of format conversions because we tend to rip our video ourselves and it's always in the format we want anyway. > > But be that as it may I'm glad you're happy. > > Lynne > > On 5 May 2011, at 17:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Subject line says everything needed really. > > I finally got around to purchasing the Windows version of this software having previously purchased the version of Prism Video File Converter for the Mac. > > I'm extremely pleased to report that software for both platforms is extremely accessible and contains many usable and useful features, Prism would have to be the best Video Format converter I've used thus far and puts the otehr accessible converter software I know of for the Mac - Movavi - to absolute shame. > > You can download a trial version of the Prism Video File Converter software or purchase from > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 6 02:39:03 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 11:39:03 +1000 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <9C0A335E-22AC-45A2-94DD-E95F14F7CD30@internode.on.net> Its a format converter, so you convert the video format to something different and you may find this helpful say if you record video from a TV broadcast and wish to play it in a format more suited to an Iphone or an Ipod Touch etc. On 06/05/2011, at 9:05 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > What are the benefits of video conversion? I'm new at this video thing on all platforms but I perform a lot and need to get my performances out there lol! and video is the only thing for me right now. so what are the benefits of this? > > take care all. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 5, 2011, at 2:50 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > >> Hello Dane & all >> >> I confess I'm aways suspicious of sites selling software which aren't the home page of the product producers. This one is in Australia so how does it benefit the majority of members of this group who, I thin, are outside of the boundaries of Australia? >> >> I'm not suggesting any wrong-doing, I'm just asking a question. But I'm glad that you're happy with what you've bought. We'll have to try the software out and see if it's any better than what we had. That said, we don't do a great deal of format conversions because we tend to rip our video ourselves and it's always in the format we want anyway. >> >> But be that as it may I'm glad you're happy. >> >> Lynne >> >> On 5 May 2011, at 17:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >> Subject line says everything needed really. >> >> I finally got around to purchasing the Windows version of this software having previously purchased the version of Prism Video File Converter for the Mac. >> >> I'm extremely pleased to report that software for both platforms is extremely accessible and contains many usable and useful features, Prism would have to be the best Video Format converter I've used thus far and puts the otehr accessible converter software I know of for the Mac - Movavi - to absolute shame. >> >> You can download a trial version of the Prism Video File Converter software or purchase from >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 6 02:54:56 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 5 May 2011 18:54:56 -0700 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: <9C0A335E-22AC-45A2-94DD-E95F14F7CD30@internode.on.net> References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> <9C0A335E-22AC-45A2-94DD-E95F14F7CD30@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <20BAB5F0-8F42-4392-8203-7AC5A9AF1337@gmail.com> or the 2 gig limit with youtube? you can convert that 23 gig vid in to something more managable for youtube to handle right? Am I seeing the light here? lol! It takes me a while to grasp stuff so bare wiht me. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 5, 2011, at 6:39 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Its a format converter, so you convert the video format to something different and you may find this helpful say if you record video from a TV broadcast and wish to play it in a format more suited to an Iphone or an Ipod Touch etc. > > > On 06/05/2011, at 9:05 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> What are the benefits of video conversion? I'm new at this video thing on all platforms but I perform a lot and need to get my performances out there lol! and video is the only thing for me right now. so what are the benefits of this? >> >> take care all. >> Sarah Alawami >> >> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >> >> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >> >> website: http://music.marrie.org >> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >> >> On May 5, 2011, at 2:50 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> >>> Hello Dane & all >>> >>> I confess I'm aways suspicious of sites selling software which aren't the home page of the product producers. This one is in Australia so how does it benefit the majority of members of this group who, I thin, are outside of the boundaries of Australia? >>> >>> I'm not suggesting any wrong-doing, I'm just asking a question. But I'm glad that you're happy with what you've bought. We'll have to try the software out and see if it's any better than what we had. That said, we don't do a great deal of format conversions because we tend to rip our video ourselves and it's always in the format we want anyway. >>> >>> But be that as it may I'm glad you're happy. >>> >>> Lynne >>> >>> On 5 May 2011, at 17:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>> >>> Subject line says everything needed really. >>> >>> I finally got around to purchasing the Windows version of this software having previously purchased the version of Prism Video File Converter for the Mac. >>> >>> I'm extremely pleased to report that software for both platforms is extremely accessible and contains many usable and useful features, Prism would have to be the best Video Format converter I've used thus far and puts the otehr accessible converter software I know of for the Mac - Movavi - to absolute shame. >>> >>> You can download a trial version of the Prism Video File Converter software or purchase from >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 6 03:57:58 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Fri, 06 May 2011 12:57:58 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox Touch Message-ID: <4DC363B6.5010103@internode.on.net> Okay, just checked the price of one of these Squeezebox Touch players, $299.00 Australia so will have to wait a little till I can buy one . Its different from the Squeezebox Boom smaller for one thing and you can use local media for your music, by local media I mean you can copy your music to a USB memory stick, Hard Drive or SD card, apart from these adidtional functions the Touch has the same functionality of all the other Squeezebox Models such as the Boom and the Duet. From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 6 04:03:58 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 5 May 2011 20:03:58 -0700 Subject: Squeezebox Touch In-Reply-To: <4DC363B6.5010103@internode.on.net> References: <4DC363B6.5010103@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Oh wow coolio! wonder if you can hook yoru ipod to it via a doc and do it that way? Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 5, 2011, at 7:57 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Okay, just checked the price of one of these Squeezebox Touch players, $299.00 Australia so will have to wait a little till I can buy one . > > Its different from the Squeezebox Boom smaller for one thing and you can use local media for your music, by local media I mean you can copy your music to a USB memory stick, Hard Drive or SD card, apart from these adidtional functions the Touch has the same functionality of all the other Squeezebox Models such as the Boom and the Duet. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 6 04:13:51 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Fri, 06 May 2011 13:13:51 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox Touch In-Reply-To: References: <4DC363B6.5010103@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <4DC3676F.3000001@internode.on.net> Can't see why you couldn't, so long as the Touch recognises the Ipod as a hard drive, I know that my Namo models would work. On 6/05/2011 1:03 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Oh wow coolio! wonder if you can hook yoru ipod to it via a doc and do it that way? > > Take care. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 5, 2011, at 7:57 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> Okay, just checked the price of one of these Squeezebox Touch players, $299.00 Australia so will have to wait a little till I can buy one. >> >> Its different from the Squeezebox Boom smaller for one thing and you can use local media for your music, by local media I mean you can copy your music to a USB memory stick, Hard Drive or SD card, apart from these adidtional functions the Touch has the same functionality of all the other Squeezebox Models such as the Boom and the Duet. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 12:44:09 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 12:44:09 +0100 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: <10C72730-8E18-4363-8447-AD8F1CB45697@internode.on.net> References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> <10C72730-8E18-4363-8447-AD8F1CB45697@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Hello Dane On 6 May 2011, at 02:37, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Okay, why would one have bought the excellent OTS Djay software because it had an Australian web site? You're missing my point. This has nothing to do with where the site is located, it's because it's a .com.au site and it looked as though the reseller was aiming at Australian customers. Of course I have no problem with them being in Australia; come on Dane be sensible! :) ? I have several products from this company including the very nice Express Talk vOIP software and CD Burn Express, all have done as claimed and all are extremely accessible. When I've had tech support issues they've been dealt with so given all that? Well I don't care where the company is, so long as I get what I paid for and get what I purchased. As I understand it they are a reseller, not the developer. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 13:02:00 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 13:02:00 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions Message-ID: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Hello everybody I'm looking for an unbiassed opinion as to whether the System Access for Atom screen-reader is worth the money. I'm contemplating buying it for Gordon as we use a NetBook exclusively now for Windows and he sometimes gets frustrated with Window-Eyes. Anybody care to give me any advice, pointers or unbiassed opinions? Lynne From moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk Fri May 6 13:17:20 2011 From: moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk (Chris Moore) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 13:17:20 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: I think SA is a very good screen reader, and of course you get free updates for life which is a bonus. It can handle some apps better than than some that have trouble, but can struggle in some areas too. My advice is to try it and see what you think first. NVDA is a good alternative, you don't have to use the default eSpeak voice. On 6 May 2011, at 13:02, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I'm looking for an unbiassed opinion as to whether the System Access for Atom screen-reader is worth the money. I'm contemplating buying it for Gordon as we use a NetBook exclusively now for Windows and he sometimes gets frustrated with Window-Eyes. > > Anybody care to give me any advice, pointers or unbiassed opinions? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 14:45:17 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 14:45:17 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hello Chris On 6 May 2011, at 13:17, Chris Moore wrote: ? I think SA is a very good screen reader, and of course you get free updates for life which is a bonus. It can handle some apps better than than some that have trouble, but can struggle in some areas too. My advice is to try it and see what you think first. NVDA is a good alternative, you don't have to use the default eSpeak voice. How do both NVDA and SA work with laptop keyboards? For instance ours is a NetBook and we obviously would need to use different key strokes. Gordon finds the Window-Eyes laptop keyboard very difficult to remember I think and the one thing that both of us have noticed about WE is that it doesn't have the keyboard reminder functions which, for instance, VoiceOver has. So it can be a pain in the rectum to try and find the correct keystroke if you've forgotten it. So, how do both NVDA and SA handle that type of situation? Lynne From moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk Fri May 6 15:06:18 2011 From: moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk (Chris Moore) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 15:06:18 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <321C84A9-5715-4A18-93B0-639A0766EEDD@blueyonder.co.uk> NVDA and System Access (and JAWS for that matter) all have keyboard help. They can all be used on a laptop too by using the shift caps lock as the modifier key. chris On 6 May 2011, at 14:45, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Chris > > On 6 May 2011, at 13:17, Chris Moore wrote: > > ? I think SA is a very good screen reader, and of course you get free updates for life which is a bonus. It can handle some apps better than than some that have trouble, but can struggle in some areas too. My advice is to try it and see what you think first. NVDA is a good alternative, you don't have to use the default eSpeak voice. > How do both NVDA and SA work with laptop keyboards? For instance ours is a NetBook and we obviously would need to use different key strokes. > > Gordon finds the Window-Eyes laptop keyboard very difficult to remember I think and the one thing that both of us have noticed about WE is that it doesn't have the keyboard reminder functions which, for instance, VoiceOver has. So it can be a pain in the rectum to try and find the correct keystroke if you've forgotten it. > > So, how do both NVDA and SA handle that type of situation? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 15:31:00 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 15:31:00 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <321C84A9-5715-4A18-93B0-639A0766EEDD@blueyonder.co.uk> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <321C84A9-5715-4A18-93B0-639A0766EEDD@blueyonder.co.uk> Message-ID: Hello Chris On 6 May 2011, at 15:06, Chris Moore wrote: ? NVDA and System Access (and JAWS for that matter) all have keyboard help. They can all be used on a laptop too by using the shift caps lock as the modifier key. Interesting. I don't remember seeing anything like that in Window-Eyes. We now have 7.5 and we are struggling to find a way to make the Braille display initialise. The new interface, if you can call it that, is much like others I've seen. It's like a kind of tree view interface now instead of being all menu orientated. But as yet we can't find out how you initialise the display. In old versions of WE you could press Alt+F and then the letter B to initialise your display. But now it seems not. To be honest as of now I'm struggling to find a reason to justify this purchase. I can't see what it's going to give Gordon in terms of Windows functionality that he didn't already have. it looks to me like GW is really struggling to find ways of improving their product; so all they do is change it and call it a "major improvement". Lynne From moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk Fri May 6 15:42:34 2011 From: moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk (Chris Moore) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 15:42:34 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <321C84A9-5715-4A18-93B0-639A0766EEDD@blueyonder.co.uk> Message-ID: <172E555A-9EB4-4E17-89CC-59DDC32D96E1@blueyonder.co.uk> The major improvement from what I could see was the ability to provide remote access (which is better implemented than JAWS apparently) and the improved settings area, and apps (aka scripts). Never used WindowEyes, but I know GWMicro have podcasts, and technical support. So have you tried contacting them? Is there nothing listed in the online help within the application? On 6 May 2011, at 15:31, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Chris > > On 6 May 2011, at 15:06, Chris Moore wrote: > > ? NVDA and System Access (and JAWS for that matter) all have keyboard help. They can all be used on a laptop too by using the shift caps lock as the modifier key. > > Interesting. I don't remember seeing anything like that in Window-Eyes. We now have 7.5 and we are struggling to find a way to make the Braille display initialise. The new interface, if you can call it that, is much like others I've seen. It's like a kind of tree view interface now instead of being all menu orientated. But as yet we can't find out how you initialise the display. In old versions of WE you could press Alt+F and then the letter B to initialise your display. But now it seems not. > > To be honest as of now I'm struggling to find a reason to justify this purchase. I can't see what it's going to give Gordon in terms of Windows functionality that he didn't already have. it looks to me like GW is really struggling to find ways of improving their product; so all they do is change it and call it a "major improvement". > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 16:34:22 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 16:34:22 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <172E555A-9EB4-4E17-89CC-59DDC32D96E1@blueyonder.co.uk> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <321C84A9-5715-4A18-93B0-639A0766EEDD@blueyonder.co.uk> <172E555A-9EB4-4E17-89CC-59DDC32D96E1@blueyonder.co.uk> Message-ID: Hello Chris On 6 May 2011, at 15:42, Chris Moore wrote: ? The major improvement from what I could see was the ability to provide remote access (which is better implemented than JAWS apparently) and the improved settings area, and apps (aka scripts). Never used WindowEyes, but I know GWMicro have podcasts, and technical support. So have you tried contacting them? Is there nothing listed in the online help within the application? I have not, as yet, tried to contact them; but I plan to do so later today if Gordon doesn't find what he needs first. GW's technical support people are now arrogant, egotistical and very obtuse in my opinion. They give you only the very basics when it comes to answering questions. Apparently it wasn't always so; but they have changed in recent years. I may be imagining this, I'm not sure. But they seem to be exceptionally cool towards us now, probably because of the fact that Gordon used to beta test for them and then jumped ship to go Mac instead. But Gordon never did a Jonathan Mosen; he did not use any information made available to him by GW Micro to further his own personal or professional life. He did not join a direct competitor and pass on any secrets. In fact, he didn't tell anybody anything despite leaving their group. But they have for the most part been very cool towards him when he's contacted them since leaving the group. Lynne From tvii at optonline.net Fri May 6 18:31:52 2011 From: tvii at optonline.net (John Panarese) Date: Fri, 06 May 2011 13:31:52 -0400 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Personally, if you want another opinion, I think SA is definitely worth the money. From experience, keep in mind that it doesn't always work with third party apps, but it does work better than the other screen readers in other instances. I also like the fact that updates are free for life and that if you send them info about out specific apps, they will work to get SA to work with it. I know you also asked questions about keyboard commands, and the help with SA is quite good. Take Care John Panarese On May 6, 2011, at 8:02 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I'm looking for an unbiassed opinion as to whether the System Access for Atom screen-reader is worth the money. I'm contemplating buying it for Gordon as we use a NetBook exclusively now for Windows and he sometimes gets frustrated with Window-Eyes. > > Anybody care to give me any advice, pointers or unbiassed opinions? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > Take Care John Panarese From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 6 18:43:43 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 07 May 2011 03:43:43 +1000 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DC4334F.4070409@internode.on.net> Well I don't know whether I'm unbias or not being a System Access user but I think the money I paid for the package was certainly worth it, firstly the support for the software has been - in my experience thus far - excellent. The only thing I might say is that perhaps Gordon may find some of the help system a little overbaring in parts, meaning that plenty of help is available throughout the software and if there's a help level in the software? Well I don't know where it is and can't change it so I just grin and bare it but still, better more help than none at all . My only further comment would be, try NVDA first! On 6/05/2011 10:02 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I'm looking for an unbiassed opinion as to whether the System Access for Atom screen-reader is worth the money. I'm contemplating buying it for Gordon as we use a NetBook exclusively now for Windows and he sometimes gets frustrated with Window-Eyes. > > Anybody care to give me any advice, pointers or unbiassed opinions? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 19:25:32 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 19:25:32 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <4DC4334F.4070409@internode.on.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <4DC4334F.4070409@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Hello Dane I have just downloaded the latest version of NVDA this afternoon; and we are going to try and try it later tonight. The primary reason for this is that we are looking to see if we can better Window-Eyes in conjunction with OTS AV DJ Pro Classic, as it is now called. Gordon is hospital radio broadcasting in quite a big way now and the old CD/tape/turntable method is quite inappropriate for this kind of work. So our aim is to set up a Shoutcast compatible server, (most likely Nicecast) to relay the connection to the main station servers. In an ideal world we'd broadcast on the Mac; but the simple fact is that there is not a solution available which meets our needs in terms of mixing and queuing. Some of the inserts and exerts have to be done on-the-fly, so to speak, so the option of using static playlists is difficult to work with. And another reason why the Mac is so difficult is the simple fact that there seems to be no means of juggling things using only one single sound output so that VoiceOver doesn't get carried on the same audio channel and, therefore, broadcast along with the stream. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 19:31:03 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 19:31:03 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <0520861C-A8C1-4EB4-AD3F-3D9E9C5875A4@mac-access.net> Hello John; really nice to see you active on list again. On 6 May 2011, at 18:31, John Panarese wrote: ? Personally, if you want another opinion, I think SA is definitely worth the money. From experience, keep in mind that it doesn't always work with third party apps, but it does work better than the other screen readers in other instances. I welcome very much your opinion John, and value it just as much as any other. ? I also like the fact that updates are free for life and that if you send them info about out specific apps, they will work to get SA to work with it. That is a good thing, yes. I'm most likely looking at the stand-alone version rather than the Atom only one. I'm going to install another VM I think, and SA would probably be useful there. ? I know you also asked questions about keyboard commands, and the help with SA is quite good. The concern here is mouse manipulation. Window-Eyes's default laptop layout is dreadful in Gordon's opinion. Since he's the one here that has to use the thing, it's going to be a matter of re-defining them by the looks of things. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 6 20:05:02 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 07 May 2011 05:05:02 +1000 Subject: Prism Video File Converter, nice accessible software In-Reply-To: References: <4DC2CFDE.3020106@internode.on.net> <93420324-9F75-4F81-B168-947379F97E50@mac-access.net> <10C72730-8E18-4363-8447-AD8F1CB45697@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <4DC4465E.4000104@internode.on.net> You started this twaddle, I didn't . On 6/05/2011 9:44 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 6 May 2011, at 02:37, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? Okay, why would one have bought the excellent OTS Djay software because it had an Australian web site? > > You're missing my point. This has nothing to do with where the site is located, it's because it's a .com.au site and it looked as though the reseller was aiming at Australian customers. Of course I have no problem with them being in Australia; come on Dane be sensible! :) > > ? I have several products from this company including the very nice Express Talk vOIP software and CD Burn Express, all have done as claimed and all are extremely accessible. When I've had tech support issues they've been dealt with so given all that? Well I don't care where the company is, so long as I get what I paid for and get what I purchased. > > As I understand it they are a reseller, not the developer. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. > > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From tvii at optonline.net Fri May 6 20:39:25 2011 From: tvii at optonline.net (John Panarese) Date: Fri, 06 May 2011 15:39:25 -0400 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <0520861C-A8C1-4EB4-AD3F-3D9E9C5875A4@mac-access.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <0520861C-A8C1-4EB4-AD3F-3D9E9C5875A4@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <7FA27422-F947-443D-A7AA-C5BDCB7545FC@optonline.net> To be honest, I have not delve too far into the keyboard commands or mouse manipulation, so, perhaps, someone else can comment on that. BTW, Lynne, off topic, but I responded to your mail message and I'm not sure if you are receiving my messages. Take Care John Panarese On May 6, 2011, at 2:31 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello John; really nice to see you active on list again. > > On 6 May 2011, at 18:31, John Panarese wrote: > > ? Personally, if you want another opinion, I think SA is definitely worth the money. From experience, keep in mind that it doesn't always work with third party apps, but it does work better than the other screen readers in other instances. > > I welcome very much your opinion John, and value it just as much as any other. > > ? I also like the fact that updates are free for life and that if you send them info about out specific apps, they will work to get SA to work with it. > > That is a good thing, yes. I'm most likely looking at the stand-alone version rather than the Atom only one. I'm going to install another VM I think, and SA would probably be useful there. > > ? I know you also asked questions about keyboard commands, and the help with SA is quite good. > > The concern here is mouse manipulation. Window-Eyes's default laptop layout is dreadful in Gordon's opinion. Since he's the one here that has to use the thing, it's going to be a matter of re-defining them by the looks of things. > > Lynne > > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 6 21:36:47 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 13:36:47 -0700 Subject: Groups ask FCC to investigate AT&T broadband caps Message-ID: Two groups are calling for an FCC investigation of AT&T's new broadband caps. http://bit.ly/jfFmuV From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 6 22:04:59 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 14:04:59 -0700 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: I used and love SaToGo. it was a lot smoother in my opinion. give it a try and see what you think. It worked with most of the programs although it does have some issues with miranda. It reads the history window as blank. lol! Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 6, 2011, at 5:02 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I'm looking for an unbiassed opinion as to whether the System Access for Atom screen-reader is worth the money. I'm contemplating buying it for Gordon as we use a NetBook exclusively now for Windows and he sometimes gets frustrated with Window-Eyes. > > Anybody care to give me any advice, pointers or unbiassed opinions? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 23:00:20 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 23:00:20 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <7FA27422-F947-443D-A7AA-C5BDCB7545FC@optonline.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <0520861C-A8C1-4EB4-AD3F-3D9E9C5875A4@mac-access.net> <7FA27422-F947-443D-A7AA-C5BDCB7545FC@optonline.net> Message-ID: <09D0D9F5-0CBB-4D92-BE20-C3543C66B0C5@mac-access.net> Hello John On 6 May 2011, at 20:39, John Panarese wrote: ? To be honest, I have not delve too far into the keyboard commands or mouse manipulation, so, perhaps, someone else can comment on that. What I'm really really looking to do, and I think perhaps I'll ask Gordon to try and knock something up here) is to make a comparison between all 3 programmes; Window-Eyes 7.5, NVDA (whatever the latest is) and System Access. ? BTW, Lynne, off topic, but I responded to your mail message and I'm not sure if you are receiving my messages. I did actually respond once John but haven't had anything since. I will check. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 6 23:02:04 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 23:02:04 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <06D2BA51-0DF8-4C24-99FF-2C472FBC6C30@mac-access.net> Hello Sarah Thank you for reminding me; I wanted to check out Miranda to see if it's any good or not. Lynne On 6 May 2011, at 22:04, Sarah Alawami wrote: I used and love SaToGo. it was a lot smoother in my opinion. give it a try and see what you think. It worked with most of the programs although it does have some issues with miranda. It reads the history window as blank. lol! Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 6, 2011, at 5:02 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I'm looking for an unbiassed opinion as to whether the System Access for Atom screen-reader is worth the money. I'm contemplating buying it for Gordon as we use a NetBook exclusively now for Windows and he sometimes gets frustrated with Window-Eyes. > > Anybody care to give me any advice, pointers or unbiassed opinions? > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From tvii at optonline.net Fri May 6 23:46:22 2011 From: tvii at optonline.net (John Panarese) Date: Fri, 06 May 2011 18:46:22 -0400 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: <09D0D9F5-0CBB-4D92-BE20-C3543C66B0C5@mac-access.net> References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <0520861C-A8C1-4EB4-AD3F-3D9E9C5875A4@mac-access.net> <7FA27422-F947-443D-A7AA-C5BDCB7545FC@optonline.net> <09D0D9F5-0CBB-4D92-BE20-C3543C66B0C5@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hi Lynne, I'd be interested in your findings. I've been toying with the idea of trying out the NVDa screen reader. I just haven't gotten around to doing it. I just checked. I didn't see any reply. John D. Panarese Managing Director Technologies for the Visually Impaired, Inc. 9 Nolan Court Hauppauge, NY 11788 Tel/Fax, (631) 724-4479 Email, tvii at optonline.net Internet, http://www.tvi-web.com AUTHORIZED DISTRIBUTORS FOR PORTSET SYSTEMS LTD, COMPSOLUTIONS VA, PREMIER ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGIES, INDEX, PAPENMEIER, REPRO-TRONICS, DUXBURY, SEROTEK AND OTHER PRODUCTS FOR THE BLIND AND VISUALLY IMPAIRED AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE MAC VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT On May 6, 2011, at 6:00 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello John > > On 6 May 2011, at 20:39, John Panarese wrote: > > ? To be honest, I have not delve too far into the keyboard commands or mouse manipulation, so, perhaps, someone else can comment on that. > > What I'm really really looking to do, and I think perhaps I'll ask Gordon to try and knock something up here) is to make a comparison between all 3 programmes; Window-Eyes 7.5, NVDA (whatever the latest is) and System Access. > > ? BTW, Lynne, off topic, but I responded to your mail message and I'm not sure if you are receiving my messages. > > I did actually respond once John but haven't had anything since. I will check. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Sat May 7 01:01:56 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 6 May 2011 17:01:56 -0700 Subject: The Last Vending Machine You'll Ever Need [Blip] Message-ID: <6BD51E7E-611C-4759-AF0C-7C1B9A2F3CC2@gmail.com> didn't know where to post this but here ya go. The Last Vending Machine You'll Ever Need [Blip] Quite possibly mankind's greatest achievement since the advent of the Automat, this vending machine carries everything the DIYer could dream of. It's located in the Metrix Create:Space, a hacker hangout in the Seattle area, and sells everything from Nutterbutters to Arduino kits. Need a servo or DC motor for your project? How about an MRE or an LCD display? Solder tubes, ShamWows, bread boards, this machine has you covered. The only thing it doesn't sell is an open-source breathalyzer kit.. .oh wait, nevermind, it does.[Metrix Create:Space via Wired Gadget Lab] More ? http://bit.ly/lvzFmn From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 02:19:16 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 02:19:16 +0100 Subject: Looking For Unbiassed Opinions In-Reply-To: References: <0494CC23-A88D-479C-98BD-4F776187EB5A@mac-access.net> <0520861C-A8C1-4EB4-AD3F-3D9E9C5875A4@mac-access.net> <7FA27422-F947-443D-A7AA-C5BDCB7545FC@optonline.net> <09D0D9F5-0CBB-4D92-BE20-C3543C66B0C5@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hello John On 6 May 2011, at 23:46, John Panarese wrote: ? I'd be interested in your findings. I've been toying with the idea of trying out the NVDa screen reader. I just haven't gotten around to doing it. Likewise. I downloaded both System Access and NVDA yesterday and Gordon will try it over the weekend, circumstances permitting. The same is true of System Access; although I think that, to be honest, there are only two ways I would be able to justify buying it: 1. I buy the Atom edition and not have the ability to install it on any virtual machine we might create. 2. I buy it using a payment plan over so many months if it still exists; I didn't see it on their website. But that payment plan must not include any interest, as in they don't stick in any extra payments in the small print. If that were available I'd buy the full version. But I only see the Mobile version as a $39.95 a month service, and that's not what we want. We're not interested in their networking services, just the screen-reader. I plan to install DocuScan Plus into Windows over the weekend as well. ? I just checked. I didn't see any reply. I'll write you off list; which address would you prefer? I will try both and you can reply from the one that suits you best. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 02:20:52 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 02:20:52 +0100 Subject: The Last Vending Machine You'll Ever Need [Blip] In-Reply-To: <6BD51E7E-611C-4759-AF0C-7C1B9A2F3CC2@gmail.com> References: <6BD51E7E-611C-4759-AF0C-7C1B9A2F3CC2@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5DFCE08D-3907-45DF-9320-FD51AEF76725@mac-access.net> Hello Sarah On 7 May 2011, at 01:01, Sarah Alawami wrote: didn't know where to post this but here ya go. Good job we have some Americans on list; this honestly couldn't have less relevance to the rest of us. :) Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 7 02:27:29 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 07 May 2011 11:27:29 +1000 Subject: The Last Vending Machine You'll Ever Need [Blip] In-Reply-To: <5DFCE08D-3907-45DF-9320-FD51AEF76725@mac-access.net> References: <6BD51E7E-611C-4759-AF0C-7C1B9A2F3CC2@gmail.com> <5DFCE08D-3907-45DF-9320-FD51AEF76725@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DC4A001.8080406@internode.on.net> And good job we have some POM'S on the list, they think they're above the rest of us . On 7/05/2011 11:20 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > > On 7 May 2011, at 01:01, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > didn't know where to post this but here ya go. > > Good job we have some Americans on list; this honestly couldn't have less relevance to the rest of us. :) > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 7 02:39:10 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 07 May 2011 11:39:10 +1000 Subject: NVDA "Drag and Drop" Message-ID: <4DC4A2BE.8080007@internode.on.net> Hi! I've been trying MVDA with various pieces of software which require "Drag and Drop" to reorder list items and I'm glad to report that "Drag And Drop" operations are certainly possible with NVDA, not tried anything like this with System Access yet. To perform "Drag and Drop" operations, move the mouse to the item you wish to drag and lock the left mouse button, then move the mouse where you want the item "Dropped" and unlock the left mouse button, "Locking" and "unlocking" can be performed using a keyboard shortcut. Like many good pieces of software these days NVDA has a "Keyboard Describer" so you can quickly find out what the keys on your keyboard do and if their are any NVDA commands or functions assigned to them. From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 04:27:56 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 04:27:56 +0100 Subject: The Last Vending Machine You'll Ever Need [Blip] In-Reply-To: <4DC4A001.8080406@internode.on.net> References: <6BD51E7E-611C-4759-AF0C-7C1B9A2F3CC2@gmail.com> <5DFCE08D-3907-45DF-9320-FD51AEF76725@mac-access.net> <4DC4A001.8080406@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <298B9B9C-985D-417A-9896-C497A1BECF38@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 7 May 2011, at 02:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? And good job we have some POM'S on the list, they think they're above the rest of us . That is absolutely not true. If know there was a smiley there, but that comment is very very wrong. Wel strictly speaking we are above you lot over there, that's why you're down-under. That's why you lose at cricket these days! Not that I care remotely about cricket. But if you really think that, we have a problem. Lynne On 7/05/2011 11:20 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > > On 7 May 2011, at 01:01, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > didn't know where to post this but here ya go. > > Good job we have some Americans on list; this honestly couldn't have less relevance to the rest of us. :) > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 05:07:01 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 05:07:01 +0100 Subject: iPeng for iOS Devices Message-ID: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> Hello everybody I suppose this message is only of interest to those who have, or are interested in the Squeezebox devices. It seems that iPeng isn't quite a "full" remote control. You cannot set up the network side of the Squeezebox. Not really surprising to be honest; but a little disappointing. Gordon says it's probably technically not possible to access the device at that low a level because at that stage you have no way to know which network, if any, it's even joining. Ours has gone into some strange mode at the moment and its not seeing the wireless networks at all. I'm hoping it isn't a hardware failure, but the device just isn't seeing anything. So, I'm off to see if I can find any factory test procedures or reset functions; irritating though it's going to be. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 7 05:59:51 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 07 May 2011 14:59:51 +1000 Subject: iPeng for iOS Devices In-Reply-To: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> References: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DC4D1C7.50809@internode.on.net> Gordon's right, no remote control could access the network settings as its a lower level, if you hold down the "Back" button on the Boom that should get you back to that lower setup level. On 7/05/2011 2:07 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I suppose this message is only of interest to those who have, or are interested in the Squeezebox devices. > > It seems that iPeng isn't quite a "full" remote control. You cannot set up the network side of the Squeezebox. > > Not really surprising to be honest; but a little disappointing. Gordon says it's probably technically not possible to access the device at that low a level because at that stage you have no way to know which network, if any, it's even joining. > > Ours has gone into some strange mode at the moment and its not seeing the wireless networks at all. I'm hoping it isn't a hardware failure, but the device just isn't seeing anything. > > So, I'm off to see if I can find any factory test procedures or reset functions; irritating though it's going to be. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 07:25:13 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 07:25:13 +0100 Subject: iPeng for iOS Devices In-Reply-To: <4DC4D1C7.50809@internode.on.net> References: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> <4DC4D1C7.50809@internode.on.net> Message-ID: We;; I think we've got it back on our network but I made a stupid mistake; I bought the iPad player. Now I can't get the darn thing back to the Boomn. Is there a way to remove the iPad player from the list, if only temprarily ubntil we ascertain that the boom will work On 7 May 2011, at 05:59, Dane Trethowan wrote: Gordon's right, no remote control could access the network settings as its a lower level, if you hold down the "Back" button on the Boom that should get you back to that lower setup level. On 7/05/2011 2:07 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I suppose this message is only of interest to those who have, or are interested in the Squeezebox devices. > > It seems that iPeng isn't quite a "full" remote control. You cannot set up the network side of the Squeezebox. > > Not really surprising to be honest; but a little disappointing. Gordon says it's probably technically not possible to access the device at that low a level because at that stage you have no way to know which network, if any, it's even joining. > > Ours has gone into some strange mode at the moment and its not seeing the wireless networks at all. I'm hoping it isn't a hardware failure, but the device just isn't seeing anything. > > So, I'm off to see if I can find any factory test procedures or reset functions; irritating though it's going to be. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 7 08:08:08 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 07 May 2011 17:08:08 +1000 Subject: iPeng for iOS Devices In-Reply-To: References: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> <4DC4D1C7.50809@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <4DC4EFD8.2010602@internode.on.net> Yep you can, follow the procedure I outlined in an earlier message but select Squeezebox Boom instead of Ipad Player. On 7/05/2011 4:25 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > We;; I think we've got it back on our network but I made a stupid mistake; I bought the iPad player. Now I can't get the darn thing back to the Boomn. Is there a way to remove the iPad player from the list, if only temprarily ubntil we ascertain that the boom will work > > On 7 May 2011, at 05:59, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Gordon's right, no remote control could access the network settings as its a lower level, if you hold down the "Back" button on the Boom that should get you back to that lower setup level. > > > > On 7/05/2011 2:07 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hello everybody >> >> I suppose this message is only of interest to those who have, or are interested in the Squeezebox devices. >> >> It seems that iPeng isn't quite a "full" remote control. You cannot set up the network side of the Squeezebox. >> >> Not really surprising to be honest; but a little disappointing. Gordon says it's probably technically not possible to access the device at that low a level because at that stage you have no way to know which network, if any, it's even joining. >> >> Ours has gone into some strange mode at the moment and its not seeing the wireless networks at all. I'm hoping it isn't a hardware failure, but the device just isn't seeing anything. >> >> So, I'm off to see if I can find any factory test procedures or reset functions; irritating though it's going to be. >> >> Lynne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk Sat May 7 12:18:12 2011 From: moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk (Chris Moore) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 12:18:12 +0100 Subject: The Last Vending Machine You'll Ever Need [Blip] In-Reply-To: <4DC4A001.8080406@internode.on.net> References: <6BD51E7E-611C-4759-AF0C-7C1B9A2F3CC2@gmail.com> <5DFCE08D-3907-45DF-9320-FD51AEF76725@mac-access.net> <4DC4A001.8080406@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Now now don't generalise Dane, I currently have my niece over from Perth. I love australia and their attitude to life and others. i certainly don't think I am above anyone, unless I am on a step ladder of course :) On 7 May 2011, at 02:27, Dane Trethowan wrote: > And good job we have some POM'S on the list, they think they're above the rest of us . > > > > On 7/05/2011 11:20 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hello Sarah >> >> On 7 May 2011, at 01:01, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> >> didn't know where to post this but here ya go. >> >> Good job we have some Americans on list; this honestly couldn't have less relevance to the rest of us. :) >> >> Lynne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 18:29:57 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 18:29:57 +0100 Subject: iPeng for iOS Devices In-Reply-To: <4DC4EFD8.2010602@internode.on.net> References: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> <4DC4D1C7.50809@internode.on.net> <4DC4EFD8.2010602@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <98656ABA-C856-4CD8-A2FA-E3AFA06D7E16@mac-access.net> We've lost the boom totally on our network for some reason which we're not quite sure of jus yet. Lynne On 7 May 2011, at 08:08, Dane Trethowan wrote: Yep you can, follow the procedure I outlined in an earlier message but select Squeezebox Boom instead of Ipad Player. From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 18:45:36 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 18:45:36 +0100 Subject: Serotek Didn't Reset It! Message-ID: Hello everybody Well; I have no idea why but Serotech has not assigned the additional free trial to our account on their network. That said, I had to create a second one as the first wouldn't let me sign in. Is there any way, does anybo on list know, to re-number accounts on their system? Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 7 19:16:59 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 04:16:59 +1000 Subject: iPeng for iOS Devices In-Reply-To: <98656ABA-C856-4CD8-A2FA-E3AFA06D7E16@mac-access.net> References: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> <4DC4D1C7.50809@internode.on.net> <4DC4EFD8.2010602@internode.on.net> <98656ABA-C856-4CD8-A2FA-E3AFA06D7E16@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <9C1CB1A1-F725-4AC9-A782-53B247202A67@internode.on.net> When you bought the Ipad Player it probably set itself to default so you'll have to change that. On 08/05/2011, at 3:29 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > We've lost the boom totally on our network for some reason which we're not quite sure of jus yet. > > Lynne > > On 7 May 2011, at 08:08, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Yep you can, follow the procedure I outlined in an earlier message but select Squeezebox Boom instead of Ipad Player. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 7 21:38:50 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 7 May 2011 21:38:50 +0100 Subject: iPeng for iOS Devices In-Reply-To: <9C1CB1A1-F725-4AC9-A782-53B247202A67@internode.on.net> References: <03AA8DEC-C21C-4BE5-A68F-C0A0901BD048@mac-access.net> <4DC4D1C7.50809@internode.on.net> <4DC4EFD8.2010602@internode.on.net> <98656ABA-C856-4CD8-A2FA-E3AFA06D7E16@mac-access.net> <9C1CB1A1-F725-4AC9-A782-53B247202A67@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <1552223A-3710-44DC-92E5-7DACB55D0D36@mac-access.net> It's now turned off, I eventually managed to drag the rest of the control out of the way. As a VoiceOver user you won't appreciate this because it isn't relevant to you. But as a visual user, you can drag the various element around. Once modified I put them back so that Gordon can identify with the basic layout. If, that is, we can ever get our player visible again. Currently it just isn't being seen. it's very odd because it is on our network and if I go to the "Settings>Advanced>Connect to server" option in the menu tree I can see our server. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun May 8 05:26:54 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 14:26:54 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox remote Control App for Iphone Message-ID: <822E71F0-84CF-4F89-A14F-D093F846F45C@internode.on.net> Hi everyone and in particular to the other Squeezebox users on list - I can count you all on my right hand . I discovered whilst searching on the Itunes store this morning a free "Squeezebox remote Controller" app for the Iphone it seems, doesn't come up under Ipad so perhaps users may be more at home with this app rather than Ipeng, nothing at all wrong with the Ipeng Squeezebox remote but it does contain a huge amount of controls and information whereas the free remote is very simple and in a similar layout to that of the Remote Control web page attached to your mysqueezebox.com account. I downloaded Ipeng for Iphone and the layouts of both Ipeng for Iphone and Ipad are considerably different and I suppose that's logical given the difference in screen sizes between both devices, functionality of both seems to be exactly the same. From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun May 8 07:07:55 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 16:07:55 +1000 Subject: Squeezebox Boom and display font Message-ID: Got asked a question about the display of the Squeezebox Boom and its fonts from a person who's considering the purchase of one of these things, he has some sight. I know that the display font can be varied but that's all I know. From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sun May 8 17:21:59 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sun, 08 May 2011 11:21:59 -0500 Subject: Setting the time and Date on the Zoom H1 Without Vision Message-ID: <201105081621.p48GLx2H093628@x.it.okstate.edu> It turns out that it is not terribly difficult. If the battery has been out long enough to loose the settings, the Zoom's time and date start on January 1 of 2010. To set the Zoom H1 time blind, Make a test file at some known time. Connect the USB to a computer and check the time stamp on your test file to see how far off it is. Hold down Record while turning on power for about 4 seconds. If using a radio set to 540 KHZ, Wait until it gets quieter. The Forward and Rewind buttons move you through each menu until you reach the desired number and then Pause moves you to the next menu. The menus go in the following order: Months days of the month year hours minutes and one last press of Pause to return to normal. A radio will make several zipping noises when you get out of the time setting menu. Example. It is 4 o'clock in the afternoon of May 8, 2011. You have had the battery out long enough to loose settings so your test file shows January 1, 2010 at 1 minute past Midnight. Unmount your Zoom from your computer and power it up in time setting mode. Remember that you start on the months first and you are already on January so just say the months to yourself as you press the Forward button until you reach May. Press Pause to go to the days of the month and count 2 through 8 as you press Forward. Press Pause to set the year and Press Forward once to get to 2011. After pressing Pause to get to the hours, remember that you are on the 0 hour so you will need to press Forward 16 times to reach 4 P.M. Now would be a good time to Press Pause to get out of the time setter and make another test recording to see how close you are. If you put the battery in pretty much on the hour, the Minutes will have kept up and you won't need to adjust them, but you get the idea. If you goofed and set the year when you thought you were setting the hour or something similar, you can always restartin time setting mode and change things again. You probably can't get much closer than the hearest minute, but at least your files will have reasonable time stamps for later reference. From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sun May 8 17:27:09 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sun, 08 May 2011 11:27:09 -0500 Subject: Setting the time and Date on the Zoom H1 Without Vision Message-ID: <201105081627.p48GR9Sl093661@x.it.okstate.edu> That last line should have been the nearest minute, not hearest minute. I'll have to type with both feet next time. Martin From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 9 07:06:53 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 8 May 2011 23:06:53 -0700 Subject: Setting the time and Date on the Zoom H1 Without Vision In-Reply-To: <201105081627.p48GR9Sl093661@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105081627.p48GR9Sl093661@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <71871620-899F-43DC-A4B4-1A4BDBE9D99E@gmail.com> Thanks for this. I have a similar tutorial someware on my messy hd regarding anothe recorder. i f I can find it I'll post. Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 8, 2011, at 9:27 AM, Martin McCormick wrote: > That last line should have been the nearest minute, not hearest > minute. I'll have to type with both feet next time. > > Martin > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Mon May 9 22:54:58 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 22:54:58 +0100 Subject: Window-Eyes 7.5 and IE 7 through 9 Message-ID: <95EB9A6E-20EC-4576-BEA9-E022841C54AB@mac-access.net> Hi all Well, if others using Window-Eyes are seeing what I am seeing with the current version, supposedly the latest and greatest, version 7.5, then perhaps it explains why GW Micro employees haven't answered my 3 support requests so far. Perhaps they are too ashamed too, (if not, they should be)! Perhaps they are simply being inundated with support requests along a similar line. If not, I'm amazed. Or perhaps they simply don't care. If so, that doesn't particularly surprise me given recent reports from others ho have attempted to contact them by E-Mail and by telephone. When I log into a website which uses Javascripting, as many of them do nowadays, of course, I'm getting errors such as: "Your browser does not support scripting. You cannot use our website without Javascript enabled. Please rever to your browser's documentation for more details." This is using Internet Explorer versions 7 through 9, as I already said, and Window-Eyes 7.5 I haven't tried using 7.2 because that would involve more effort than I'm prepared to waste my time putting into this. If GW can't be bothered wasting their time replying to my support request, then that's it, I've had it with that company! Lynne and I have already decided that the 7.5 upgrade, (if you can call it that), was going to be our final purchase from GW Micro, and this just confirms that our decision is a very correct one. But all the same, I wonder whether others are getting this type of error? This definitely isn't a browser setting as Lynne is able to use the same browser without Window-Eyes on the same websites, and she isn't having the problem. Soon as she loads Window-Eyes, the sites become unusable. So heaven only knows what they are doing with their accessibility buffers but it's clearly destroying the browser experience. If others are receiving this error, then the people who GW Micro have beta testing for them these days should be duly ashamed of themselves for this. In my day there, I'd have made such a stink about this that it would have been certain that GW was well aware of the problem pre-release. If they did do that and GW simply released anyway in order to meet deadlines and compete with Freedom Scientific, Serotek and the others in the market these days, then GW Micro aught to be boycotted by all of its customers. The software market is one where the vendor has all the aces because the poor long-suffering consumer can't ask for a refund. But rest assured that GW Micro has seem its last dime from this particular neck of the woods. Initial impressions of Window-Eyes 7.5 are, therefore, pretty poor and that is being kind to them. Gordon From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Tue May 10 03:03:51 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 09 May 2011 21:03:51 -0500 Subject: Window-Eyes 7.5 and IE 7 through 9 Message-ID: <201105100203.p4A23p9T002691@x.it.okstate.edu> I have no idea of how the mechanics of Windows Screen readers work but I am surprised that one gets javascript-related errors peculiar to Windo-eyes. I guess the errors come in when the javascript executes client-side routines and maybe the client, now equipped with Windo-Eyes, can no longer perform what the JS commands tell it to do. I am astounded to say the least. Is there any sort of debug-capture mode you can run to capture the session and send that in? They could at least watch it blow up as it did for you. You would think the least they could do was try to duplicate the condition. It is possible that they didn't try their code against all of the English selections available so that it might work in the United States and Canada, but it might not work in the UK, South Africa and Australia. I know that is a long stretch, but it is something to consider since it sounds like things are broken in a major way. Gordon Smith writes: > Hi all > > Well, if others using Window-Eyes are seeing what I am seeing with the > current version, supposedly the latest and greatest, version 7.5, then > perhaps it explains why GW Micro employees haven't answered my 3 support > requests so far. Perhaps they are too ashamed too, (if not, they should > be)! Perhaps they are simply being inundated with support requests along > a similar line. If not, I'm amazed. Or perhaps they simply don't care. > If so, that doesn't particularly surprise me given recent reports from > others ho have attempted to contact them by E-Mail and by telephone. > > When I log into a website which uses Javascripting, as many of them do > nowadays, of course, I'm getting errors such as: > > "Your browser does not support scripting. You cannot use our website > without Javascript enabled. Please rever to your browser's documentation > for more details." > > This is using Internet Explorer versions 7 through 9, as I already said, > and Window-Eyes 7.5 I haven't tried using 7.2 because that would involve > more effort than I'm prepared to waste my time putting into this. If GW > can't be bothered wasting their time replying to my support request, then > that's it, I've had it with that company! > > Lynne and I have already decided that the 7.5 upgrade, (if you can call > it that), was going to be our final purchase from GW Micro, and this just > confirms that our decision is a very correct one. But all the same, I > wonder whether others are getting this type of error? This definitely > isn't a browser setting as Lynne is able to use the same browser without > Window-Eyes on the same websites, and she isn't having the problem. Soon > as she loads Window-Eyes, the sites become unusable. So heaven only > knows what they are doing with their accessibility buffers but it's > clearly destroying the browser experience. If others are receiving this > error, then the people who GW Micro have beta testing for them these days > should be duly ashamed of themselves for this. In my day there, I'd have > made such a stink about this that it would have been certain that GW was > well aware of the problem pre-release. If they did do that and GW simply > released anyway in order to meet deadlines and com > pete with Freedom Scientific, Serotek and the others in the market these > days, then GW Micro aught to be boycotted by all of its customers. > > The software market is one where the vendor has all the aces because the > poor long-suffering consumer can't ask for a refund. But rest assured > that GW Micro has seem its last dime from this particular neck of the > woods. > > Initial impressions of Window-Eyes 7.5 are, therefore, pretty poor and > that is being kind to them. From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 10 21:31:36 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 13:31:36 -0700 Subject: Microsoft will acquire Skype Message-ID: from the big blog: Microsoft will acquire Skype I?m excited to announce that Skype and Microsoft have entered into a definitive agreement whereby Microsoft will acquire Skype for $8.5 billion US. Once the acquisition closes, Skype will become a new business division of Microsoft. It is an exciting day for all of us at Skype ? we?ve taken a significant step towards realising our vision of making the world a better, more connected place. I believe this acquisition is the very best way to extend Skype?s reach and will allow us to bring real-time video and voice communications to more people around the world than ever before. The combination of Skype and Microsoft will directly benefit all of you who use Skype by ushering in a new era of generative ways for everyone to communicate. What I love most about this company are the people who have made Skype a verb. Not only the team here at Skype and our partners, but everyone like you who uses Skype every day ? you are the people who have made Skype what it is. Once the acquisition is complete, Skype will operate as a new business division of Microsoft, and I look forward to working with the team as president of Microsoft Skype to write the next chapter of the Skype story. Onwards! http://bit.ly/lERTeT note from me lol! I'm not at all excited about this. I hope skype will continu to make it accessibil for all platforms. Take care all. From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 10 22:18:38 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 14:18:38 -0700 Subject: Get More Out of Your Monthly Data by Using Onavo's Free Data-Compressing App [Apps] Message-ID: I'm actually using this and it is working very good. they are working on audio and video at the moment and even VOIP. enjoy. Get More Out of Your Monthly Data by Using Onavo's Free Data-Compressing App [Apps] This is a necessity download for any iOS user?particularly if you tend to reach the miserly monthly data cap your network imposes on you. It compresses emails, apps or web suring to as much as 90 per cent! More ? http://bit.ly/lNY5yk From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 10 22:20:36 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 14:20:36 -0700 Subject: New VOIP Feature: 911 Calls You [Emergency] Message-ID: <983009EA-F628-44AE-BD71-D83B1A18870C@gmail.com> New VOIP Feature: 911 Calls You [Emergency] Yeah, 911 is a joke in your town, so it's nice to know about family emergencies at home when you're away. Ooma's new notification service helps make that happen that, pinging you remotely when your home phone calls 911. More ? http://bit.ly/kvpObQ From gordon at mac-access.net Wed May 11 10:18:18 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 10:18:18 +0100 Subject: Window-Eyes 7.5 and IE 7 through 9 In-Reply-To: <201105100203.p4A23p9T002691@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105100203.p4A23p9T002691@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Hello Martin I'm still no closer to a resolution and, to be honest, I've given up. Gordon On 10 May 2011, at 03:03, Martin McCormick wrote: I have no idea of how the mechanics of Windows Screen readers work but I am surprised that one gets javascript-related errors peculiar to Windo-eyes. I guess the errors come in when the javascript executes client-side routines and maybe the client, now equipped with Windo-Eyes, can no longer perform what the JS commands tell it to do. I am astounded to say the least. Is there any sort of debug-capture mode you can run to capture the session and send that in? They could at least watch it blow up as it did for you. You would think the least they could do was try to duplicate the condition. It is possible that they didn't try their code against all of the English selections available so that it might work in the United States and Canada, but it might not work in the UK, South Africa and Australia. I know that is a long stretch, but it is something to consider since it sounds like things are broken in a major way. From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Wed May 11 14:07:52 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 08:07:52 -0500 Subject: Fools can Teach Us Message-ID: <201105111307.p4BD7qne011911@x.it.okstate.edu> This teachable moment comes from a young man who stole a Mac Book from a building on our campus last Thursday and was stupid enough to put it on our network 4 days later. The rightful owner apparently had saved a record of his Ethernet addresses for both his wireless and wired Ethernet adaptors so the police asked us to look for the addresses in logs that we keep on various systems. We said we would be glad to, but we had not had much luck in the past few years we had been doing this because most thieves never put their loot back on the network, here. I was actually reworking my piece of the puzzle last Monday to make the output a little more usable when it suddenly began showing output. I actually double-checked the hardware addresses to make sure we were tracking the right system and we were. A coworker was able to use what is called a "heat map" on our wireless network to pinpoint the actual room number of the activity. We called the police and they eventually cought up with this fellow and, yes, he had the stolen Mac Book and he did get to ride in a police car and see the inside of the Payne County Jail. For the rest of us who get our computers the normal way, you know, by walking in to a store, paying money, etc, the lesson is to make a record of all your interface adaptors and store it somewhere safe so that if someone broke in or you left your laptop somewhere accidentally, it is remotely possible that these addresses could aid in getting it back. All Unix systems including Mac's running OSX have the ifconfig command that you can run from a command shell. This command will list all the interfaces on your system and their Ethernet or hardware addresses. There is a lot of output that you don't need, but look for lines like: en0: flags=8863 mtu 1500 ether F0:35:00:f4:4c:bA It is unique for each interface but has that same format. You can also find it in the "about this mac" section dealing with network interfaces. You need to save the wired Ethernet address, the airport or WiFi address and Bluetooth address if you have one. P.C.'s running Windows will have all that information in the network properties window. As for iphones, ipods and ipads, I don't know if you can look that up on the device, itself, but you might also look on any dhcp servers you own that may have given these devices an IP address. They should show the Ethernet address of the adaptor using that IP address. It's a long shot, but sometimes thieves are that stupid and this time, the owner got his Mac Book back. If the spirits of the dead live among us, Charles Darwin must have had a true belly laugh last Monday, watching this perfect example of how some members of the species simply do not have enough common sense to stay out of trouble. From support at mac-access.net Wed May 11 23:07:13 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 23:07:13 +0100 Subject: Online Backup Message-ID: <249C92BC-CFD1-4B27-9BD1-DE0378E58459@mac-access.net> Hello everybody This has been mentioned to us by listers several times. So i'm just going to sneak break our rules once and ask this question. Please reply to this off list, not on, if you are interested or have questions. Gordon and I are working right now on an "Online Backup" service solution. Is anybody interested? Please, again, reply off list. We are still working on the details but it will be a heck of a lot cheaper than Droop Box or Send Space. If anybody replies to this thread on list it will be ignored. Thank you. Lynne From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 13 22:01:57 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 13 May 2011 14:01:57 -0700 Subject: Access Denied! 18 Places Google Maps Won't Let You See [Republished] Message-ID: Access Denied! 18 Places Google Maps Won't Let You See [Republished] Google has always tried to keep a very open policy with the general public, but it can't always be entirely forthcoming, as is the case with Google Maps. Google has very little say in what gets censored and what doesn't, be it for personal privacy or national security. Finding censored objects on Google Maps isn't the easiest task, as most look like imaging anomalies, rather than some big black bar with "CENSORED" written in large text. More ? http://gizmo.do/mtwIs1 From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 13 22:05:10 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 13 May 2011 14:05:10 -0700 Subject: Tron-Esque Curtains Not Only Cancel Out Noise, They Sample it in Cool Music Mixes For Your Speakers [Design] Message-ID: <06BC26BB-50B7-4E45-BF85-64EAA862E539@gmail.com> Tron-Esque Curtains Not Only Cancel Out Noise, They Sample it in Cool Music Mixes For Your Speakers [Design] These noise-cancelling curtains go a step further than the last drapes we saw, as they actually replace all the humdrum from outside with music. Music created from the honks of cars outside! More ? http://gizmo.do/jeN5wz From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 14 04:12:22 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 14 May 2011 04:12:22 +0100 Subject: DocuScan Plus for Windows Message-ID: <76A6FA39-F020-4FD5-8F4D-1719F1536644@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Has anybody tried installing Docuscan Plus under Windows yet? I ask because we tried it last night and we got a very strange error under Windows 7. Firstly, System Access 2 Go loaded and then came up with an error saying: "System Access 2 Go couldn't detect your web browser. This is most likely a problem with SA, please call Serotek technical support". Firstly, why does one need to use System Access 2 go in order to use DocuScan Plus? Why can't they simply make it an independent application rather than making people use their other products as well? I haven't seen other software products by, for instance, GW Micro so here's the question. Is it "usual" for accessibility vendors to adopt this kind of strategy? I know that Window-Eyes, for instance, has a self-voicing installation programme. And yes; I can understand that since Window-Eyes is a screen-reader and, as such, it's fairly logical to assume that the user won't have such a product available under most circumstances when they install it. But DocuScan Plus is not a screen-reader, it is an OCR package. So why does it need to employ a screen-reader at all? Or perhaps, it would be more appropriate to say why "must" it employ a screen-reader? I remember seeing Kurzweil 1000 a while ago when we installed it for our friend Gillian. From memory, Kurzweil gives you the option as to whether or not you require a talking installation. That's fair enough, but it seems that DocuScan Plus simply won't run if there is no instance of System Access 2 Go running. This seems a little silly to me; but perhaps somebody else can explain the logic? Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 14 11:04:38 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 14 May 2011 20:04:38 +1000 Subject: Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player Message-ID: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch From support at mac-access.net Sat May 14 20:46:26 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Sat, 14 May 2011 20:46:26 +0100 Subject: New Member Welcome Message-ID: <8463050A-0491-4B55-A6C7-6B3C61328A42@mac-access.net> Hello everybody It is traditional when new members join the Techno-Chat group that Gordon and I try to welcome the new member(s) personally. In keeping with that tradition, we are delighted to welcome Hello everybody Please do not reply to this thread on list unless your reply has a direct relevance to their Mac use or interest. It is traditional when new members join the Mac Access Dot Net email forum that Gordon and I try to welcome the new member(s) personally. In keeping with that tradition, we are delighted to welcome John Turley to our number. We are gratified by the fact that Mac Access is growing globally. We hope that you will find Mac-Access at mac-access.net a pleasant, friendly and worthwhile place to be. In here you will find a wealth of knowledge, and people with a variety of skill levels ranging from the total novice, to the application developers with advanced skills. Then there are those who don't yet own a Mac, but have a keen interest. We hope you will feel free to post your questions and constructive comment, whatever your skill levels may be. Be assured, there will be none of the ridiculing and flaming which we know takes place in other groups. That kind of behaviour is not tolerated in Mac-Access. Anything Mac OS and iOS is on topic for this group. In the case of virtualisation applications such as Fusion and Parallels Desktop, the configuration of the applications themselves, plus the configuration of the virtual machines is on topic. However, the configuration of Windows or any other operating systems within that virtual machine is off topic. The exception to that is if you're using another instance of OSX within the virtual machine. This has always been a bit of a grey area; but we hope this clarifies the position. If you have any list-related queries, please do not hesitate to contact either Gordon and myself, (the list owners), at , or one of our very capable assistant list controllers; Anne Robertson, or James Austin, and we will be happy to help you. Once again, a very warm welcome to the group. We hope you find your membership an enjoyable experience. Finally, I would like to add that currently, we are offering all Mac-Access. members the opportunity to purchase the Take Control Of Your Mac publications, published by Tidbits.com, at an 80% discount. If you want to know more, please contact the above support address. For a listing of the books available please visit: http://www.takecontrolbooks.com/catalog-alpha Lynne to our number. Anything related to technology is open for discussion in this group. Members frequently post links to interesting articles in this group. Whilst the primary function of Techno-chat is discussion, we recognise that these articles are often of value. That is why we encourage members to post links, rather than the full articles themselves, to the group. This way, members have the option of whether to follow up the articles, or to discard them. We hope that you will find Techno-Chat a pleasant, friendly and worthwhile place to be. if you have any list-related queries, please don't hesitate to contact either Gordon and myself, support at tft-bbs.co.uk or our very able and capable assistant list controller Mary Stores, mstores at indiana.edu and we'll be pleased to help you. Lynne From marrie12 at gmail.com Sat May 14 20:49:41 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sat, 14 May 2011 12:49:41 -0700 Subject: Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word > http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 > > I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. > > Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. > > Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 14 23:39:17 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 08:39:17 +1000 Subject: Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <86F659A6-D31A-4B2D-84AC-746506323A4F@internode.on.net> Okay well I think we're talking about different thinks here, I suggest you read the review I gave a link to in my message. On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >> >> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >> >> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >> >> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 14 23:52:57 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 08:52:57 +1000 Subject: Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >> >> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >> >> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >> >> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 15 05:12:54 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sat, 14 May 2011 21:12:54 -0700 Subject: Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> Yep tha'ts the same one. the voice will be at 32kbps mono and the headphone mic jack wheny ypu plug in a mic should be 128kbps mp3. Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 14, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. > > As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. > > Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. > > Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. > > And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. > > Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. > > I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here > > > On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. >> Sarah Alawami >> >> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >> >> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >> >> website: http://music.marrie.org >> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >> >> On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >>> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >>> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >>> >>> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >>> >>> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >>> >>> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun May 15 05:43:39 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 14:43:39 +1000 Subject: Audio Recorders was Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4DCF59FB.1060808@internode.on.net> Okay, well I'll read the review I saw again but I'm sure it mentioned that you could record in stereo using the 3.5MM jack so perhaps the 32K you mention only refers to the built-in microphone? In any case 32K is certainly good enough for a clear mono voice recording so I don't have any issue with that, one can get a bit picky too often . If I want really nice recordings then I have a very nice audio recorder in the form of the Zoom H1 which by the way, has been the biggest selling Zoom audio recorder in history and I'm not at all surprised to hear that given its ease of operation. Zoom also make a hand-held video recorder which I'm thinking of buying down the track. On 15/05/2011 2:12 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Yep tha'ts the same one. the voice will be at 32kbps mono and the headphone mic jack wheny ypu plug in a mic should be 128kbps mp3. > > Take care. > > > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 14, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. >> >> As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. >> >> Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. >> >> Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. >> >> And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. >> >> Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. >> >> I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here >> >> >> On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> >>> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. >>> Sarah Alawami >>> >>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>> >>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>> >>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>> >>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>> >>>> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >>>> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >>>> >>>> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >>>> >>>> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >>>> >>>> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>> >>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>> >>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 15 19:55:30 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 11:55:30 -0700 Subject: Audio Recorders was Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <4DCF59FB.1060808@internode.on.net> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> <4DCF59FB.1060808@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <84BC2920-3A8C-486E-8A55-F2C65D264BA0@gmail.com> Ah cool! 32kbps is good for voice but it sounds like the person is under water when they say an s or it might sound like they have spit in there mouth. lol! Take care and yeah I believe you can record in stereo with he headphone mic jack. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 14, 2011, at 9:43 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Okay, well I'll read the review I saw again but I'm sure it mentioned that you could record in stereo using the 3.5MM jack so perhaps the 32K you mention only refers to the built-in microphone? In any case 32K is certainly good enough for a clear mono voice recording so I don't have any issue with that, one can get a bit picky too often . > > If I want really nice recordings then I have a very nice audio recorder in the form of the Zoom H1 which by the way, has been the biggest selling Zoom audio recorder in history and I'm not at all surprised to hear that given its ease of operation. > > Zoom also make a hand-held video recorder which I'm thinking of buying down the track. > > On 15/05/2011 2:12 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> Yep tha'ts the same one. the voice will be at 32kbps mono and the headphone mic jack wheny ypu plug in a mic should be 128kbps mp3. >> >> Take care. >> >> >> Sarah Alawami >> >> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >> >> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >> >> website: http://music.marrie.org >> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >> >> On May 14, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >>> Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. >>> >>> As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. >>> >>> Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. >>> >>> Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. >>> >>> And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. >>> >>> Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. >>> >>> I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here >>> >>> >>> On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> >>>> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. >>>> Sarah Alawami >>>> >>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>> >>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>> >>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>> >>>>> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >>>>> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >>>>> >>>>> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >>>>> >>>>> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >>>>> >>>>> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>> >>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>> >>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>> >>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>> >>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 16 00:38:23 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 09:38:23 +1000 Subject: Audio Recorders was Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <84BC2920-3A8C-486E-8A55-F2C65D264BA0@gmail.com> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> <4DCF59FB.1060808@internode.on.net> <84BC2920-3A8C-486E-8A55-F2C65D264BA0@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4DD063EF.9000800@internode.on.net> I beg to differ with you on that point about voice recordings at 32K, depends on how they're done and I'll take what the reviewer said of the Milestone 312 on-board at the moment, he describes the voice recordings made on the machine as "Clear"! I should have my unit next week. I've been discussing the Milestone 312 with someone else I know who has ordered one of these and the only concern we have is the USB port, given the small size of the thing we're wondering just how long the port will last before it gets broken? We hope perhaps that Milestone will consider adding a Bluetooth option if at all possible for transfers and audio of course, most computers have bluetooth facilities these days. On 16/05/2011 4:55 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Ah cool! 32kbps is good for voice but it sounds like the person is under water when they say an s or it might sound like they have spit in there mouth. lol! > > Take care and yeah I believe you can record in stereo with he headphone mic jack. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 14, 2011, at 9:43 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> Okay, well I'll read the review I saw again but I'm sure it mentioned that you could record in stereo using the 3.5MM jack so perhaps the 32K you mention only refers to the built-in microphone? In any case 32K is certainly good enough for a clear mono voice recording so I don't have any issue with that, one can get a bit picky too often. >> >> If I want really nice recordings then I have a very nice audio recorder in the form of the Zoom H1 which by the way, has been the biggest selling Zoom audio recorder in history and I'm not at all surprised to hear that given its ease of operation. >> >> Zoom also make a hand-held video recorder which I'm thinking of buying down the track. >> >> On 15/05/2011 2:12 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> Yep tha'ts the same one. the voice will be at 32kbps mono and the headphone mic jack wheny ypu plug in a mic should be 128kbps mp3. >>> >>> Take care. >>> >>> >>> Sarah Alawami >>> >>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>> >>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>> >>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>> >>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>> >>>> Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. >>>> >>>> As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. >>>> >>>> Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. >>>> >>>> Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. >>>> >>>> And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. >>>> >>>> Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. >>>> >>>> I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here >>>> >>>> >>>> On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>> >>>>> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. >>>>> Sarah Alawami >>>>> >>>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>>> >>>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>>> >>>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >>>>>> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >>>>>> >>>>>> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >>>>>> >>>>>> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >>>>>> >>>>>> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>> >>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>> >>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>> >>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>> >>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>> >>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>> >>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From tsiegel at softcon.com Mon May 16 01:41:37 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 19:41:37 -0500 Subject: riaa is at it again Message-ID: <0A495B44-76E7-44BE-A037-9034A5EED38B@softcon.com> Here are a couple articles about riaa. In one, they won 105 million dollars in a suit against limewire. In another, we have finally been told about practices by record labels to effectively steal music to which they didn't have the rights to. They have actually been ordered to pay 45 million for this infringment, but we all know, the artists who were stripped of their earnings via this method won't see any of it. There's even more nonsense going on, and some of the articles are linked from these pages. First, the record labels being made to pay 45 million, that article is here. http://www.dailytech.com/Major+Record+Labels+Forced+to+Pay+45M+USD+for +Pirating+Music/article20632.htm And, the limewire article: http://www.dailytech.com/RIAA+Scores+105M+USD+from+Limewire+Gives +Nothing+to+Artists/article21630.htm And, here's an article about riaa spending 64 million dollars just to prosecute for a whopping 1.4 million. Great economics there. Yep, think I'll hire them to run my company for me. http://www.dailytech.com/RIAA+Spent+64M+to+Win+14M+From+Pirates +Between+06+and+08/article19034.htm And yet, our local flee markets are absolutely chalked full of morons selling bootlegged dvds, and nobody cares enough to even tell me who to report them to. Police don't care, riaa doesn't deal with movies, and I can't find a freaking individual anywhere who will actually do anything. Apparently, downloading a song to see if you like the band is bad, because you might actually buy a legitimate copy of the music if you like it. But, purchasing dvds that have been copied illegally is ok, because then you don't need to purchase the movie itself. I sense a backwards approach here. Perhaps we should make all our laws like that. Wouldn't that make things interesting. From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 16 02:37:41 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 18:37:41 -0700 Subject: Audio Recorders was Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <4DD063EF.9000800@internode.on.net> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> <4DCF59FB.1060808@internode.on.net> <84BC2920-3A8C-486E-8A55-F2C65D264BA0@gmail.com> <4DD063EF.9000800@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <2D89BD1D-2EC5-466F-9C8F-608436E7501C@gmail.com> lol. my ears are pretty good in that department. In my sound engineering classes I was taught to hear different bitrates so I record everything at 320kbps but ah well to each his or her own. I'm done now. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 15, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > I beg to differ with you on that point about voice recordings at 32K, depends on how they're done and I'll take what the reviewer said of the Milestone 312 on-board at the moment, he describes the voice recordings made on the machine as "Clear"! > > I should have my unit next week. > > I've been discussing the Milestone 312 with someone else I know who has ordered one of these and the only concern we have is the USB port, given the small size of the thing we're wondering just how long the port will last before it gets broken? We hope perhaps that Milestone will consider adding a Bluetooth option if at all possible for transfers and audio of course, most computers have bluetooth facilities these days. > > > > On 16/05/2011 4:55 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> Ah cool! 32kbps is good for voice but it sounds like the person is under water when they say an s or it might sound like they have spit in there mouth. lol! >> >> Take care and yeah I believe you can record in stereo with he headphone mic jack. >> Sarah Alawami >> >> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >> >> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >> >> website: http://music.marrie.org >> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >> >> On May 14, 2011, at 9:43 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >>> Okay, well I'll read the review I saw again but I'm sure it mentioned that you could record in stereo using the 3.5MM jack so perhaps the 32K you mention only refers to the built-in microphone? In any case 32K is certainly good enough for a clear mono voice recording so I don't have any issue with that, one can get a bit picky too often. >>> >>> If I want really nice recordings then I have a very nice audio recorder in the form of the Zoom H1 which by the way, has been the biggest selling Zoom audio recorder in history and I'm not at all surprised to hear that given its ease of operation. >>> >>> Zoom also make a hand-held video recorder which I'm thinking of buying down the track. >>> >>> On 15/05/2011 2:12 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>> Yep tha'ts the same one. the voice will be at 32kbps mono and the headphone mic jack wheny ypu plug in a mic should be 128kbps mp3. >>>> >>>> Take care. >>>> >>>> >>>> Sarah Alawami >>>> >>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>> >>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>> >>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. >>>>> >>>>> As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. >>>>> >>>>> Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. >>>>> >>>>> Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. >>>>> >>>>> And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. >>>>> >>>>> Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. >>>>> >>>>> I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. >>>>>> Sarah Alawami >>>>>> >>>>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>>>> >>>>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>>>> >>>>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >>>>>>> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>> >>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>> >>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>> >>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>> >>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>> >>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>> >>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 16 05:52:33 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 14:52:33 +1000 Subject: Audio Recorders was Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <2D89BD1D-2EC5-466F-9C8F-608436E7501C@gmail.com> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> <4DCF59FB.1060808@internode.on.net> <84BC2920-3A8C-486E-8A55-F2C65D264BA0@gmail.com> <4DD063EF.9000800@internode.on.net> <2D89BD1D-2EC5-466F-9C8F-608436E7501C@gmail.com> Message-ID: <13992470-CCA5-484F-AEAD-A985F305E8B4@internode.on.net> The Audio Engineering classes don't really come into it, if the Milestone 312 does what it claims and the review is accurate then that's all I'm concerned about and this will mean that I've bought a product of the quality I read about . On 16/05/2011, at 11:37 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > lol. my ears are pretty good in that department. In my sound engineering classes I was taught to hear different bitrates so I record everything at 320kbps but ah well to each his or her own. I'm done now. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 15, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> I beg to differ with you on that point about voice recordings at 32K, depends on how they're done and I'll take what the reviewer said of the Milestone 312 on-board at the moment, he describes the voice recordings made on the machine as "Clear"! >> >> I should have my unit next week. >> >> I've been discussing the Milestone 312 with someone else I know who has ordered one of these and the only concern we have is the USB port, given the small size of the thing we're wondering just how long the port will last before it gets broken? We hope perhaps that Milestone will consider adding a Bluetooth option if at all possible for transfers and audio of course, most computers have bluetooth facilities these days. >> >> >> >> On 16/05/2011 4:55 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> Ah cool! 32kbps is good for voice but it sounds like the person is under water when they say an s or it might sound like they have spit in there mouth. lol! >>> >>> Take care and yeah I believe you can record in stereo with he headphone mic jack. >>> Sarah Alawami >>> >>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>> >>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>> >>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>> >>> On May 14, 2011, at 9:43 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>> >>>> Okay, well I'll read the review I saw again but I'm sure it mentioned that you could record in stereo using the 3.5MM jack so perhaps the 32K you mention only refers to the built-in microphone? In any case 32K is certainly good enough for a clear mono voice recording so I don't have any issue with that, one can get a bit picky too often. >>>> >>>> If I want really nice recordings then I have a very nice audio recorder in the form of the Zoom H1 which by the way, has been the biggest selling Zoom audio recorder in history and I'm not at all surprised to hear that given its ease of operation. >>>> >>>> Zoom also make a hand-held video recorder which I'm thinking of buying down the track. >>>> >>>> On 15/05/2011 2:12 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>> Yep tha'ts the same one. the voice will be at 32kbps mono and the headphone mic jack wheny ypu plug in a mic should be 128kbps mp3. >>>>> >>>>> Take care. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sarah Alawami >>>>> >>>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>>> >>>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>>> >>>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>>> >>>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. >>>>>> >>>>>> As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. >>>>>> >>>>>> Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. >>>>>> >>>>>> Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. >>>>>> >>>>>> And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. >>>>>>> Sarah Alawami >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>>>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>>>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >>>>>>>> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>> >>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>> >>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>> >>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>> >>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>> >>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>> >>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 16 07:03:55 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 15 May 2011 23:03:55 -0700 Subject: Audio Recorders was Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player In-Reply-To: <13992470-CCA5-484F-AEAD-A985F305E8B4@internode.on.net> References: <4DCE53B6.7000600@internode.on.net> <1070223D-3A82-41C7-8314-4A078AA5478D@gmail.com> <23C9550E-79CF-4301-A90B-B1B64600BC60@internode.on.net> <568C440E-E871-44D0-B4E0-10711F81794B@gmail.com> <4DCF59FB.1060808@internode.on.net> <84BC2920-3A8C-486E-8A55-F2C65D264BA0@gmail.com> <4DD063EF.9000800@internode.on.net> <2D89BD1D-2EC5-466F-9C8F-608436E7501C@gmail.com> <13992470-CCA5-484F-AEAD-A985F305E8B4@internode.on.net> Message-ID: but there's one problem. I don't see a way of monitoring what you are doing if you can't hear it. that is if you plug in the mic in and your audio source is too loud, I don't think you will find a way of knowing what happened. this is the thing that prevented me from buying one. I did like the audio quality of the stereo mics neil used in his review though. and the stereo sound was ok. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 15, 2011, at 9:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > The Audio Engineering classes don't really come into it, if the Milestone 312 does what it claims and the review is accurate then that's all I'm concerned about and this will mean that I've bought a product of the quality I read about . > > > On 16/05/2011, at 11:37 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> lol. my ears are pretty good in that department. In my sound engineering classes I was taught to hear different bitrates so I record everything at 320kbps but ah well to each his or her own. I'm done now. >> Sarah Alawami >> >> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >> >> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >> >> website: http://music.marrie.org >> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >> >> On May 15, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >>> I beg to differ with you on that point about voice recordings at 32K, depends on how they're done and I'll take what the reviewer said of the Milestone 312 on-board at the moment, he describes the voice recordings made on the machine as "Clear"! >>> >>> I should have my unit next week. >>> >>> I've been discussing the Milestone 312 with someone else I know who has ordered one of these and the only concern we have is the USB port, given the small size of the thing we're wondering just how long the port will last before it gets broken? We hope perhaps that Milestone will consider adding a Bluetooth option if at all possible for transfers and audio of course, most computers have bluetooth facilities these days. >>> >>> >>> >>> On 16/05/2011 4:55 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>> Ah cool! 32kbps is good for voice but it sounds like the person is under water when they say an s or it might sound like they have spit in there mouth. lol! >>>> >>>> Take care and yeah I believe you can record in stereo with he headphone mic jack. >>>> Sarah Alawami >>>> >>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>> >>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>> >>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>> >>>> On May 14, 2011, at 9:43 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay, well I'll read the review I saw again but I'm sure it mentioned that you could record in stereo using the 3.5MM jack so perhaps the 32K you mention only refers to the built-in microphone? In any case 32K is certainly good enough for a clear mono voice recording so I don't have any issue with that, one can get a bit picky too often. >>>>> >>>>> If I want really nice recordings then I have a very nice audio recorder in the form of the Zoom H1 which by the way, has been the biggest selling Zoom audio recorder in history and I'm not at all surprised to hear that given its ease of operation. >>>>> >>>>> Zoom also make a hand-held video recorder which I'm thinking of buying down the track. >>>>> >>>>> On 15/05/2011 2:12 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>>> Yep tha'ts the same one. the voice will be at 32kbps mono and the headphone mic jack wheny ypu plug in a mic should be 128kbps mp3. >>>>>> >>>>>> Take care. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Sarah Alawami >>>>>> >>>>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>>>> >>>>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>>>> >>>>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>>>> >>>>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:52 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Okay to follow up, I've just gone to the product page at and yep it does describe the player as a credit card size device, that's something the review I mentioned didn't describe the player as but never mind. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> As for the recording quality? Well I was unable to find any specifications on that score but the literature does say that the unit is a voice recorder and the review I pointed to in my original email says it has settings for line in to record stereo recordings but in all honesty, I'll be buying one for its quality playback and design, I like the idea that plenty of room has been left for further hardware and software developments and I also like the idea of being able to use such things as a colour reader and a barcode scanner with this device. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Another thing I find appealing with the Milestone 312 is the fact you don't need any software to copy files from your computer to the device, you just plug the device in to your USB port of your computer and copy. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yep, you can do that with a Victor Reader Stream I know but then you have to know exactly where to copy the files to, for example if you're copying books then you need to put them in the appropriate folder on the Stream, if you're copying Music then you need to put those music files into the "Music" folder and on it goes. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And finally, the amount of buttons the 312 has sounds good, only 6 and the VR Stream has far too many in my opinion. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yes, there are things which still need to be done but I'm told that Milestone's upgrade department is "On The Ball" when it comes to listening to customers, this is evident when you put the 312 against the 311 I believe. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'm going to have to deal with Bones directly to import the unit it seems as we have no reps for the company out here >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 15/05/2011, at 5:49 AM, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Is that the thing that is the size of a credit card? the thing that bugs me is the mic acts as the headphone/line in jack as well and you cannot hear what youa re doingwith it and also the recording quality wiht the recording mic is 32kbps mono. good for speach but no. >>>>>>>> Sarah Alawami >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> website: http://music.marrie.org >>>>>>>> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >>>>>>>> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On May 14, 2011, at 3:04 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Just read a review of the Milestone 312 and you can find it in the May edition of Access word >>>>>>>>> http://www.afb.org/afbpress/pub.asp?DocID=aw120507 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I had been toying with the idea of a purchase of the Plextalk Pocket though the Milestone device sounds far more interesting because of the add-on hardware and software functionality. Hardware functionality includes colour reader and barcode scanner. Software add-ons include an agenda and scheduler app. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Unit is smaller than Plextalk Pocket and lighter. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Milestone Web site http://www.bones.ch >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>>> >>>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> >>>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>>> >>>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>>> >>>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>>> >>>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>>> >>>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> >>>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>>> >>>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>>> >>>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Mon May 16 14:27:17 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 08:27:17 -0500 Subject: Audio Recorders was Now here's a very nice sounding Audio player Message-ID: <201105161327.p4GDRHDt042603@x.it.okstate.edu> Ah, the world of digital sound. Let me confuse things a bit with some information. It all starts out rather simply. We speak in to a microphone and the vibrations in the air turn in to alternating current that has the same frequency and wave form as our voice. Alexander Graham Bell even used that argument in court when a man named Gray tried to steal Bell's patent as gray had tried to also patent a similar device and was only a few hours late. Those electrical signals are directly analogous to our voice which is why we call non-digital media analog. You can electrically measure the polarity and amplitude of the vibrations and, with the aid of a device called an analog-to-digital converter, assign a number to each voltage. Enter the first skunk at the picnic, so to speak. Your analog-to-digital or A/D converter has an output expressed in bits, not bits per second just yet, just bits. Those bits can either be 0 or 1 and the number of bits that are used express how many possible combinations of 0 and 1 we can set each time. If you have 8 bits, you can set 256 separate values. The number is 2 to the NTH power. The A/D converters used in hifi systems are at least 16 bits wide or more. a 16-bit converter can display 65536 different numbers. The more bits there are, the easier it is to completely reproduce the original audio. So, if you only have 4 or 8 bits, things could sound bad because the output wave now looks like a bunch of stairs rather than smooth curves. So too few bits can ruin the sound. The next sound destroyer is a little more technical. It has to do with how many samples per second you take. There is a law of physics called the Nyquist principle after its discoverer that says that you can not reproduce a wave form with less than two samples per wave. This means that if the best human ears hear up to 20000 Hertz, you've got to take at least 40000 samples per second to capture all possible sounds. That is called the Nyquist Frequency. That's how we got 44100 samples per second for CD's. But wait. There's more. If you just sample raw audio at that frequency, any notes or overtones that are very near or higher than 22 kilohertz will mix with the sampling, itself and produce false sounds called aliases so a digital sound recorder must not only sample at the right rate to pick everything up we can hear, but it has to have a well-designed filter that deliberately stops it from hearing any higher frequencies or the recording sounds like rubbish. The playback of a digital sound stream has some pitfalls of its own. The companion to the A/D converter is the D/A or digital-to-analog converter. That device takes all those bits or numbers and turns them back in to electric currents that should almost exactly mirror the currents that came out of the microphone. We're not done yet! If you looked at a wave form of that A/D converter, it is a bunch of stair steps again, all be they maybe very tiny, but they are still not smooth. You have a second low-pass filter on the playback system that is much like the one on the recorder that smoothes out those steps and makes them as close to the original wave form as possible. If those filters are not good or malfunction, the recording and the playback will both suffer. So, of course, bit rate matters, but so does the low-pass filters and sampling rate. Last, but not least, here is where it gets really messy. When you digitize audio, those digits take up lots of room on a disk. If you try to send them over a radio, they take up far more room than can be allowed for each radio station so something has to be done to make room. That is compression and there is lossless compression like .zip files and other archival systems and then there is lossy compression which is like mpeg3 and Sony's PASC and something called LPC which stands for Linear Predictive Coding and is used in cell phones and two-way radio and some recording systems to jam as much sound in to as small a storage space or as narrow a band of radio frequencies as humanly possible. The sound quality suffers but not enough to make it totally unintelligible, just mostly so. Lossy compression deliberately throws away some of the sound because research says you won't miss it. In well-done forms of MP3, that's mostly true. The pieces of software or hardware that turn raw digital sound, called PCM, in to MP3 or LPC streams are called coder/decoders or codecs. Good MP3 codecs do sound good even if the bit rate is down to 64 bits per channel. I've heard other mp3's that would make you want to throw up they are so bad. My point in this long ramble is that you can't say that this or that bit rate is bad or good. Higher is usually better, but the codecs and the Nyquist filtering in the system can also make all the difference in the world. Those of you who have Unix systems other than Mac's might see if you have /dev/dsp on your system. With no special settings, /dev/dsp produces an 8-bit audio stream at 8000 samples per second. It makes music sound a little worse than AM radio, but voice sounds amazingly good all be it a bit flat like a good telephone line. It would be fine for dictation and communication, just not good for music. It is an interesting thing to listen to, keeping in mind that it is 8000 samples per second meaning that the highest frequency it will pass is 4000 HZ. One of my older computers at home is a Gateway and the others are Dells. The Dell sound chip set plays 8000 sample-per-second audio nicely but the Gateway does not have a proper low-pass filter so you hear the sampling as a high-pitched zippy quality to the sound, like a cheap talking toy. Sarah Alawami writes: > lol. my ears are pretty good in that department. In my sound engineering > classes I was taught to hear different bitrates so I record everything at > 320kbps but ah well to each his or her own. I'm done now. From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 16 20:43:33 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 12:43:33 -0700 Subject: sound engineering In-Reply-To: <201105161327.p4GDRHDt042603@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105161327.p4GDRHDt042603@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Yep sounds like the stuff I learned in class. I forgot about the ni-quest curve sorry about the spelling. I don't think we went in to that depth of a detail as it was a 15 week course but yeah all of this is starting to sound very very familiar. Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 16, 2011, at 6:27 AM, Martin McCormick wrote: > Ah, the world of digital sound. Let me confuse things a > bit with some information. > > It all starts out rather simply. We speak in to a > microphone and the vibrations in the air turn in to alternating > current that has the same frequency and wave form as our voice. > Alexander Graham Bell even used that argument in court when a > man named Gray tried to steal Bell's patent as gray had tried to > also patent a similar device and was only a few hours late. > > Those electrical signals are directly analogous to our > voice which is why we call non-digital media analog. > > You can electrically measure the polarity and amplitude > of the vibrations and, with the aid of a device called an > analog-to-digital converter, assign a number to each voltage. > Enter the first skunk at the picnic, so to speak. > > Your analog-to-digital or A/D converter has an output > expressed in bits, not bits per second just yet, just bits. > Those bits can either be 0 or 1 and the number of bits that are > used express how many possible combinations of 0 and 1 we can > set each time. > > If you have 8 bits, you can set 256 separate values. The > number is 2 to the NTH power. The A/D converters used in hifi > systems are at least 16 bits wide or more. a 16-bit converter > can display 65536 different numbers. > > The more bits there are, the easier it is to completely > reproduce the original audio. So, if you only have 4 or 8 bits, > things could sound bad because the output wave now looks like a > bunch of stairs rather than smooth curves. So too few bits can > ruin the sound. > > The next sound destroyer is a little more technical. It has > to do with how many samples per second you take. There is a law > of physics called the Nyquist principle after its discoverer > that says that you can not reproduce a wave form with less than > two samples per wave. This means that if the best human ears > hear up to 20000 Hertz, you've got to take at least 40000 > samples per second to capture all possible sounds. That is > called the Nyquist Frequency. > > That's how we got 44100 samples per second for CD's. > > But wait. There's more. If you just sample raw audio at > that frequency, any notes or overtones that are very near or > higher than 22 kilohertz will mix with the sampling, itself and > produce false sounds called aliases so a digital sound recorder > must not only sample at the right rate to pick everything up we > can hear, but it has to have a well-designed filter that > deliberately stops it from hearing any higher frequencies or the > recording sounds like rubbish. > > The playback of a digital sound stream has some pitfalls > of its own. The companion to the A/D converter is the D/A or > digital-to-analog converter. That device takes all those bits or > numbers and turns them back in to electric currents that should > almost exactly mirror the currents that came out of the > microphone. > > We're not done yet! If you looked at a wave form of that > A/D converter, it is a bunch of stair steps again, all be they > maybe very tiny, but they are still not smooth. > > You have a second low-pass filter on the playback system > that is much like the one on the recorder that smoothes out > those steps and makes them as close to the original wave form as > possible. > > If those filters are not good or malfunction, the > recording and the playback will both suffer. > > So, of course, bit rate matters, but so does the > low-pass filters and sampling rate. > > Last, but not least, here is where it gets really messy. > > When you digitize audio, those digits take up lots of > room on a disk. If you try to send them over a radio, they take > up far more room than can be allowed for each radio station so > something has to be done to make room. > > That is compression and there is lossless compression > like .zip files and other archival systems and then there is > lossy compression which is like mpeg3 and Sony's PASC and > something called LPC which stands for Linear Predictive Coding > and is used in cell phones and two-way radio and some recording > systems to jam as much sound in to as small a storage space or > as narrow a band of radio frequencies as humanly possible. The > sound quality suffers but not enough to make it totally > unintelligible, just mostly so. > > Lossy compression deliberately throws away some of the > sound because research says you won't miss it. In well-done > forms of MP3, that's mostly true. > > The pieces of software or hardware that turn raw digital > sound, called PCM, in to MP3 or LPC streams are called > coder/decoders or codecs. Good MP3 codecs do sound good even if > the bit rate is down to 64 bits per channel. I've heard other > mp3's that would make you want to throw up they are so bad. > > My point in this long ramble is that you can't say that > this or that bit rate is bad or good. Higher is usually better, > but the codecs and the Nyquist filtering in the system can also > make all the difference in the world. > > Those of you who have Unix systems other than Mac's > might see if you have /dev/dsp on your system. With no special > settings, /dev/dsp produces an 8-bit audio stream at 8000 > samples per second. It makes music sound a little worse than AM > radio, but voice sounds amazingly good all be it a bit flat like > a good telephone line. It would be fine for dictation and > communication, just not good for music. It is an interesting > thing to listen to, keeping in mind that it is 8000 samples per > second meaning that the highest frequency it will pass is 4000 > HZ. > > One of my older computers at home is a Gateway and the > others are Dells. The Dell sound chip set plays 8000 > sample-per-second audio nicely but the Gateway does not have a > proper low-pass filter so you hear the sampling as a > high-pitched zippy quality to the sound, like a cheap talking > toy. > > Sarah Alawami writes: >> lol. my ears are pretty good in that department. In my sound engineering >> classes I was taught to hear different bitrates so I record everything at >> 320kbps but ah well to each his or her own. I'm done now. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Mon May 16 21:39:17 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 15:39:17 -0500 Subject: sound engineering Message-ID: <201105162039.p4GKdHBx045702@x.it.okstate.edu> The engineers who design the low-pass filters to make Mr. Nyquist happy try to design a filter with as flat a frequency response as possible from whatever low frequency is the low limit right up to the Nyquist limit at which point it has a very steep roll-off. Simple resistor-capacitor networks will sort of work, but multi-pole active filters are the best. One of the funniest segments I ever heard on "Saturday Night Live" was a fake commercial for a Baby Jesus doll that contains an electronic circuit that makes the baby begin to cry on Christmas Eve night and keep on crying right through Epiphany on January 6. While the announcer speaks, you can hear the most horrible electronic sound you ever heard. It is suggestive of a baby crying but the sampling rate is somewhere around 4 or 5 KHZ with no low-pass filtering at all. It is even possible that whoever created that effect reduced the bit count for each sample to make it even worse. As I said earlier, when you reproduce a digital wave form without a low-pass filter, the output is a series of stair steps that represent the minimum difference between levels that the D/A converter can deliver. This is called quantization and the fewer the number of bits in a sample, the more quantization noise there is since the steps are bigger from one level to the next. In the spoof commercial for the Baby Jesus doll, somebody probably had some real fun trying to make the cry sound as awful to listen to as possible. Also, the sound simply repeated without any variation. Imagine listening to that for twelve days and nights. AAUGH! Sarah Alawami writes: > Yep sounds like the stuff I learned in class. I forgot about the > ni-quest curve sorry about the spelling. I don't think we went in to > that depth of a detail as it was a 15 week course but yeah all of this is > starting to sound very very familiar. > > Take care. From tsiegel at softcon.com Tue May 17 00:13:14 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 18:13:14 -0500 Subject: sound engineering In-Reply-To: References: <201105161327.p4GDRHDt042603@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Thank you very much for that short but interesting piece. I'm always fascinated by compression, whether it be general forms, or sound quality, or otherwise, so these kinds always interest me, even if it's stuff I've read before, mostly because the old brain isn't what it used to be, and I always recall something new I'd forgot, or possibly not learned the first time around. Keep those explanatory emails coming. :) From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 17 00:45:58 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 16:45:58 -0700 Subject: sound engineering In-Reply-To: References: <201105161327.p4GDRHDt042603@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: don't forget the brick wall filter radios use. I forgot what freq that's at and i don't have my books at hand but i't somewhere ridiculously high to prevent your fillings from hearing the music and you broadcasting it everywhere via your mouth so my teacher said lol! Take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 16, 2011, at 4:13 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > Thank you very much for that short but interesting piece. I'm always fascinated by compression, whether it be general forms, or sound quality, or otherwise, so these kinds always interest me, even if it's stuff I've read before, mostly because the old brain isn't what it used to be, and I always recall something new I'd forgot, or possibly not learned the first time around. > Keep those explanatory emails coming. > :) > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 17 17:37:27 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 17:37:27 +0100 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project Message-ID: <14A2F367-4A86-467D-A743-C902BD7848FB@mac-access.net> Hello all Anybody up for trying a small DAISY book I just created using a medical document as a template? It's just a very small 7-page leaflet which I tried as an experiment. I can't get it to play locally but I'm not sure if it's our player software or the book. Lynne From mstores at indiana.edu Tue May 17 18:35:56 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 13:35:56 -0400 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project In-Reply-To: <14A2F367-4A86-467D-A743-C902BD7848FB@mac-access.net> References: <14A2F367-4A86-467D-A743-C902BD7848FB@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <20110517133556.2eumx52680cwo4ow@webmail.iu.edu> Sure, I'd be willing to help. Mary Quoting "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" : > Hello all > > Anybody up for trying a small DAISY book I just created using a > medical document as a template? It's just a very small 7-page leaflet > which I tried as an experiment. I can't get it to play locally but > I'm not sure if it's our player software or the book. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's > dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat > group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 17 18:53:50 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 18:53:50 +0100 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project In-Reply-To: <20110517133556.2eumx52680cwo4ow@webmail.iu.edu> References: <14A2F367-4A86-467D-A743-C902BD7848FB@mac-access.net> <20110517133556.2eumx52680cwo4ow@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: Hello Mary On 17 May 2011, at 18:35, Mary Stores wrote: ? Sure, I'd be willing to help. Many thanks. I am currently uploading the file to our cloud. So if you'd like to get it, here is the link to the file. Let me tell you what the document actually is. It's a scanned leaflet which I got this morning from the pain control nurse dealing with Gordon's Acupuncture sessions. This document is a description of what Acupuncture is and how it is used and administered. Some of the information may be local, and as such won't mean much to you. But you'll at least hopefully be able to play the book I created with any DAISY player. I will also be very interested to hear your opinions of the speech synthesiser I used for the job. Although it is British english, Gordon feels it's the best synthetic speech engine available in the world on any platform. It is actually Infovox which has been available for the Mac for ages and which is now also available for Windows although in a very different form. OK, here is the link; if anybody else wants to try this as well while it's there, feel free. And thank you again. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 17 19:40:30 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 19:40:30 +0100 Subject: OmniPage Professional 18 Message-ID: <91678BC6-AA8F-4448-8FEA-0547AA1A1DE7@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Well; from what I have seen, this programme looks to be the business end of OCR on the Windows platform. I needed something that would save in multiple formats, documents which are able to be saved retaining all original format, including columns, bullets, tables and other characteristics. I have been looking for something which would meet our requirements under OSX but have finally had to concede that there just isn't anything which is both accessible and which will do all of the above. There are programmes which do maybe some of them, but which are only partially accessible. There are programmes which will do all o f them, but which aren't accessible at all. Since Gordon is an important part of the team here, that goes without saying, it was important to take accessibility into account. So I didn't even contemplate buying any of the alternatives which don't include it. There are programmes such as VueScan, AbbYY FineReader Pro and ReadIRIS Pro 12. None of which meet all of our requirements and none of which come close to OmniPage Pro under Windows or Mac. The Mac version of OmniPage is not accessible, so that ruled that out of the equation. In the end, reluctant though I was and having given up on DocuScan Plus as the final solution, I had to make a choice based on the fact that there wasn't a lot of choice, if you know what I mean. Anyway, my sister-in-law showed me OmniPage on her notebook and she showed me the levels of OCR you cant achieve with it, in over 100 languages. Emma works professionally in the field of office management for a local branch of a very large bank. She is responsible for much of their daily output in terms of letters, statements and other documents. The banking institution she works for issued her with a volume license copy for her own laptop and that's where I saw the power of OmniPage Pro 18. So, I just bought a copy of it for Gordon and I. Like many applications these days, it now uses cloud technology for file storage and exchange, including Drop Box. We will post more as we play with it. Lynne From mstores at indiana.edu Tue May 17 19:48:15 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 14:48:15 -0400 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project In-Reply-To: References: <14A2F367-4A86-467D-A743-C902BD7848FB@mac-access.net> <20110517133556.2eumx52680cwo4ow@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: <20110517144815.pwqyjw0pkw8oockw@webmail.iu.edu> Hi Lynne, The voice synthesizer is really neat. Apart from a couple of scanning errors on page 4, this file read really well, and I had no trouble navigating it. The scanning errors did not prevent me in any way from understanding the document, I don't think. I used FSReader 2.0, which came with JAWS 12, to read the document. I had the option of reading it in Braille, listening to it with the British voice, or with Eloquence. I did not have any trouble using any of these options. Please let me know if you have any questions or if I can help further. Mary From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 17 19:50:02 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 19:50:02 +0100 Subject: More on OmniPage Pro 18 Message-ID: <5CC5E8CC-61C3-42DA-A310-D9269F692C91@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Just remembered that I did not add one important comment to my last post regarding OmniPage. Emma's version is actually a special release because it's not available to the public until 25 May 2011. At which time we will review it more indent on our blog. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Tue May 17 19:52:36 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 19:52:36 +0100 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project In-Reply-To: <20110517144815.pwqyjw0pkw8oockw@webmail.iu.edu> References: <14A2F367-4A86-467D-A743-C902BD7848FB@mac-access.net> <20110517133556.2eumx52680cwo4ow@webmail.iu.edu> <20110517144815.pwqyjw0pkw8oockw@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: Hello Mary I will top post. Would you be willing to have a look at the Braille formatted version, see what you think? is that possible? Lynne On 17 May 2011, at 19:48, Mary Stores wrote: Hi Lynne, The voice synthesizer is really neat. Apart from a couple of scanning errors on page 4, this file read really well, and I had no trouble navigating it. The scanning errors did not prevent me in any way from understanding the document, I don't think. I used FSReader 2.0, which came with JAWS 12, to read the document. I had the option of reading it in Braille, listening to it with the British voice, or with Eloquence. I did not have any trouble using any of these options. Please let me know if you have any questions or if I can help further. Mary _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From mstores at indiana.edu Tue May 17 20:29:41 2011 From: mstores at indiana.edu (Mary Stores) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 15:29:41 -0400 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project In-Reply-To: References: <14A2F367-4A86-467D-A743-C902BD7848FB@mac-access.net> <20110517133556.2eumx52680cwo4ow@webmail.iu.edu> <20110517144815.pwqyjw0pkw8oockw@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: <20110517152941.udf5j3h8kkss4sok@webmail.iu.edu> Sure, Lynne. I'll be happy to look at it. Mary Quoting "Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith" : > Hello Mary > > I will top post. Would you be willing to have a look at the Braille > formatted version, see what you think? is that possible? > > Lynne From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 17 21:21:48 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 13:21:48 -0700 Subject: accessible way to access google calendar References: <1105564939561.1101643709773.7032.6.1502107B@scheduler> Message-ID: > This seems interesting. I have not tried it out but here ya go > Povidi Releases "My Accessible Google", Non-Visual Access to Google's Calendar Application! > > RELEASED: May 17, 2011 > > > Date: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 > For Immediate Release: Povidi Releases "My Accessible Google", Non-Visual Access to Google's Calendar application!! - Christchurch, New Zealand - Cleveland, OH USA - PR Web > > Today, Povidi LTD announced that for the first time users who are visually impaired will now be able to access Google's Calendar Application. Up until now, this robust, online means of organizing one's calendar has been virtually inaccessible to persons who are blind or visually impaired. But no longer thanks to the development efforts of Povidi, a New Zealand-based development firm committed to providing orientation and navigation solutions as well as intuitive access to otherwise relatively inaccessible web-based applications by persons who are blind or visually impaired. > > Povidi has created a user interface to Google's Calendar Application that can be freely utilized by visiting http://www.povidi.com/mag/. Users must first have a Google account; once they sign in and grant this application access to their Google calendar, users may create, store, and review appointments in the same manner as their sighted peers. Povidi was able to accomplish this milestone in the wake of a tragic earthquake that has decimated Christchurch. > > "We're delighted with this breakthrough," stated Darryl Sherwood, founder of Povidi. "We're seeing a trend whereby vision impaired computer users are expected to manage and access information in a similar fashion to their sighted peers, and we're keen to explore ways to give them the tools they need to accomplish the tasks they are expected to independently complete." > > Flying Blind, LLC is a strategic partner and minority shareholder in Povidi. "I'm ecstatic about the work that Darryl and his team have completed on the Google Calendar," stated Larry Lewis, President of Flying Blind, LLC. "It's a tremendous follow-up effort to Povidi's access on the YouTube front, and I'm confident that we'll find ways to bring Povidi's problem solving skills to a number of other inaccessible applications on the web as well." > > The staff at Povidi and Flying Blind, LLC are encouraging all of their customers to give "My Accessible Google" a try and to provide their feedback. For more information about "My Accessible Google", please contact: > > Darryl Sherwood, Founder > Povidi LTD > darryl at povidi.com > http://www.povidi.com > > Larry Lewis, President From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Wed May 18 15:49:15 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 09:49:15 -0500 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project Message-ID: <201105181449.p4IEnFak056226@x.it.okstate.edu> I downloaded it here and will check the navigation tonight if I have time as I do not have a daisy player at work but I did play the mp3 files with no issues at all. The scan sounds beautiful with a couple of small exceptions: On occasion, a "backslash" was read before certain words or parts of words. It certainly does not effect understandability. I am thinking that occurs when the OCR encounters something it doesn't quite understand. That is an excellent voice. Do you just tell the synthesizer to produce MP3 files instead of sending the sound to the sound outputs or is that a traditional audio recording of the synthesizer output? From gordon at mac-access.net Wed May 18 15:56:48 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 15:56:48 +0100 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project In-Reply-To: <201105181449.p4IEnFak056226@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105181449.p4IEnFak056226@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <3A3D8817-D4B6-4333-BB61-53BAE20A9617@mac-access.net> Hello Martin Don't worry about the scan. Lynne's only concern was the DAISY content. Gordon On 18 May 2011, at 15:49, Martin McCormick wrote: I downloaded it here and will check the navigation tonight if I have time as I do not have a daisy player at work but I did play the mp3 files with no issues at all. The scan sounds beautiful with a couple of small exceptions: On occasion, a "backslash" was read before certain words or parts of words. It certainly does not effect understandability. I am thinking that occurs when the OCR encounters something it doesn't quite understand. That is an excellent voice. Do you just tell the synthesizer to produce MP3 files instead of sending the sound to the sound outputs or is that a traditional audio recording of the synthesizer output? _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Wed May 18 20:57:45 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 14:57:45 -0500 Subject: Help with a small DAISY Project Message-ID: <201105181957.p4IJvjmH058817@x.it.okstate.edu> Thanks. Evenings are kind of busy this week since my father is in the process of moving in. I will put a message related to that on this list next and you will se it does belong in techno-chat. Gordon Smith writes: > Hello Martin > > Don't worry about the scan. Lynne's only concern was the DAISY content. > > Gordon > > On 18 May 2011, at 15:49, Martin McCormick wrote: > > I downloaded it here and will check the navigation > tonight if I have time as I do not have a daisy player at work > but I did play the mp3 files with no issues at all. > > The scan sounds beautiful with a couple of small > exceptions: > > On occasion, a "backslash" was read before certain words > or parts of words. It certainly does not effect > understandability. I am thinking that occurs when the OCR > encounters something it doesn't quite understand. > > That is an excellent voice. Do you just tell the > synthesizer to produce MP3 files instead of sending the sound to > the sound outputs or is that a traditional audio recording of > the synthesizer output? > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated > web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated > web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Wed May 18 21:32:51 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 15:32:51 -0500 Subject: Wire Line Telephones Message-ID: <201105182032.p4IKWpbO058943@x.it.okstate.edu> As some of you know from the just-chat list, my father bought the house across the street from us and is moving in. The biggest telephone company, here, is AT&T and he changed from his old address to the new one. AT&T is not the only player in the game, however. You can get telephone service from one other wire line carrier, here, plus VOIP telephone service through cable television or even VOIP telephone service through your Internet connection be it cable television or wire line without dial tone. The previous owner of the house had had telephone through the other wire line company and may have even tried our cable television provider's VOIP solution. When my father got his new telephone number for Stillwater, we know about when they activated it because if you called it before it was switched on, you got an out-of-service recording. Sometime Monday morning,it went from that to just ringing with no answer. By Tuesday night, my dad was starting to get annoyed because the phone was still quite dead even though it was plugged in in the house and the number would ring. I offered to check the outside box called a demark. I don't know if you in the UK have something similar, but we have this box that is divided in to two parts. The left side is the telephone provider's half and we are not supposed to open it. The right side is our half and there is where the telephone wires of the house are attached to screw terminals in the box. There is also a short jumper with a RJ11 on it that plugs in to a jack in the box that allows one to plug a telephone right in there and see if the line is good to the house. I did that and there was dial tone. There probably had been dial tone since Monday. When I opened the customer side of the box, the company side was swinging wide open. There was also a wad of wire pairs that were unterminated. I asked my father what color the various pairs were and there was one blue-white pair which is usually the first pair you use for a telephone. The others were just extra pairs as it appears that the house was wired with CAT5. The blue-white pair had, at one time been joined to another blue-white pair and had gone to points unknown. When I found it, they were just hanging out there in space having been cut by someone. I had my father go in and plug a phone in to a jack and then remove the receiver. I expected continuity across the pair but my Morse Code practice oscillator which usually will crackle a little when across something like the resistance of a telephone off hook, made no sound at all. I finally just decided to go ahead and connect those wires first to see if it would work. It did. The modular plug for the RJ11 jack in the box was also unplugged so I plugged that back in which energized the screw terminals. When you have AT&T or some other telephone company connect your line, they will not do any work on your side of the box unless you pay quite nicely for that work. My father's phone would have remained silent for a very long time had we not looked in to that box. Why, on Earth, somebody cut the primary pair in to the house and also unplugged the RJ11 modular plug is beyond me. I don't know how things were hooked up before, but that was just really odd. I closed the company side of the box, our side of the box, and called it a good day. From support at mac-access.net Wed May 18 21:34:46 2011 From: support at mac-access.net (Gordon & Lynne Smith) Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 21:34:46 +0100 Subject: Ready For Trials Of Online Baciup Message-ID: <9DA634AB-9004-4A17-A573-0B101B42F0D5@mac-access.net> Hello everybody I know this is off topic; so I'll make it brief and ask you to please reply off list to as we will ignore on list replies. We are now ready to commence trials of our online backup solution. Anybody who would like to participate in restricted trials which, if successful, will turn into a full-blown service shortly, please contact us for info. But please only contact us if you're willing to participate in a paid subscriber scheme. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 20 11:37:36 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 20:37:36 +1000 Subject: Apple TV and PVR Message-ID: <4DD64470.4070603@internode.on.net> Hi! Its not often I have a question about Itunes . I just purchased a Samsung TV which seems to go hand in glove with my Apple TV unit, so far so good and now comes the third part of the jigsaw puzzle, my Leadtek TV Video Tuner card with the PVR software which by default records video in mpg format. I know that if I convert MPg format to MOV, I can add these >MOV files to the Itunes library and they will be displayed on my Apple TV thanks to Itunes Home Sharing, I can then pick and choose the files I wish to play thanks to Apple TV'S remote control which is nice so does anyone know if Itunes will play the MPG files themselves? That would save me the time and trouble of the conversion step to .MOV format. I've tried adding MPG files to the Itunes library and they seem to go into the library but I can't seem to find them listed through Apple TV in any of the library categories and they don't seem to show up anywhere in Itunes. Thanks In Advance From tsiegel at softcon.com Fri May 20 17:55:00 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 11:55:00 -0500 Subject: Apple TV and PVR In-Reply-To: <4DD64470.4070603@internode.on.net> References: <4DD64470.4070603@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <5DD94EA4-01E1-4EDF-B4C9-922F039DEBF6@softcon.com> Itunes does indeed play mpg files. Most likely, you'll find them under the movies section of the library. I've had no trouble adding mpg files to itunes, though vlc playes them too, as does the lame encoder :) hth. On May 20, 2011, at 5:37 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Hi! > > Its not often I have a question about Itunes . > > I just purchased a Samsung TV which seems to go hand in glove with > my Apple TV unit, so far so good and now comes the third part of > the jigsaw puzzle, my Leadtek TV Video Tuner card with the PVR > software which by default records video in mpg format. > > I know that if I convert MPg format to MOV, I can add these >MOV > files to the Itunes library and they will be displayed on my Apple > TV thanks to Itunes Home Sharing, I can then pick and choose the > files I wish to play thanks to Apple TV'S remote control which is > nice so does anyone know if Itunes will play the MPG files > themselves? That would save me the time and trouble of the > conversion step to .MOV format. I've tried adding MPG files to the > Itunes library and they seem to go into the library but I can't > seem to find them listed through Apple TV in any of the library > categories and they don't seem to show up anywhere in Itunes. > > Thanks In Advance > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, > Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's > dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/ > listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat > group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 20 19:23:37 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 11:23:37 -0700 Subject: How to Encrypt All Internet Use on Your Android Phone [Encryption] Message-ID: <445C004C-FBDE-4B66-8A02-086B56505073@gmail.com> How to Encrypt All Internet Use on Your Android Phone [Encryption] When you connect to a public Wi-Fi network, your Android phone is susceptible to the same sorts of attacks as a laptop?as demonstrated by the Android data vulnerability exposed a few days ago. The solution to securing your communication is simple: You have to encrypt it. Here's how to set up an SSH tunnel as a cheap, easy method to encrypt all your Android phone's data. More ? http://bit.ly/jZknty From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 20 19:25:01 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 11:25:01 -0700 Subject: Yes, a Cat-Food Brand Really Has Created Three iPad Games For Cats [Video] Message-ID: Oh my is all I'll say to this. Yes, a Cat-Food Brand Really Has Created Three iPad Games For Cats [Video] All I will say about this is that if you consider lending your iPad to your feline for some browser-based cat-game fun, please oh please wear a screen protector. Won't someone think of the chiiiiildren! [Games For Cats] More ? http://bit.ly/mbnIMe From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 20 19:26:31 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 20 May 2011 11:26:31 -0700 Subject: Eight Plankers Lose Their Jobs For Foolish Facebook Fad [Wtf] Message-ID: <30CD0661-F06F-43B0-AA46-88A4DA45F98D@gmail.com> Eight Plankers Lose Their Jobs For Foolish Facebook Fad [Wtf] Planking has already cost one Australian man his life, but now eight employees of the Australian chain Woolworths are out of work for balancing on shopping trolleys, mincing machines, and whatever else they discovered they could balance on at work. More ? http://bit.ly/jtHnGU From grtdane at internode.on.net Fri May 20 23:28:37 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 21 May 2011 08:28:37 +1000 Subject: Apple TV and PVR In-Reply-To: <5DD94EA4-01E1-4EDF-B4C9-922F039DEBF6@softcon.com> References: <4DD64470.4070603@internode.on.net> <5DD94EA4-01E1-4EDF-B4C9-922F039DEBF6@softcon.com> Message-ID: <4DD6EB15.1000209@internode.on.net> Hmm interesting, your thoughts were echoed here but when I looked under the Movies category I couldn't find my MPg files for some reason, just mov files which I had added, I'm using Itunes for Windows for this by the way so I'm wondering if there's a difference between the Mac and the Windows version somewhere. I have been playing MPG files with VLC on the Mac, sharper picture, they look very nice under Windows with Windows Media Player, Winamp keeps crashing here every time I try to play them and VLC is absolutely useless from an accessibility point of view under Windows though its perfectly accessible under OS10 or LINUX. . On 21/05/2011 2:55 AM, Travis Siegel wrote: > Itunes does indeed play mpg files. > Most likely, you'll find them under the movies section of the library. > I've had no trouble adding mpg files to itunes, though vlc playes them > too, as does the lame encoder :) > hth. > > On May 20, 2011, at 5:37 AM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > >> Hi! >> >> Its not often I have a question about Itunes . >> >> I just purchased a Samsung TV which seems to go hand in glove with my >> Apple TV unit, so far so good and now comes the third part of the >> jigsaw puzzle, my Leadtek TV Video Tuner card with the PVR software >> which by default records video in mpg format. >> >> I know that if I convert MPg format to MOV, I can add these >MOV >> files to the Itunes library and they will be displayed on my Apple TV >> thanks to Itunes Home Sharing, I can then pick and choose the files I >> wish to play thanks to Apple TV'S remote control which is nice so >> does anyone know if Itunes will play the MPG files themselves? That >> would save me the time and trouble of the conversion step to .MOV >> format. I've tried adding MPG files to the Itunes library and they >> seem to go into the library but I can't seem to find them listed >> through Apple TV in any of the library categories and they don't seem >> to show up anywhere in Itunes. >> >> Thanks In Advance >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, >> virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's >> dedicated web pages located at >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat >> group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's > dedicated web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat > group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Sun May 22 06:57:13 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 22 May 2011 15:57:13 +1000 Subject: Itunes under Windows Message-ID: <4DD8A5B9.3030709@internode.on.net> Hi! I was pleasantly surprised at just how easy Itunes for Windows is to get around and access with the new version of Window-Eyes but one thing has me stumped at the moment, how does one get to a table of songs in say an album and preview each before deciding to purchase it, anyone know? From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 22 08:06:36 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 22 May 2011 00:06:36 -0700 Subject: Itunes under Windows In-Reply-To: <4DD8A5B9.3030709@internode.on.net> References: <4DD8A5B9.3030709@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <114FE072-330D-4C29-B767-2BAA2BF82348@gmail.com> Not sure but will f6 work in that screen reading software to do that? take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 21, 2011, at 10:57 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Hi! > > I was pleasantly surprised at just how easy Itunes for Windows is to get around and access with the new version of Window-Eyes but one thing has me stumped at the moment, how does one get to a table of songs in say an album and preview each before deciding to purchase it, anyone know? > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 24 00:49:06 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 23 May 2011 16:49:06 -0700 Subject: T-Mobile ditches unlimited data plans: Message-ID: <1C7E06C5-DC86-4D99-97E1-23D935DCDA11@gmail.com> I wonder if sprint will be next? http://bit.ly/kjNZgK From rose at chicksdigmacs.net Tue May 24 01:08:18 2011 From: rose at chicksdigmacs.net (Rose Morales) Date: Mon, 23 May 2011 20:08:18 -0400 Subject: T-Mobile ditches unlimited data plans: In-Reply-To: <1C7E06C5-DC86-4D99-97E1-23D935DCDA11@gmail.com> References: <1C7E06C5-DC86-4D99-97E1-23D935DCDA11@gmail.com> Message-ID: I have been a t-mobile customer for about eight years now. With my current t-mobile data plan, I pay $30. That gives me 5 gigs of 3g or 4g speed, depending on whether or not I'm in a 4g area. If I reach this cap, I get dropped down to edge. In summary, prices may have changed, but the caps are by no means a new thing. The only difference is that now they're coming straight out and telling you that you only get 5 gigs o 3g. Whereas before, you had to read your data plan service agreement or peruse t-mobile related forums to find this out. Rose On May 23, 2011, at 7:49 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > I wonder if sprint will be next? > > http://bit.ly/kjNZgK > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 24 01:50:49 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 23 May 2011 17:50:49 -0700 Subject: T-Mobile ditches unlimited data plans: In-Reply-To: References: <1C7E06C5-DC86-4D99-97E1-23D935DCDA11@gmail.com> Message-ID: <7DC7985D-E112-4726-9C7E-8844E3BC6A7E@gmail.com> OH wow interesting. I know of someone who gets unlimited everything for $40 but ah well. 5 gigs really is not a lot and at&t does the same thing except they don't tell you that. I'm on an unlimited plan but am thinking of drooping it. I wish at&t would do that. give you or everyone unlimited and if you go over you get throttled. Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 23, 2011, at 5:08 PM, Rose Morales wrote: > I have been a t-mobile customer for about eight years now. With my current t-mobile data plan, I pay $30. That gives me 5 gigs of 3g or 4g speed, depending on whether or not I'm in a 4g area. If I reach this cap, I get dropped down to edge. In summary, prices may have changed, but the caps are by no means a new thing. The only difference is that now they're coming straight out and telling you that you only get 5 gigs o 3g. Whereas before, you had to read your data plan service agreement or peruse t-mobile related forums to find this out. > > Rose > > On May 23, 2011, at 7:49 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> I wonder if sprint will be next? >> >> http://bit.ly/kjNZgK >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 24 02:33:45 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 23 May 2011 18:33:45 -0700 Subject: installing the sam encoders Message-ID: Hey I'm trying to walk a broadcaster through installing the sam encoders. I can't remember the path in to which to copy the dll. How easy is is this gong to be? I can't remember how to do it s I use edcast lol! Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed May 25 06:59:42 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 24 May 2011 22:59:42 -0700 Subject: Ok I'm scared now! Message-ID: Ok I quit using my hotmail address as I wanted to switch over to gmail for convenience. I did this about 6 months ago. It emailed me saying I requested a password reset a few minutes ago. Um? I did not! I thought once you quit using your msn address or hotmail address it would go away and not work. I have never had this happen before. Help please? I know I should not panic over this but I am a very careful person. Take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 From gordon at mac-access.net Wed May 25 16:46:24 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 16:46:24 +0100 Subject: Ok I'm scared now! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Sarah You say you're a very careful person. You're not, because you're one of the millions who have been sucked into the Google trap. :) There's far more going on at Google than most people know about and that's not just me talking. Personally, I would never use either Google or Hotmail or any of the other public email services just because they're convenient. But well, you pays your money you takes your choice. I will never understand why people need these things in preference to their ISP's E-Mail services. I guess people just like to be in with the in-crowd or something like that! But sarah, if it helps you, these addresses don't "just go away' because you stop using them. But the password resets are often junk. All the same, I find it difficult to sympathise with people who ignore the warnings. :) Google, Hotmail and the likes are a spammer's paradise. I would never laugh or ridicule another's misfortune. But I'm not in the least surprised when people get problems with Google. . Gordon On 25 May 2011, at 06:59, Sarah Alawami wrote: Ok I quit using my hotmail address as I wanted to switch over to gmail for convenience. I did this about 6 months ago. It emailed me saying I requested a password reset a few minutes ago. Um? I did not! I thought once you quit using your msn address or hotmail address it would go away and not work. I have never had this happen before. Help please? I know I should not panic over this but I am a very careful person. From lynne at mac-access.net Wed May 25 17:10:55 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 17:10:55 +0100 Subject: Omnipage Pro 18 Message-ID: <41462EFE-23AB-4A63-913B-CBBB2958FA3D@mac-access.net> Hello everybody Has anybody used anything later than OmniPage Pro 16 for Windows? We just got 18 which was released today but I see they're now using one of those irritating download manglers like Semantic uses. Just hope they let you download the full installer without having to install it from a cloud. If anybody is interested in our findings I will report to the list. But not otherwise Lynne From marrie12 at gmail.com Wed May 25 22:17:35 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 14:17:35 -0700 Subject: Ok I'm scared now! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2613988F-67A6-41E9-AD4C-0538E81A7709@gmail.com> Actually I did a bit more research and I'm blocked from my own account lol! Ah well I quit using it anyway and I removed all contacts in said account about 6 months ago so I'm not that worried. the reason I use google mail is I need that 7 gigs of storage space that's growing every few months. and I can send 34 mb email attachments with out google mail yelling at me, plus I can have filters server side and sync anyware. I have never been attacked by google and i never will be because I don't keep any of my contacts and stuff and calendars online. all of it is offline. I was actually paying for storage space on hotmail because I needed it but now that I can't even access my own account because I'm blocked out of it. Yeah that password thing was real. I looked at headers and I know how to read them, I'm not that worried. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 25, 2011, at 8:46 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi Sarah > > You say you're a very careful person. You're not, because you're one of the millions who have been sucked into the Google trap. :) There's far more going on at Google than most people know about and that's not just me talking. Personally, I would never use either Google or Hotmail or any of the other public email services just because they're convenient. But well, you pays your money you takes your choice. I will never understand why people need these things in preference to their ISP's E-Mail services. I guess people just like to be in with the in-crowd or something like that! > > But sarah, if it helps you, these addresses don't "just go away' because you stop using them. But the password resets are often junk. All the same, I find it difficult to sympathise with people who ignore the warnings. :) > > Google, Hotmail and the likes are a spammer's paradise. I would never laugh or ridicule another's misfortune. But I'm not in the least surprised when people get problems with Google. > . > Gordon > > On 25 May 2011, at 06:59, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > Ok I quit using my hotmail address as I wanted to switch over to gmail for convenience. I did this about 6 months ago. It emailed me saying I requested a password reset a few minutes ago. Um? I did not! I thought once you quit using your msn address or hotmail address it would go away and not work. I have never had this happen before. Help please? I know I should not panic over this but I am a very careful person. > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Thu May 26 00:03:15 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Wed, 25 May 2011 16:03:15 -0700 Subject: how to import feeds in to sage? Message-ID: <542ECA2A-C1C0-44CB-8F5E-99A97C43788B@gmail.com> Hello. trying to use sage as an rss reader but can't figure out hot to import my opml file in to there? Thanks. I tried ctrl o but that didn't work. Help? Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 From lynne at mac-access.net Thu May 26 14:43:37 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 14:43:37 +0100 Subject: PowerISO for Windows Message-ID: <8AC551C5-3E38-4C1F-8469-356881AF91F7@mac-access.net> Hello everybody I know of at least one person on list who is using PowerISo, as in Dane. But does anybody else use it? I'm trying to decide on which, if any, is the best CD/DVD burning or writing software for Windows these days and I'm only looking at tools still under development I have no problem with paying for something if it's going to be usable. But I don't want something like Nero which is a bloated pile of useless applications whose mere presence slows down a Windows installation if my sister-in-law's laptop is anything to go by. In fact she's trying to remove it but it stubbornly won't let her uninstall its core components. So there's no way on earth I'm installing that thing here. I don't think that PowerISO is capable of doing disk to disk copies, is it? As i understand it it's just a programme to create/read from images and burn disks using them. Correct me if I am wrong. I bought PowerISO some time ago but have so far been very disappointed in it. Lynne From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu May 26 14:55:37 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 08:55:37 -0500 Subject: Britain's Oldest Working Television Message-ID: <201105261355.p4QDtbhR005616@x.it.okstate.edu> I read about this on another list I am on and thought some may find it interesting. A month or so ago, there was an auction in the UK in which was sold what is reportedly the oldest still-working tele in the country. It had been made in 1936 and was sold to a man who bought it for 99 Pounds, that year and was able to watch it for all of 3 days when a fire destroyed a facility called the Crystal Palace containing the studios that fed the transmitter in his part of England. The set sat unused until 1946 when the UK resumed television transmissions in the 405-line system after the end of World War II. The old set was refurbished but reportedly only needed about 30% of its parts replaced to make it operational again and was sold for 16-thousand Pounds at the auction. Other than its novelty of being almost 80 years old, it would be useless as 405-line signals from the UK stopped after 1985. For the auction, I believe I read that someone built a 625 to 405-line converter and proved that the old set would still work if there were signals to receive. The set would have been impressive to look at as it was built in to a finished wooden cabinet. The 12-inch round screen, however, was not viewed directly but shown on a mirror that was part of a lid that you lifted when you wanted to watch. I guess you could call it the original flat screen TV. To me, this is all interesting because how technology was originally presented and used is historical, in and of itself. Those of you who can, should read a book called "The History of Radar. It goes in to fairly great detail as to how the British government subsidized the budding television industry, there, during the thirties because television picture tubes aren't all that different than radar screens. At least, if you make good picture tubes, it's a tiny leap to make good radar display tubes. The book also describes how, on an August afternoon in 1939, the BBC shut off all TV transmitters in mid movie without so much as an announcement, because of fear, probably quite justified, that Hitler would use the television transmitters as beacons to guide bombers to their targets. Here in the US, we also had a television station in New York City during the thirties, but there was no secret government subsidy for set manufacturing and television in the thirties was an oddity that a few amateur radio operators in the New York City area plus a few more wealthy individuals enjoyed, but the rest of the country didn't get TV until after the Second World War. If you were not technically inclined but had a lot of spare cash lying around in 1938 in New York City, you could buy the only commercially-made television set in America. It sold for the equivalent of twelve-hundred Dollars in today's money, had a 3-inch screen and no sound. I don't know this for a fact, but if you wanted sound, you would tune a short wave radio to the sound carrier frequency in the 45 MHZ range. From grtdane at internode.on.net Thu May 26 15:53:15 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 00:53:15 +1000 Subject: PowerISO for Windows In-Reply-To: <8AC551C5-3E38-4C1F-8469-356881AF91F7@mac-access.net> References: <8AC551C5-3E38-4C1F-8469-356881AF91F7@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <7DEC388D-C97C-48E4-A3C2-0142A5EFCE37@internode.on.net> Another suggestion, there's a tool brought out by our friends at NCH Software which you may like to look at, On 26/05/2011, at 11:43 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > I know of at least one person on list who is using PowerISo, as in Dane. But does anybody else use it? I'm trying to decide on which, if any, is the best CD/DVD burning or writing software for Windows these days and I'm only looking at tools still under development > > I have no problem with paying for something if it's going to be usable. But I don't want something like Nero which is a bloated pile of useless applications whose mere presence slows down a Windows installation if my sister-in-law's laptop is anything to go by. In fact she's trying to remove it but it stubbornly won't let her uninstall its core components. So there's no way on earth I'm installing that thing here. > > I don't think that PowerISO is capable of doing disk to disk copies, is it? As i understand it it's just a programme to create/read from images and burn disks using them. Correct me if I am wrong. I bought PowerISO some time ago but have so far been very disappointed in it. > > Lynne > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > Express Burn is a multi platform CD/DVD burning tool. I've not played much with this yet and its on the "thousand things to do" list but from the glimpses I've had its nicely accessible. Power ISO and Express Burn are about the same price, I already have Power ISO and may consider Express Burn, you get a nice discount off other NCH Software when purchasing multi titles and they make some good stuff, the Prism Video Converter and Express Talk are 2 examples that immediately spring to mind. From lynne at mac-access.net Thu May 26 16:07:10 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 16:07:10 +0100 Subject: PowerISO for Windows In-Reply-To: <7DEC388D-C97C-48E4-A3C2-0142A5EFCE37@internode.on.net> References: <8AC551C5-3E38-4C1F-8469-356881AF91F7@mac-access.net> <7DEC388D-C97C-48E4-A3C2-0142A5EFCE37@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Hello Dane On 26 May 2011, at 15:53, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Another suggestion, there's a tool brought out by our friends at NCH Software which you may like to look at, OK I'll look on Google for it. Lynne From moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk Thu May 26 17:05:12 2011 From: moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk (Chris Moore) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 17:05:12 +0100 Subject: Britain's Oldest Working Television In-Reply-To: <201105261355.p4QDtbhR005616@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105261355.p4QDtbhR005616@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <8DB1E0A0-D7F5-4CBD-B255-131D8A3E6552@blueyonder.co.uk> Martin, what other groups are you a member of? I do enjoy your posts. On 26 May 2011, at 14:55, Martin McCormick wrote: > I read about this on another list I am on and thought > some may find it interesting. > > A month or so ago, there was an auction in the UK in > which was sold what is reportedly the oldest still-working tele > in the country. > > It had been made in 1936 and was sold to a man who > bought it for 99 Pounds, that year and was able to watch it for > all of 3 days when a fire destroyed a facility called the > Crystal Palace containing the studios that fed the transmitter > in his part of England. > > The set sat unused until 1946 when the UK resumed > television transmissions in the 405-line system after the end of > World War II. > > The old set was refurbished but reportedly only needed > about 30% of its parts replaced to make it operational again and > was sold for 16-thousand Pounds at the auction. > > Other than its novelty of being almost 80 years old, it > would be useless as 405-line signals from the UK stopped after > 1985. For the auction, I believe I read that someone built a 625 > to 405-line converter and proved that the old set would still > work if there were signals to receive. > > The set would have been impressive to look at as it was > built in to a finished wooden cabinet. The 12-inch round screen, > however, was not viewed directly but shown on a mirror that was > part of a lid that you lifted when you wanted to watch. I guess > you could call it the original flat screen TV. > > To me, this is all interesting because how technology > was originally presented and used is historical, in and of > itself. > > Those of you who can, should read a book called "The > History of Radar. It goes in to fairly great detail as to how > the British government subsidized the budding television > industry, there, during the thirties because television picture > tubes aren't all that different than radar screens. At least, if > you make good picture tubes, it's a tiny leap to make good radar > display tubes. > > The book also describes how, on an August afternoon in > 1939, the BBC shut off all TV transmitters in mid movie without > so much as an announcement, because of fear, probably quite > justified, that Hitler would use the television transmitters as > beacons to guide bombers to their targets. > > Here in the US, we also had a television station in New > York City during the thirties, but there was no secret > government subsidy for set manufacturing and television in the > thirties was an oddity that a few amateur radio operators in the > New York City area plus a few more wealthy individuals enjoyed, > but the rest of the country didn't get TV until after the Second > World War. > > If you were not technically inclined but had a lot of > spare cash lying around in 1938 in New York City, you could buy > the only commercially-made television set in America. It sold > for the equivalent of twelve-hundred Dollars in today's money, > had a 3-inch screen and no sound. > > I don't know this for a fact, but if you wanted sound, > you would tune a short wave radio to the sound carrier frequency > in the 45 MHZ range. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu May 26 19:48:39 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 13:48:39 -0500 Subject: Britain's Oldest Working Television Message-ID: <201105261848.p4QImdRq007528@x.it.okstate.edu> Chris Moore writes: > Martin, what other groups are you a member of? I do enjoy your posts. I belong to a lot of different lists, some work related and others like the one I am going to show you, strictly hobby-related. If you are really in to electronic hardware and the building, there of, this list is very good, also very busy. The series of messages about the old television were in an OT or off-topic thread so most of the threads concern the Microchip line of products and how best to use them. Here is the information from the last time I subscribed: Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2010 06:16:54 EDT From: piclist-request at mit.edu Subject: Welcome to the "Piclist" mailing list Welcome to the Piclist at mit.edu mailing list! Congratulations! You are now a member of the best mailing list ever for embedded engineers. Before posting, please check the PIC FAQ at http://www.piclist.com/faq or the SX FAQ at http://www.sxlist.com and search the Archives http://www.piclist.com/techref/piclist/listfaq.htm#archives to get an instant answer without wasting anyone's time. We enforce the use of topics tagging and topic filtering to try to allow a greater range of discussion while still respecting the fact that many hardcore engineers, who are valuable resources to the list, may have little time to read off topic posts and need a reliable way to filter them out so that they can spend what time they have concentrating on the topic they are most interested in. You may change what topics you recieve at the Member Options page: http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/options/piclist/ Topic tags must be at the start of the subject line, enclosed in brackets "[" and "]". Current topics are: - [PIC] Should be at the start of the subject line for most postings to the PICList. This says that a PIC microcontroller (or clone) is directly involved, connected or the entire subject of your post. Any person who works with PICs would want to read it. - [SX] Items specific to the Scenix SX microcontrollers - [AVR] Items specific to the Atmel AVR microcontrollers - [EE] The doing of EE that you can do yourself. Power stations go into TECH unless its a power station that you can build. So too eg Magnetohydrodynamics etc. Windmill alternators and related systems and alternate energy at the doing level go into EE. Windfarms into TECH. etc. - [TECH] About technology, Engineering other than EE, Science hard stuff. NOT the philosophy of science in any depth. New discoveries in QM, cosmology etc are fine. Almost anything that gets a long thread that diverges can probably evolve into OT once people know it exists. Those who care can follow it. eg Global Warming is TECH at the latest discoveries level but not discussions of "An inconvenient truth" or "The great global warming swindle" etc. This may rate an occasional mention in TECH but long ramblings can go to OT. - [BUY] People looking for parts, equipment, or consultants should use this topic. - [AD] This is for advertisements of a commercial product or service. Don't spam, do post [AD] - [OT] This label is for posts that are completely off the topic of engineering/technology. The only things we don't ever want to see are religious/metaphysical, sex, hate, or political messages. Notes: Please change the topic tag before posting a reply which moves the thread into a new area. Check the tag before you press "send". Please do not use more than one topic tag. Guidelines: - The subject should be as complete a description of the problem as is possible in 60 characters or so. Compress and distill. Tag your topic. - The body should be in plain text, not HTML. See: http://www.piclist.com/techref/app/inet/emailfmt.htm - Include a detailed description of the problem in as few words as possible with what you are trying to do (overall), what you expected to have happen at this point, what you are seeing, and how you are seeing it (what test equipment, etc...) - Include specific part numbers, code snippets (not the full source, please), and signal descriptions. If you have a web page, post a verbose description of the problem to it and put the full URL of that page in your post (include the "http://" ) along with a summary of the problem. If you join the piclist.com website (not the same as the mailing list) you will have a free homepage which is ideal for this. - Remember that the PICList is a world wide thing and that if you are talking about an item that may change with physical location you should mention yours (at least country and maybe state or province). - The list is not moderated, but it is actively policed and messages of hatred or intolerance will get you kicked off the list, right now: period. - Please forward suggestion or complaints about the list or other list members to the list admins at mailto:piclist-owner at mit.edu rather than to all the list members. - Product information about your PIC related product is fine as long as the subject line starts with [AD], but blatant spam is not. You may also advertise your company, product or site in a one or two line addition to your signature at the bottom of your posts. - Please don't post cracks, or copyrighted material. We can't police this, but we don't want it and it will get a very negative reaction. - Please be careful of the copyright of any materials you post or link to in a post. We can't police this, but we don't want it and it will get a very negative reaction. Over the years, this mailing list has forged strong frendships, saved countless hours of trouble, provided real-world education to students from all walks of life. We know you will benifit from it, and we are pleased to have you with us! To post to this list, send your email to: piclist at mit.edu General information about the mailing list is at: http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/piclist If you ever want to unsubscribe or change your options (eg, switch to or from digest mode, change your password, etc.), visit your subscription page at: http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/options/piclist/martin%40x.it.okstate.edu You can also make such adjustments via email by sending a message to: Piclist-request at mit.edu with the word `help' in the subject or body (don't include the quotes), and you will get back a message with instructions. You must know your password to change your options (including changing the password, itself) or to unsubscribe. It is: awohkoib Normally, Mailman will remind you of your mit.edu mailing list passwords once every month, although you can disable this if you prefer. This reminder will also include instructions on how to unsubscribe or change your account options. There is also a button on your options page that will email your current password to you. From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu May 26 20:21:53 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 14:21:53 -0500 Subject: What Kind of Stupid am I today? Message-ID: <201105261921.p4QJLr59007719@x.it.okstate.edu> When I sent the last message about another list I am subscribed to, I forgot that my password to the list is right at the bottom. That's what I get for not checking closely. Trust me. it's been changed. From marrie12 at gmail.com Thu May 26 20:27:27 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 12:27:27 -0700 Subject: What Kind of Stupid am I today? In-Reply-To: <201105261921.p4QJLr59007719@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105261921.p4QJLr59007719@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <0EAC8B60-E4CF-4936-8BA7-04C74135FD30@gmail.com> No worires. I just sent a disregard message to the wrong list. Ah well. Looks like I'm having one of those days as well. Take care of yourself and have fun with technology today. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 12:21 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: > When I sent the last message about another list I am > subscribed to, I forgot that my password to the list is right at > the bottom. > > That's what I get for not checking closely. Trust me. > it's been changed. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Thu May 26 21:16:08 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 15:16:08 -0500 Subject: Doorbell Fun Message-ID: <201105262016.p4QKG8v0008205@x.it.okstate.edu> Last weekend, we got a new doorbell for my father's house because the one that was there was not loud enough and I changed out the bells. There isn't that much to door bells although modern electronic bells have a little more to them than do the traditional electromechanical bells. The new bell plays the Westminster chime melody or one could also call it the Big Ben chimes except these are a lot higher pitched. What is supposed to happen is that the caller presses the bell button and all 8 notes play even if they just tapped the button. A diode must be wired across the button to power the chimes all the time, so what you have is half-wave DC all the time and then a burst of AC when someone presses the bell button. What we got was not quite right. As soon as I connected the diode across the doorbell button, the chimes began to play or more correctly stammer at a rate of about 4 attempted starts per second. After a little burst of chime, it would go quiet and start again. What, on Earth, could be causing this behavior? I remember saying that it acts like there is something else in the circuit as there just isn't that much to hooking up door bells and the original bell did work properly all be it rather quietly. It was at that point when Beverly, my wife said that she could hear some sort of rattle or buzzing noise near the back door. Many houses have a back door bell button but this one does not. Instead, it had a back door bell as the previous owner wanted to be able to hear it outside. This bell was a twin brother of the one inside but it had a rougher childhood outside. There was a spider web in the box and one of the chimes had fallen off the bell and clattered to the ground when I took the cover off. That bell was producing inductive flyback from its solenoids which confused the new electronic bell in to trying to ring continuously. I disconnected the outside bell and immediately the other bell worked perfectly. Had it not malfunctioned, we would have not known about the second doorbell and the diode would have energized it continuously until the solenoids burned out or the transformer melted, which ever came first. Those little bell transformers aren't meant for continuous power nor are the solenoids meant for more than brief activity. Some days, we just get lucky. From marrie12 at gmail.com Thu May 26 22:04:48 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 14:04:48 -0700 Subject: Doorbell Fun In-Reply-To: <201105262016.p4QKG8v0008205@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105262016.p4QKG8v0008205@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <214CD694-C1BB-4AA1-8CB4-7846F5DC979D@gmail.com> Wow. Yeah I know nothing about electronics so am not brave enought ot try this stuff on my own with out feer of me getting hurt or killed. I've had a few close calls and I don't feel like anymore. lol! Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Martin McCormick wrote: > Last weekend, we got a new doorbell for my father's > house because the one that was there was not loud enough and I > changed out the bells. There isn't that much to door bells > although modern electronic bells have a little more to them than > do the traditional electromechanical bells. The new bell plays > the Westminster chime melody or one could also call it the Big > Ben chimes except these are a lot higher pitched. > > What is supposed to happen is that the caller presses > the bell button and all 8 notes play even if they just tapped > the button. A diode must be wired across the button to power the > chimes all the time, so what you have is half-wave DC all the > time and then a burst of AC when someone presses the bell > button. > > What we got was not quite right. As soon as I connected > the diode across the doorbell button, the chimes began to play > or more correctly stammer at a rate of about 4 attempted starts > per second. After a little burst of chime, it would go quiet and > start again. > > What, on Earth, could be causing this behavior? > > I remember saying that it acts like there is something > else in the circuit as there just isn't that much to hooking up > door bells and the original bell did work properly all be it > rather quietly. > > It was at that point when Beverly, my wife said that she > could hear some sort of rattle or buzzing noise near the back > door. Many houses have a back door bell button but this one does > not. > > Instead, it had a back door bell as the previous owner > wanted to be able to hear it outside. > > This bell was a twin brother of the one inside but it > had a rougher childhood outside. There was a spider web in the > box and one of the chimes had fallen off the bell and clattered > to the ground when I took the cover off. > > That bell was producing inductive flyback from its > solenoids which confused the new electronic bell in to trying to > ring continuously. > > I disconnected the outside bell and immediately the > other bell worked perfectly. > > Had it not malfunctioned, we would have not known about > the second doorbell and the diode would have energized it > continuously until the solenoids burned out or the transformer > melted, which ever came first. Those little bell transformers > aren't meant for continuous power nor are the solenoids meant > for more than brief activity. Some days, we just get lucky. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Thu May 26 22:17:35 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 14:17:35 -0700 Subject: stream relaying Message-ID: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> Hello. I was asked to relay a stream on my shoutcast server. I have a few questions. 1. that stream is icecast. will that fail? 2. will I be able to interrupt the relayed stream if I or another broadcaster needed to get on there to do a show? 3. if something breaks will it be easy to fix? Thanks. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 From tsiegel at softcon.com Fri May 27 00:15:59 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 18:15:59 -0500 Subject: stream relaying In-Reply-To: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> References: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> Message-ID: Can't answer most of your questions, but shoutcast can most certainly handle an icecast feed, in fact, in one or the other documentation, it points to the other as a fine way to stream the audio. Don't remember which way round it goes though, it's been quite some time since I fiddled with either one. From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 00:21:36 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 16:21:36 -0700 Subject: stream relaying In-Reply-To: References: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4C79A03D-7780-4B3F-AFE4-82618C6CB404@gmail.com> lol. I put in the address and port that the relay is suposed to go to so yeah there ya go. I hope I did it right. HOpefully my station will pick it up if I didn't break anything. Is this not fun? lol! Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 4:15 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > Can't answer most of your questions, but shoutcast can most certainly handle an icecast feed, in fact, in one or the other documentation, it points to the other as a fine way to stream the audio. > Don't remember which way round it goes though, it's been quite some time since I fiddled with either one. > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 00:58:14 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 16:58:14 -0700 Subject: Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill Message-ID: Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill A Senate committee approved a controversial copyright protection bill that would allow the Department of Justice to seek court orders requiring search engines and Internet service providers to stop sending traffic to Websites accused of infringing copyright. http://bit.ly/lH1plk From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 02:33:52 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 18:33:52 -0700 Subject: stream relaying In-Reply-To: References: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1E90A521-D7C0-4287-A8C6-AD8C044ABC41@gmail.com> Actually I can't relay a icecast stream to a shoutcast stream. I asked the provider of my station. ah well. Well, if I switch to icecast maybe I can go to ogg. will let you all know how it goes. Take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 4:15 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > Can't answer most of your questions, but shoutcast can most certainly handle an icecast feed, in fact, in one or the other documentation, it points to the other as a fine way to stream the audio. > Don't remember which way round it goes though, it's been quite some time since I fiddled with either one. > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From tsiegel at softcon.com Fri May 27 02:49:40 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 20:49:40 -0500 Subject: stream relaying In-Reply-To: <1E90A521-D7C0-4287-A8C6-AD8C044ABC41@gmail.com> References: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> <1E90A521-D7C0-4287-A8C6-AD8C044ABC41@gmail.com> Message-ID: <81734EF7-4C18-42CC-9DE3-D79DAF4241CB@softcon.com> I think someone at your server stream host isn't being honest with you, or they just plain don't know. According to the page located at http://www.icecast.org/ You can most certainly feed a shoutcast feed from an icecast server, this would (to me) seem to indicate that an icecast stream can be configured to talk to a shoutcast server. And, this has been true since version 2.20 (they're up to 2.31 now) You might want to check again, and point them to the page mentioned above, and see if they can tell you icecast says yes, and they say no. On May 26, 2011, at 8:33 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Actually I can't relay a icecast stream to a shoutcast stream. I > asked the provider of my station. ah well. Well, if I switch to > icecast maybe I can go to ogg. will let you all know how it goes. > > Take care all. > Sarah Alawami > > If you need an edit done on a small project go to http:// > music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact > me my info is below. > > MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com > > website: http://music.marrie.org > Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com > youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 > > On May 26, 2011, at 4:15 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > >> Can't answer most of your questions, but shoutcast can most >> certainly handle an icecast feed, in fact, in one or the other >> documentation, it points to the other as a fine way to stream the >> audio. >> Don't remember which way round it goes though, it's been quite >> some time since I fiddled with either one. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, >> Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's >> dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/ >> listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat >> group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, > Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's > dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/ > listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat > group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From tsiegel at softcon.com Fri May 27 02:52:16 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 20:52:16 -0500 Subject: Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2709E077-90D6-46D0-9487-F490C06125BF@softcon.com> This sounds like a case of convicting folks before they're proven inocent. Note it says sites accused of copyright infringement. It would be simple enough for me to claim any site in the world is breaking copyright, and they'd be in an accused status. Not very intelligent if you ask me. (of course, nobody asked me). On May 26, 2011, at 6:58 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill > > A Senate committee approved a controversial copyright protection > bill that would allow the Department of Justice to seek court > orders requiring search engines and Internet service providers to > stop sending traffic to Websites accused of infringing copyright. > > > http://bit.ly/lH1plk > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, > Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's > dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/ > listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat > group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From tsiegel at softcon.com Fri May 27 02:56:19 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 20:56:19 -0500 Subject: Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill In-Reply-To: <2709E077-90D6-46D0-9487-F490C06125BF@softcon.com> References: <2709E077-90D6-46D0-9487-F490C06125BF@softcon.com> Message-ID: The other thing is: How is a search engine supposed to know which websites have been accused anyhow? From tsiegel at softcon.com Fri May 27 03:02:58 2011 From: tsiegel at softcon.com (Travis Siegel) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 21:02:58 -0500 Subject: Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8A769787-3711-4557-AA5F-06BBE9F97190@softcon.com> ok, I just read the silly thing, and now I'm really confused. It states that "Now the doj will be able to target the worst of the worst foreign websites" Did I miss something? Since when were foreign websites subject to us laws? Somebody needs to tell congress they're full of hot air and this can't possibly be enforced, not to mention how many countries are going to ignore it anyhow. Us laws hold absolutely no sway in most other countries in the world, and passing a law saying they can prosecute them is only going to make a whole lot of folks mad. (I'm glad my main site isn't hosted in the us, who knows what they'll pass next) From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 05:45:56 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 21:45:56 -0700 Subject: Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill In-Reply-To: References: <2709E077-90D6-46D0-9487-F490C06125BF@softcon.com> Message-ID: <10C50626-52A7-4E31-A6DF-4FAC6D5BE40E@gmail.com> that's what I'm wornderong. I'm no programmer and I don't mnwo that much code. only enough to code a basic site that is usable. Hmm thoughts? Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 6:56 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > The other thing is: How is a search engine supposed to know which websites have been accused anyhow? > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 05:46:34 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 21:46:34 -0700 Subject: Senate panel approves controversial copyright bill In-Reply-To: <8A769787-3711-4557-AA5F-06BBE9F97190@softcon.com> References: <8A769787-3711-4557-AA5F-06BBE9F97190@softcon.com> Message-ID: <5060557D-7563-4DCD-83B3-26E72DB0D19C@gmail.com> yeaj mine is but still. Take care Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 7:02 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > ok, I just read the silly thing, and now I'm really confused. > It states that > "Now the doj will be able to target the worst of the worst foreign websites" > Did I miss something? > Since when were foreign websites subject to us laws? > Somebody needs to tell congress they're full of hot air and this can't possibly be enforced, not to mention how many countries are going to ignore it anyhow. > Us laws hold absolutely no sway in most other countries in the world, and passing a law saying they can prosecute them is only going to make a whole lot of folks mad. > (I'm glad my main site isn't hosted in the us, who knows what they'll pass next) > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 06:25:26 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 22:25:26 -0700 Subject: A Computer Error Released 450 Prisoners with "a High Risk of Violence" Message-ID: Computer system errors accidentally released more than 450 inmates with "a high risk of violence" from California prisons. What might be even worse is that no attempt has been made to return any of them back to prison. More ? http://bit.ly/kBt4A3 From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 06:35:03 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 22:35:03 -0700 Subject: stream relaying In-Reply-To: <81734EF7-4C18-42CC-9DE3-D79DAF4241CB@softcon.com> References: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> <1E90A521-D7C0-4287-A8C6-AD8C044ABC41@gmail.com> <81734EF7-4C18-42CC-9DE3-D79DAF4241CB@softcon.com> Message-ID: <1484A2A7-CA26-4419-8C40-849F830307C2@gmail.com> Well I sent them the link but I did hear differently from toher people that na icecast server could not comunicate with a shoutcast server at all. IN fact I was on a station where we tried to do just that and it failed majorly. lol! but we'll see what happens tomorrow. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 6:49 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > I think someone at your server stream host isn't being honest with you, or they just plain don't know. > According to the page located at http://www.icecast.org/ > You can most certainly feed a shoutcast feed from an icecast server, this would (to me) seem to indicate that an icecast stream can be configured to talk to a shoutcast server. > And, this has been true since version 2.20 (they're up to 2.31 now) > You might want to check again, and point them to the page mentioned above, and see if they can tell you icecast says yes, and they say no. > > > On May 26, 2011, at 8:33 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> Actually I can't relay a icecast stream to a shoutcast stream. I asked the provider of my station. ah well. Well, if I switch to icecast maybe I can go to ogg. will let you all know how it goes. >> >> Take care all. >> Sarah Alawami >> >> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >> >> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >> >> website: http://music.marrie.org >> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >> >> On May 26, 2011, at 4:15 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: >> >>> Can't answer most of your questions, but shoutcast can most certainly handle an icecast feed, in fact, in one or the other documentation, it points to the other as a fine way to stream the audio. >>> Don't remember which way round it goes though, it's been quite some time since I fiddled with either one. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 06:36:51 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Thu, 26 May 2011 22:36:51 -0700 Subject: stream relaying In-Reply-To: <81734EF7-4C18-42CC-9DE3-D79DAF4241CB@softcon.com> References: <2062FD2B-3CD3-4281-A000-556D361E1E5F@gmail.com> <1E90A521-D7C0-4287-A8C6-AD8C044ABC41@gmail.com> <81734EF7-4C18-42CC-9DE3-D79DAF4241CB@softcon.com> Message-ID: Actually the tech at my provider is right. http://forums.streamsolutions.co.uk/showthread.php?t=2426 Take care. but still we'll see. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 26, 2011, at 6:49 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: > I think someone at your server stream host isn't being honest with you, or they just plain don't know. > According to the page located at http://www.icecast.org/ > You can most certainly feed a shoutcast feed from an icecast server, this would (to me) seem to indicate that an icecast stream can be configured to talk to a shoutcast server. > And, this has been true since version 2.20 (they're up to 2.31 now) > You might want to check again, and point them to the page mentioned above, and see if they can tell you icecast says yes, and they say no. > > > On May 26, 2011, at 8:33 PM, Sarah Alawami wrote: > >> Actually I can't relay a icecast stream to a shoutcast stream. I asked the provider of my station. ah well. Well, if I switch to icecast maybe I can go to ogg. will let you all know how it goes. >> >> Take care all. >> Sarah Alawami >> >> If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. >> >> MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com >> >> website: http://music.marrie.org >> Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com >> youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 >> >> On May 26, 2011, at 4:15 PM, Travis Siegel wrote: >> >>> Can't answer most of your questions, but shoutcast can most certainly handle an icecast feed, in fact, in one or the other documentation, it points to the other as a fine way to stream the audio. >>> Don't remember which way round it goes though, it's been quite some time since I fiddled with either one. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Fri May 27 11:22:19 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 11:22:19 +0100 Subject: Apple Time Capsule Second Generation; Joke! Message-ID: Hi all REcently we've been having problems with the Apple Time Capsule on our network. To explain properly. Our network isn't a residential type of network which use NAT (Network Address Translation) to share a public IP address amongst a specified number of devices. For example, you have a router which sits on the front of your network plugged into your DSL, ADSL or cable modem. The modem allocates an IP address to your router which acts as the public IP and allows you to log into the Internet. Behind that router's switch, however, you have maybe 4 computers connected which also get allocated IP addresses but those IP addresses are in what's known as an "Un-routable range". When the IP4 protocol was designed, the software engineers who did the work had the foresight to allocate a number of subnets which are not routable via an Extranet such as the Internet. So, they set aside subnets such as "192.168.*.*", "10.*.*.*", plus a couple of others which are used exclusively for internal networks. Therefore, the NAT routers can take advantage of this by providing DHCP, (Dynamic Host Control Protocol) servers which allocate IP4 and, on more modern routers, IP6 addresses which are invisible to the outside world because by default, the router blocks most incoming connections and prevents traffic. OK, that's a brief and very generic description of a typical residential network but, of course, it isn't how things are in all cases. Sometimes networks can be modified so that services do pass through the router by intent, and certain server functions can be used even though the network is still using NAT. For this purpose, the Apple Time Capsule is ideal. It does everything you'd expect a router to do, and more. It also gives you shared disk and printer connectivity both via Giganet and via wi-fi networking. The Time Capsules does, however, have a "bridge" mode. The idea being that you can use the router to bridge two networks. Our networks are very different. There is no NAT whatsoever on our network, and each device has its own public IP address, and is exposed to the Internet. Our SDSL routers are simply gateways, and do no firewall functions. Thus, it's down to the specific devices on the network to protect themselves and handle network traffic intelligently. So, I thought, I'll connect the Time Capsule in bridged mode, so that it doesn't act as a router. It's simply another device on the network to which our machines have access. However, the Time Capsule fails miserably in this kind of environment. If you have devices on the back of the Time Capsule, they should be visible to other local devices and, if they know the respective access passwords, also to external users on the Internet. But the Time Capsule slows down the entire network assembly in those mode, and can't be used in its default configuration on our network because NAT is not supported. I guess the Time Capsule is designed mostly for the residential user, so Apple doesn't think this important enough. But the hardware specs of the Time Capsule are appalling. When I do comparisons between high-end professional gateway routers and the Time Capsule, in terms of access speed, functionality and overall performance the time Capsule loses every time. I have to say I am disappointed in the Time Capsule. I'd hoped that it could form an integral part of our network, providing facilities which we could use from anywhere. However, following all these tests, I have now concluded that there is little point in keeping the TC on line, as it is introducing bottlenecks which are detrimental to our entire network. I can only hope that, in the future, Apple comes to realise that there are users out there who don't use the residential type of networks. Apple claims that the Time Capsule is great for the home or the office. Well, all I can say is that they haven't really done their homework properly. The flaws in the Time Capsule's design are exposed very quickly when you try to integrate the device in a high specification network. Overall I'm a fan of Apple's products, but I confess that sometimes their presumptions and hand-holding do irritate me. Is anybody else on list using a TC in a high spec network? If so, I'd be interested to know how you find it. Gordon From gordon at mac-access.net Fri May 27 13:20:18 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 13:20:18 +0100 Subject: A Computer Error Released 450 Prisoners with "a High Risk of Violence" In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: This doesn't make sense. How on earth can a computer error release prisoners? I would presume this is just badly phrased and that the actual meaning was that, due to a computer error, 450 high risk inmates were released. But again, it's not really a computer error, people always blame computer errors for their mistakes. Computers do what they're programmed to do so, if there is an error, it's a programming or data entry error and it's not the confuter's fault, it is the computer operator's fault. But how does this relate to technology? I'd have said this is more a social issue than technology. On 27 May 2011, at 06:25, Sarah Alawami wrote: Computer system errors accidentally released more than 450 inmates with "a high risk of violence" from California prisons. What might be even worse is that no attempt has been made to return any of them back to prison. More ? From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Fri May 27 14:41:11 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 08:41:11 -0500 Subject: A Computer Error Released 450 Prisoners with "a High Risk of Violence" Message-ID: <201105271341.p4RDfB0I013516@x.it.okstate.edu> That story rings a bell and I think it is a clerical issue, not a technology issue. A computer error is when some deficiency in the technology produces a bizarre outcome that is not logically defensible. Remember the Pentium math coprocessor fiasco from about 20 years ago? The coprocessor unit which was part of one of the Pentium CPU series was defective and produced results that were mathematically wrong and not just due to rounding errors. Architects, engineers and graphic designers soon found that their work was wrong due to something over which they had no control. That's a computer error. The situation with the inmates has to do with a US Supreme court ruling that California must immediately begin reducing prison overcrowding. The 450 inmates were assessed as being really bad eggs but the test results were not used in the release criteria and you can't blame sloppy bookkeeping on machines. Actually a lack of functional technology is more likely the culprit. Gordon Smith writes: > This doesn't make sense. How on earth can a computer error release > prisoners? I would presume this is just badly phrased and that the > actual meaning was that, due to a computer error, 450 high risk inmates > were released. But again, it's not really a computer error, people > always blame computer errors for their mistakes. Computers do what > they're programmed to do so, if there is an error, it's a programming or > data entry error and it's not the confuter's fault, it is the computer > operator's fault. > > But how does this relate to technology? I'd have said this is more a > social issue than technology. > > On 27 May 2011, at 06:25, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > Computer system errors accidentally released more than 450 inmates with > "a high risk of violence" from California prisons. What might be even > worse is that no attempt has been made to return any of them back to > prison. More >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, > virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated > web pages located at > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group > since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > From djden at thejazzden.org.uk Fri May 27 15:28:40 2011 From: djden at thejazzden.org.uk (Dennis Freedman) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 15:28:40 +0100 Subject: Keeping track of photos Message-ID: <932DEA91-33CA-47C2-8D96-24D31E51B7A5@thejazzden.org.uk> Hello Listers From time to time I have to use photos as images in emails, FaceBook, Twitter etc. While it's a simple matter for a sighted person to find the correct photo from their phone or computer, it's impossible for a blind person without sighted assistance unless the photos are tagged or renamed when copied to the computer, an even more difficult if not impossible task when more than one new photo is involved. Do any of you have a reasonably easy way of keeping track of photos? I find my IPhone is so easy to send photos from to email or FaceBook, but it doesn't allow for naming of photos in the photo album. It's relatively easy to attach a photo file on the Mac or in Windows to email, but again, like in FaceBook, unless you've got a name for the photo how do you know which one to send? Or do any of you use a digital camera, transferring the unnamed image files from the camera's memory card onto the computer then renaming them, I guess again with sighted assistance? Any suggestions welcomed. Replies specific to the IPhone or IMac or Windows which I've mentioned should really be sent off list I guess. With thanks in advance. From lynne at mac-access.net Fri May 27 15:41:11 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 15:41:11 +0100 Subject: A Admin Error, Not Computer Error; [Was Re: A Computer Error Released 450 Prisoners with "a High Risk of Violence"] In-Reply-To: <201105271341.p4RDfB0I013516@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105271341.p4RDfB0I013516@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <6AEF8D2A-FD87-43EA-BFF0-EE87BC1177B4@mac-access.net> Hello all Could we close this thread now please because it has little to do with technology. Lynne From moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk Fri May 27 16:38:38 2011 From: moore.c at blueyonder.co.uk (Chris Moore) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 16:38:38 +0100 Subject: Apple Time Capsule Second Generation; Joke! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <44C52992-2135-4AC1-A4B2-522C068488C1@blueyonder.co.uk> I think the key in their description was 'great for home or office" but you are using a high spec network so higher spec hardware would be required and not a one aimed at the domestic / small business / small LAN market? I think the bridge facility works in the same way as the Airport Express as it is a wi fi extender. On 27 May 2011, at 11:22, Gordon Smith wrote: > Hi all > > REcently we've been having problems with the Apple Time Capsule on our network. To explain properly. Our network isn't a residential type of network which use NAT (Network Address Translation) to share a public IP address amongst a specified number of devices. > > For example, you have a router which sits on the front of your network plugged into your DSL, ADSL or cable modem. The modem allocates an IP address to your router which acts as the public IP and allows you to log into the Internet. Behind that router's switch, however, you have maybe 4 computers connected which also get allocated IP addresses but those IP addresses are in what's known as an "Un-routable range". When the IP4 protocol was designed, the software engineers who did the work had the foresight to allocate a number of subnets which are not routable via an Extranet such as the Internet. So, they set aside subnets such as "192.168.*.*", "10.*.*.*", plus a couple of others which are used exclusively for internal networks. > > Therefore, the NAT routers can take advantage of this by providing DHCP, (Dynamic Host Control Protocol) servers which allocate IP4 and, on more modern routers, IP6 addresses which are invisible to the outside world because by default, the router blocks most incoming connections and prevents traffic. > > OK, that's a brief and very generic description of a typical residential network but, of course, it isn't how things are in all cases. Sometimes networks can be modified so that services do pass through the router by intent, and certain server functions can be used even though the network is still using NAT. > > For this purpose, the Apple Time Capsule is ideal. It does everything you'd expect a router to do, and more. It also gives you shared disk and printer connectivity both via Giganet and via wi-fi networking. > > The Time Capsules does, however, have a "bridge" mode. The idea being that you can use the router to bridge two networks. > > Our networks are very different. There is no NAT whatsoever on our network, and each device has its own public IP address, and is exposed to the Internet. Our SDSL routers are simply gateways, and do no firewall functions. Thus, it's down to the specific devices on the network to protect themselves and handle network traffic intelligently. > > So, I thought, I'll connect the Time Capsule in bridged mode, so that it doesn't act as a router. It's simply another device on the network to which our machines have access. However, the Time Capsule fails miserably in this kind of environment. If you have devices on the back of the Time Capsule, they should be visible to other local devices and, if they know the respective access passwords, also to external users on the Internet. But the Time Capsule slows down the entire network assembly in those mode, and can't be used in its default configuration on our network because NAT is not supported. > > I guess the Time Capsule is designed mostly for the residential user, so Apple doesn't think this important enough. But the hardware specs of the Time Capsule are appalling. > > When I do comparisons between high-end professional gateway routers and the Time Capsule, in terms of access speed, functionality and overall performance the time Capsule loses every time. > > I have to say I am disappointed in the Time Capsule. I'd hoped that it could form an integral part of our network, providing facilities which we could use from anywhere. However, following all these tests, I have now concluded that there is little point in keeping the TC on line, as it is introducing bottlenecks which are detrimental to our entire network. > > I can only hope that, in the future, Apple comes to realise that there are users out there who don't use the residential type of networks. Apple claims that the Time Capsule is great for the home or the office. Well, all I can say is that they haven't really done their homework properly. The flaws in the Time Capsule's design are exposed very quickly when you try to integrate the device in a high specification network. Overall I'm a fan of Apple's products, but I confess that sometimes their presumptions and hand-holding do irritate me. > > Is anybody else on list using a TC in a high spec network? If so, I'd be interested to know how you find it. > > Gordon > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Fri May 27 18:05:34 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 12:05:34 -0500 Subject: Keeping track of photos Message-ID: <201105271705.p4RH5Y3Q014672@x.it.okstate.edu> Until you can get the photos to some storage media where you can rename them to something meaningful, you might be able to use the time stamp on each file to know what order they were taken in, that is assuming the clock was set right on the camera. The few times I have handled photo files, the stamps told one when the file was created but the name is just a long series of numbers. Dennis Freedman writes: > From time to time I have to use photos as images in emails, FaceBook, > Twitter etc. While it's a simple matter for a sighted person to find the > correct photo from their phone or computer, it's impossible for a blind > person without sighted assistance unless the photos are tagged or renamed > when copied to the computer, an even more difficult if not impossible > task when more than one new photo is involved. > Do any of you have a reasonably easy way of keeping track of photos? I > find my IPhone is so easy to send photos from to email or FaceBook, but > it doesn't allow for naming of photos in the photo album. It's relatively > easy to attach a photo file on the Mac or in Windows to email, but again, > like in FaceBook, unless you've got a name for the photo how do you know > which one to send? Or do any of you use a digital camera, transferring > the unnamed image files from the camera's memory card onto the computer > then renaming them, I guess again with sighted assistance? > Any suggestions welcomed. Replies specific to the IPhone or IMac or > Windows which I've mentioned should really be sent off list I guess. > With thanks in advance. From gordon at mac-access.net Fri May 27 19:08:54 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 19:08:54 +0100 Subject: Apple Time Capsule Second Generation; Joke! In-Reply-To: <44C52992-2135-4AC1-A4B2-522C068488C1@blueyonder.co.uk> References: <44C52992-2135-4AC1-A4B2-522C068488C1@blueyonder.co.uk> Message-ID: <5451F853-0613-4CE7-8406-B3D5B3D478E1@mac-access.net> Hello Chris Just to address your last point. No, the bridge service is absolutely nothing to do with wi-fi extending. What it does is makes the TC into a device on your existing network, rather than a network router or server. You can access it via an IP address which you have to assign manually. So no, don't get mixed up between extending and bridge as they are two totally different concepts. But my point here was Chris that the TC slows down the network even when used in Bridged mode. I would never have expected it to work as a router on our network which, as you rightly say, is far more high spec than the residential or small office type of network. But it shouldn't adversely effect the network in the way it does when in Bridge mode. The TC is not, by definition, being used as a switch or router. Effectively it's being used as a hub and nothing more. So the specs of the router shouldn't matter, it's a Giganet device and it shouldn't be slowing down the network in the way that it is. Im going to do more tests over the weekend to see if there is any work-around for this. But if not, then although we could use the drive space, the TC goes into cold storage and will probably not surface again for quite a considerable time. On 27 May 2011, at 16:38, Chris Moore wrote: I think the key in their description was 'great for home or office" but you are using a high spec network so higher spec hardware would be required and not a one aimed at the domestic / small business / small LAN market? I think the bridge facility works in the same way as the Airport Express as it is a wi fi extender. From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 20:57:09 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 12:57:09 -0700 Subject: This Mathematical Formula Cancels Out All Sound [Factoid] Message-ID: This Mathematical Formula Cancels Out All Sound [Factoid] There's a baby crying next to you, and it's extremely annoying. You hate it. It's a cute baby, but come on, you're trying to sleep on the train. Luckily, math (and tech that uses it) can wipe the baby out. More ? http://bit.ly/mJDwrh From marrie12 at gmail.com Fri May 27 20:58:55 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Fri, 27 May 2011 12:58:55 -0700 Subject: How to Share Photos of Your Adorable Child or Pet Without Annoying Your Friends [Etiquette] Message-ID: <7B35D6E8-705E-4340-980E-5B6654A6C037@gmail.com> How to Share Photos of Your Adorable Child or Pet Without Annoying Your Friends [Etiquette] That picture of your baby/dog/child on the couch is almost as cute as the one of her on a chair! Which is almost as cute as the one of her sleeping! Which is almost as cute as? OK STOP. More ? http://bit.ly/k4aO9l From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 28 14:05:06 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 14:05:06 +0100 Subject: Windows Apps Message-ID: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> Hello everybody We have just finished installing OTS DJ on to our Windows-based NetBook. The programme runs fine, although it looks quite different to how Gordon says he remembers it. The biggest struggle in going to be the mouse navigation. Since upgrading to Window-Eyes 7.5 from 7.2, there appears to have been lots of changes and we cannot get the mouse keys to work at all. Gordon, as usual, started to get very frustrated as he thinks that these movements must be due o his own errors. Anybody else noticed the mouse key problem in WE 7.5? Actually this AP has change a lot since Gordon used it. But why Window-Eyes 7.5 is so slow and totally unresponsive at times I really don't know. But it is on our NetBook and it is a darn irritant So now a question about the NetBook itself in case anybody happens to know the answer. A while ago now, we bought some fast memory, I forget the spec now but it's what theMacBooks use. We inadvertently ought 2 of what we wanted instead of 1. But now it might come in useful after all. Does anybody know the procedure for changing memory in an Asus EEEPC NetBook; I think the model number is 1015PEN and it's part of the EEEPC series. We can see the memory module compartment on the bottom of the box. Bit it's how to open it. There's what looks to me like some sort of catch on the bottom which you have to pull out. But I dare not go too far with that in case I break it. Any info very very welcome on any of these topics. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 28 14:16:33 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 23:16:33 +1000 Subject: Windows Apps In-Reply-To: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> References: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <8C171721-15A8-4F45-8451-676026D5BCCB@internode.on.net> Yes I've noticed this but the thing I've noticed about WE 7.5 in general is that the software is very sluggish and unpredictable, by that i mean that when you press a key combination or perform an action you're never quite sure what will happen any more, will pressing say ctrl-shift-r start reading the document from where you are or will it do sweet nothing or do something entirely different? In short WE 7.5 is a complete and utter joke, waste of time or whatever you wish to call it and I'm using NVDA for much of everything these days because it works, including mouse movement keys . On 28/05/2011, at 11:05 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello everybody > > We have just finished installing OTS DJ on to our Windows-based NetBook. The programme runs fine, although it looks quite different to how Gordon says he remembers it. The biggest struggle in going to be the mouse navigation. Since upgrading to Window-Eyes 7.5 from 7.2, there appears to have been lots of changes and we cannot get the mouse keys to work at all. > > Gordon, as usual, started to get very frustrated as he thinks that these movements must be due o his own errors. > > Anybody else noticed the mouse key problem in WE 7.5? > > Actually this AP has change a lot since Gordon used it. But why Window-Eyes 7.5 is so slow and totally unresponsive at times I really don't know. But it is on our NetBook and it is a darn irritant > > So now a question about the NetBook itself in case anybody happens to know the answer. A while ago now, we bought some fast memory, I forget the spec now but it's what theMacBooks use. We inadvertently ought 2 of what we wanted instead of 1. But now it might come in useful after all. Does anybody know the procedure for changing memory in an Asus EEEPC NetBook; I think the model number is 1015PEN and it's part of the EEEPC series. > > We can see the memory module compartment on the bottom of the box. Bit it's how to open it. There's what looks to me like some sort of catch on the bottom which you have to pull out. But I dare not go too far with that in case I break it. > > Any info very very welcome on any of these topics. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 28 14:37:14 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 14:37:14 +0100 Subject: Windows Apps In-Reply-To: <8C171721-15A8-4F45-8451-676026D5BCCB@internode.on.net> References: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> <8C171721-15A8-4F45-8451-676026D5BCCB@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <8D8CA289-9172-4ADE-853F-585D043211A2@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 28 May 2011, at 14:16, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Yes I've noticed this but the thing I've noticed about WE 7.5 in general is that the software is very sluggish and unpredictable, by that i mean that when you press a key combination or perform an action you're never quite sure what will happen any more, will pressing say ctrl-shift-r start reading the document from where you are or will it do sweet nothing or do something entirely different? In short WE 7.5 is a complete and utter joke, waste of time or whatever you wish to call it and I'm using NVDA for much of everything these days because it works, including mouse movement keys . We have never used the read to end function so can't comment on that. But on the rest of it, I agree totally, it is a joke. Of course, GW Micro have stopped answering our email and because, I thin, of the serious slamming Gordon gave GW Micro last year when he was asked to participate in an online discussion about accessibility in general. Doug Geoffray was not pleased I gather. Well; they say the truth hurts. Doug tried some time ago to tell his list members that all you could do with VoiceOver was install the operating system. He said that it was great that the OS came up talking when you ran the installer but he said that post-install you can't do much. His claim was that you can't efficient browse the web, write email, and do all the usual things that people like to do. That comment was made when Gordon was a GW beta tester and it was a contributory factor in our decision to ditch that project. But getting back to the point. Yes, Window-Eyes 7.5 probably won't be the latest and greatest for long. I bet GW is even now working on a new release and, if they charge their customers another $175.00 US to upgrade, we certainly won't be buying that. Now, on to NVDA. We think we have a version of it somewhere which we downloaded quite recently. So I had better go and look for it. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 28 15:45:45 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 00:45:45 +1000 Subject: WE and NVDA In-Reply-To: <8D8CA289-9172-4ADE-853F-585D043211A2@mac-access.net> References: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> <8C171721-15A8-4F45-8451-676026D5BCCB@internode.on.net> <8D8CA289-9172-4ADE-853F-585D043211A2@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DE10A99.3030300@internode.on.net> Well onto Doug for a moment, he knows his claims about VO are just BS, there just happens to be one - won't name names - person who regularly participates in the GW Micro talk on the GW-Info list, let's just say there was! one person who up until recently participated but ditched his participation because - like Gordon - was getting no satisfaction from GW Micro when it came to tech support, wasn't getting his questions answered and so on. I've gone back to using - when I use Window-Eyes - version 7.2 Refresh orwhatever the upgrade was called. Probably the best place to find NVDA is on the web site for the latest version. On 28/05/2011 11:37 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 28 May 2011, at 14:16, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? Yes I've noticed this but the thing I've noticed about WE 7.5 in general is that the software is very sluggish and unpredictable, by that i mean that when you press a key combination or perform an action you're never quite sure what will happen any more, will pressing say ctrl-shift-r start reading the document from where you are or will it do sweet nothing or do something entirely different? In short WE 7.5 is a complete and utter joke, waste of time or whatever you wish to call it and I'm using NVDA for much of everything these days because it works, including mouse movement keys. > > We have never used the read to end function so can't comment on that. But on the rest of it, I agree totally, it is a joke. Of course, GW Micro have stopped answering our email and because, I thin, of the serious slamming Gordon gave GW Micro last year when he was asked to participate in an online discussion about accessibility in general. Doug Geoffray was not pleased I gather. Well; they say the truth hurts. > > Doug tried some time ago to tell his list members that all you could do with VoiceOver was install the operating system. He said that it was great that the OS came up talking when you ran the installer but he said that post-install you can't do much. His claim was that you can't efficient browse the web, write email, and do all the usual things that people like to do. > > That comment was made when Gordon was a GW beta tester and it was a contributory factor in our decision to ditch that project. > > But getting back to the point. Yes, Window-Eyes 7.5 probably won't be the latest and greatest for long. I bet GW is even now working on a new release and, if they charge their customers another $175.00 US to upgrade, we certainly won't be buying that. > > Now, on to NVDA. We think we have a version of it somewhere which we downloaded quite recently. So I had better go and look for it. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 28 17:42:46 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 17:42:46 +0100 Subject: Window-Eyes Observations In-Reply-To: <4DE10A99.3030300@internode.on.net> References: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> <8C171721-15A8-4F45-8451-676026D5BCCB@internode.on.net> <8D8CA289-9172-4ADE-853F-585D043211A2@mac-access.net> <4DE10A99.3030300@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Hello Dane On 28 May 2011, at 15:45, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Well onto Doug for a moment, he knows his claims about VO are just BS, there just happens to be one - won't name names - person who regularly participates in the GW Micro talk on the GW-Info list, let's just say there was! one person who up until recently participated but ditched his participation because - like Gordon - was getting no satisfaction from GW Micro when it came to tech support, wasn't getting his questions answered and so on. It seems to be a common occurrence with GW. I was talking to somebody at Humanware recently and they were telling me that they two are having problems dealing with GW Micro. In fact, it was I who pointed out to Humanware that their Window-Eyes page was way out of date. They still had all the stuff about Window-Eyes 5.0 which ran under 98/ME. This was reported to the people in Canada and they got back to me to say thank you for making them aware of the issue. But the point of mentioning that was that it used to be the case that all GW dealers had to undergo tests to make suer they knew about Window-Eyes and how to use the thin. Now, it seems, that no longer happens and GW doesn't give a stuff about the dealers knowing the products. GW is there for the money, nothing else. ? I've gone back to using - when I use Window-Eyes - version 7.2 Refresh orwhatever the upgrade was called. We'll most likely end up doing the same shortly. It really is a pain in the proverbial backside; but Gordon doesn't like the new Window-Eyes interface much I don't think. In fact, we haven't seen anything major that's new in 7.5 which really gives you an advantage. Apart from the fact that you need 7.5 if you want to use IE9 or if you want to use Windows Libve. That aside, 7.2 seems a better product and we won't be buying any more upgrades from that company. But finally, I would add that when he was testing for GW, Gordon got Doug Geoffray and the head accessibility engineer (whose name I won't mention publicly) in communication and that's how the iTunes support began in Window-Eyes. Previously GW was saying it was too much work and they couldn't be wasting time on that when they had other projects to meat. Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Sat May 28 17:50:36 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 02:50:36 +1000 Subject: Window-Eyes Observations In-Reply-To: References: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> <8C171721-15A8-4F45-8451-676026D5BCCB@internode.on.net> <8D8CA289-9172-4ADE-853F-585D043211A2@mac-access.net> <4DE10A99.3030300@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <6072027F-2B31-4539-8CDF-031AD3562E32@internode.on.net> Gee! that's a nice attitude I don't think, couldn't be bothered wasting their time as they had other projects and deadlines to meet? What about the customers of GW Micro or Gutless Wonder Micro as someone in a private message to me has just called it . On 29/05/2011, at 2:42 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 28 May 2011, at 15:45, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? Well onto Doug for a moment, he knows his claims about VO are just BS, there just happens to be one - won't name names - person who regularly participates in the GW Micro talk on the GW-Info list, let's just say there was! one person who up until recently participated but ditched his participation because - like Gordon - was getting no satisfaction from GW Micro when it came to tech support, wasn't getting his questions answered and so on. > > It seems to be a common occurrence with GW. I was talking to somebody at Humanware recently and they were telling me that they two are having problems dealing with GW Micro. In fact, it was I who pointed out to Humanware that their Window-Eyes page was way out of date. They still had all the stuff about Window-Eyes 5.0 which ran under 98/ME. This was reported to the people in Canada and they got back to me to say thank you for making them aware of the issue. > > But the point of mentioning that was that it used to be the case that all GW dealers had to undergo tests to make suer they knew about Window-Eyes and how to use the thin. Now, it seems, that no longer happens and GW doesn't give a stuff about the dealers knowing the products. GW is there for the money, nothing else. > > ? I've gone back to using - when I use Window-Eyes - version 7.2 Refresh orwhatever the upgrade was called. > > We'll most likely end up doing the same shortly. It really is a pain in the proverbial backside; but Gordon doesn't like the new Window-Eyes interface much I don't think. In fact, we haven't seen anything major that's new in 7.5 which really gives you an advantage. Apart from the fact that you need 7.5 if you want to use IE9 or if you want to use Windows Libve. That aside, 7.2 seems a better product and we won't be buying any more upgrades from that company. > > But finally, I would add that when he was testing for GW, Gordon got Doug Geoffray and the head accessibility engineer (whose name I won't mention publicly) in communication and that's how the iTunes support began in Window-Eyes. Previously GW was saying it was too much work and they couldn't be wasting time on that when they had other projects to meat. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Sat May 28 18:48:22 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 18:48:22 +0100 Subject: Window-Eyes Observations In-Reply-To: <6072027F-2B31-4539-8CDF-031AD3562E32@internode.on.net> References: <2E906BA5-E402-49D8-B042-EBD90FDBEFEF@mac-access.net> <8C171721-15A8-4F45-8451-676026D5BCCB@internode.on.net> <8D8CA289-9172-4ADE-853F-585D043211A2@mac-access.net> <4DE10A99.3030300@internode.on.net> <6072027F-2B31-4539-8CDF-031AD3562E32@internode.on.net> Message-ID: Hello Dane On 28 May 2011, at 17:50, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Gee! that's a nice attitude I don't think, couldn't be bothered wasting their time as they had other projects and deadlines to meet? What about the customers of GW Micro or Gutless Wonder Micro as someone in a private message to me has just called it . Well it seems that that company has totally changed its philosophies regarding their products. I'm told that in the early days, they were a very friendly, user-orientated company who would often go the extra mile to help the user. Now, they're large commercial outfit which has lost its humanity. By that, I mean that they no longer care about the customer; as long as the turnover keeps moving. I don't know how much Freedom Scientific charges its customers for upgrades. Maybe it is about the same. But they apparently went the same way as GW Micro has gone when Ted (Gordon can't remember his surname, something like Henterjoice) sold the then small company to Blazer Engineering, or somebody. This is just what I'm being told. They merged and formed Freedom Scientific. And out of that grew the big monster we have today. GW Micro may be trying to compete with them and so they have to trample the customers into the dirt just the same as Freedom does. Anyway, I'm babbling. But as an outsider so to speak, I find it pretty horrendous reading about and learning about what's going on in the so-called accessibility industry. I gather that the UK company called Sight & Sound together with Freedom, re-sold Gordon's serial number just after he bought his JFW license back in 2000. It only came to light when he enquired with S&S as to why he wasn't receiving SMA upgrades which he'd paid for. They discovered that the serial number had been re-sold and the second client was receiving what Gordon paid for. There were enquiries but in the end Freedom just said that they were very sorry but they couldn't help Gordon any further. The fact that he'd lost a lot of money was, to them, just a little unfortunate. I wasn't around in those days; but if I had been I wouldn't have tolerated that. I'd have taken it as far as I legally had to in order to get regress. But it just shows you the kind of sharks that they are now in that industry and I'm very glad that Gordon is now out of it, having moved over to the mac for 99% of what he does. Lynn From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 29 05:21:05 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 21:21:05 -0700 Subject: Patriot Act renewed despite warnings of 'secret' law Message-ID: <206C2D94-127E-404A-8368-E66C0CFA3422@gmail.com> Patriot Act renewed despite warnings of 'secret' law After senators reveal that Justice Department has a secret interpretation of controversial law, speculation turns to whether cell phone location records are being vacuumed up. http://cnet.co/lGSUyS From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 29 05:22:27 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sat, 28 May 2011 21:22:27 -0700 Subject: Microsoft's lucrative new revenue stream? Android. Message-ID: <9EAA5233-164F-4EC9-A868-4657F9C5464D@gmail.com> This might be old news as it came to my rss thingy yesterday but here ya go. sorry for the lateness. Microsoft's lucrative new revenue stream? Android. The irony's enough to make your head explode: Microsoft makes more money from Android than it does Windows Phone. http://cnet.co/kEELZJ From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 29 12:21:23 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 04:21:23 -0700 Subject: Twitter Buckles To Legal Pressure and Releases Confidential User Info [Twitter] Message-ID: Twitter Buckles To Legal Pressure and Releases Confidential User Info [Twitter] Twitter just gave into pressure from British councillors to release the private information of users who made some allegedly libelous tweets. This is a landmark case in the already-messy realm of online free speech and privacy. More ? http://bit.ly/iKyDx4 From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Sun May 29 14:23:50 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 08:23:50 -0500 Subject: Twitter Buckles To Legal Pressure and Releases Confidential User Info [Twitter] Message-ID: <201105291323.p4TDNowZ024182@x.it.okstate.edu> Sometimes, it is a thin grey line between technological and social issues, but this is more a social/legal issue and not really about technology. From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 29 19:28:26 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 11:28:26 -0700 Subject: Twitter Buckles To Legal Pressure and Releases Confidential User Info [Twitter] In-Reply-To: <201105291323.p4TDNowZ024182@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105291323.p4TDNowZ024182@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: Oops? sorry about htat. Yeah I can never tell and I don't want to post to both lists. but I will repoet to the just chat thingy if I can dinf the thing in my now updated rss feeds. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 29, 2011, at 6:23 AM, Martin McCormick wrote: > Sometimes, it is a thin grey line between technological and > social issues, but this is more a social/legal issue and not > really about technology. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Sun May 29 19:51:45 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 11:51:45 -0700 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard Message-ID: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard Want to build a fast-booting system without buying and installing a solid state drive? Gigabyte is giving you another option by launching a new motherboard that has a 20GB SSD baked right in.... http://zd.net/j5TgVm From gordon at mac-access.net Sun May 29 20:06:28 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 20:06:28 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> I assume, Sarah, you meant built right in, not baked right in. :) Personally though I wouldn't go for something like this because, if your SSD goes down, so does your entire computer and, effectively, bye bye all of your data. Besides which, 22GB, unless this was an error as well, is hardly anything to write home about. Gordon On 29 May 2011, at 19:51, Sarah Alawami wrote: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard Want to build a fast-booting system without buying and installing a solid state drive? Gigabyte is giving you another option by launching a new motherboard that has a 20GB SSD baked right in.... From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 30 00:20:34 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 16:20:34 -0700 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Nope I did not modify the subject line. I asume that you can install a sata drive in to there and have your apps and data stored there and run the os off of the 20 gig ssd drive. which is a good idea in my opinion. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 29, 2011, at 12:06 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > I assume, Sarah, you meant built right in, not baked right in. :) > > Personally though I wouldn't go for something like this because, if your SSD goes down, so does your entire computer and, effectively, bye bye all of your data. Besides which, 22GB, unless this was an error as well, is hardly anything to write home about. > > Gordon > > On 29 May 2011, at 19:51, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard > > Want to build a fast-booting system without buying and installing a solid state drive? Gigabyte is giving you another option by launching a new motherboard that has a 20GB SSD baked right in.... > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 00:42:08 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 09:42:08 +1000 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows Message-ID: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> Hi! Anyone know if there's any software which will allow the opening of Mac Sparsebundles under Windows? From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 01:11:34 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 01:11:34 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> Hello Sarah On 30 May 2011, at 00:20, Sarah Alawami wrote: ? Nope I did not modify the subject line. I asume that you can install a sata drive in to there and have your apps and data stored there and run the os off of the 20 gig ssd drive. which is a good idea in my opinion. I think what Gordon was getting at was that the machine is not modular in as much as the SDD was in-built. So if the motherboard develops a fault, you've lost everything; and the potential for data theft exists when your machine goes away for repair/replacement, if that is necessary. Gordon used to build computers for a living in his not too distant past. And I think he sees things from a slightly different perspective than you do. From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 01:12:26 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 01:12:26 +0100 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 30 May 2011, at 00:42, Dane Trethowan wrote: Anyone know if there's any software which will allow the opening of Mac Sparsebundles under Windows? Yes, Transmac. Lynne _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 01:13:48 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 10:13:48 +1000 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> I Really? I know you can access DMG files, never managed to get Sparsebundles to work yet. On 30/05/2011 10:12 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 30 May 2011, at 00:42, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > > Anyone know if there's any software which will allow the opening of Mac Sparsebundles under Windows? > > Yes, Transmac. > > Lynne > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 01:17:23 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 01:17:23 +0100 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 30 May 2011, at 01:13, Dane Trethowan wrote: I Really? I know you can access DMG files, never managed to get Sparsebundles to work yet. Yes, really! Lynne From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 01:17:43 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 10:17:43 +1000 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> Seems rather a mute point really, what's the difference between this and a hard drive built-in to a computer when it comes to potential data theft? Surely! you're not suggesting that every person who owns a computer should know how to take his machine to pieces to remove the hard drive before sending off to service to keep data safe? Yep, I could probably remove a hard drive from my PC but why should I need that knowledge? After all! I'd say that most people on the road take their cars to mechanics and that must be true otherwise they wouldn't be in business. On 30/05/2011 10:11 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > On 30 May 2011, at 00:20, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > ? Nope I did not modify the subject line. I asume that you can install a sata drive in to there and have your apps and data stored there and run the os off of the 20 gig ssd drive. which is a good idea in my opinion. > > > I think what Gordon was getting at was that the machine is not modular in as much as the SDD was in-built. So if the motherboard develops a fault, you've lost everything; and the potential for data theft exists when your machine goes away for repair/replacement, if that is necessary. > > Gordon used to build computers for a living in his not too distant past. And I think he sees things from a slightly different perspective than you do. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 01:20:28 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 10:20:28 +1000 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DE2E2CC.3010005@internode.on.net> Yeah okay how? I can't even access my C: drive with Transmac to look at the sparasebundle. On 30/05/2011 10:17 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 30 May 2011, at 01:13, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I Really? I know you can access DMG files, never managed to get Sparsebundles to work yet. > > Yes, really! > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 01:23:53 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 01:23:53 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 30 May 2011, at 01:17, Dane Trethowan wrote: I think you're missing the point. The point I'm making is that if the motherboard goes down, you lose your entire OS or whatever you have on the drive at the time. If your HD is separate from the motherboard you still have your data when the machine comes back. You may have to re-install the OS; but at least you still have your data. Lynne ? Seems rather a mute point really, what's the difference between this and a hard drive built-in to a computer when it comes to potential data theft? Surely! you're not suggesting that every person who owns a computer should know how to take his machine to pieces to remove the hard drive before sending off to service to keep data safe? Yep, I could probably remove a hard drive from my PC but why should I need that knowledge? After all! I'd say that most people on the road take their cars to mechanics and that must be true otherwise they wouldn't be in business. On 30/05/2011 10:11 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > On 30 May 2011, at 00:20, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > ? Nope I did not modify the subject line. I asume that you can install a sata drive in to there and have your apps and data stored there and run the os off of the 20 gig ssd drive. which is a good idea in my opinion. > > > I think what Gordon was getting at was that the machine is not modular in as much as the SDD was in-built. So if the motherboard develops a fault, you've lost everything; and the potential for data theft exists when your machine goes away for repair/replacement, if that is necessary. > > Gordon used to build computers for a living in his not too distant past. And I think he sees things from a slightly different perspective than you do. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 01:24:53 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 01:24:53 +0100 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <4DE2E2CC.3010005@internode.on.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> <4DE2E2CC.3010005@internode.on.net> Message-ID: From the Acute System website: TransMac for Windows can open Macintosh format disk drives, flash drives, CD/DVD/Blu-ray media, high density diskettes, dmg and sparseimage files. Lynne On 30 May 2011, at 01:20, Dane Trethowan wrote: Yeah okay how? I can't even access my C: drive with Transmac to look at the sparasebundle. On 30/05/2011 10:17 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 30 May 2011, at 01:13, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I Really? I know you can access DMG files, never managed to get Sparsebundles to work yet. > > Yes, really! > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 01:33:40 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 10:33:40 +1000 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DE2E5E4.8060206@internode.on.net> Yeah but either way, most computer users have an external backup drive or another hard drive in the computer system for backups anyhow so no difference. On 30/05/2011 10:23 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 30 May 2011, at 01:17, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I think you're missing the point. The point I'm making is that if the motherboard goes down, you lose your entire OS or whatever you have on the drive at the time. If your HD is separate from the motherboard you still have your data when the machine comes back. You may have to re-install the OS; but at least you still have your data. > > Lynne > > > ? Seems rather a mute point really, what's the difference between this and a hard drive built-in to a computer when it comes to potential data theft? Surely! you're not suggesting that every person who owns a computer should know how to take his machine to pieces to remove the hard drive before sending off to service to keep data safe? Yep, I could probably remove a hard drive from my PC but why should I need that knowledge? After all! I'd say that most people on the road take their cars to mechanics and that must be true otherwise they wouldn't be in business. > > > > > > On 30/05/2011 10:11 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hello Sarah >> On 30 May 2011, at 00:20, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> >> ? Nope I did not modify the subject line. I asume that you can install a sata drive in to there and have your apps and data stored there and run the os off of the 20 gig ssd drive. which is a good idea in my opinion. >> >> >> I think what Gordon was getting at was that the machine is not modular in as much as the SDD was in-built. So if the motherboard develops a fault, you've lost everything; and the potential for data theft exists when your machine goes away for repair/replacement, if that is necessary. >> >> Gordon used to build computers for a living in his not too distant past. And I think he sees things from a slightly different perspective than you do. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 01:34:13 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 10:34:13 +1000 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> <4DE2E2CC.3010005@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <4DE2E605.8060501@internode.on.net> So I see but how? On 30/05/2011 10:24 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > From the Acute System website: > > TransMac for Windows can open Macintosh format disk drives, flash drives, CD/DVD/Blu-ray media, high density diskettes, dmg and sparseimage files. > > Lynne > > > On 30 May 2011, at 01:20, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Yeah okay how? I can't even access my C: drive with Transmac to look at the sparasebundle. > > > > On 30/05/2011 10:17 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hello Dane >> >> On 30 May 2011, at 01:13, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >> I Really? I know you can access DMG files, never managed to get Sparsebundles to work yet. >> >> Yes, really! >> >> Lynne >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 02:10:23 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 02:10:23 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <4DE2E5E4.8060206@internode.on.net> References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> <4DE2E5E4.8060206@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <94E8CE99-6B36-4009-8346-EB0B9BE2DE69@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 30 May 2011, at 01:33, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? Yeah but either way, most computer users have an external backup drive or another hard drive in the computer system for backups anyhow so no difference. I think you'll find you're wrong there. Going by the statistics published in "Which Magazine" when they talked about this exact subject last year, (I happened to read that article), they say that in their own surveys of computer users, less then 40% of people did regular backups of their system and an even higher number of people said they had no backup solution at all. So I think based on that, your assertion that "Most People" is a little erroneous. It might be more accurate to say that most people who are more than just "Point & clickers", as I used to be, make backups. Yes, we know that it's not sensible not to have backups; we know that you should do them regularly, blah blah blah. But I stand by the original point Gordon made and I agree with him. It's just like an all-in-one hi-fi system. If your cassette deck or your CD player goes down, you lose the whole system. Exactly the same kind of problem. Lynne From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 02:13:00 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 02:13:00 +0100 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <4DE2E605.8060501@internode.on.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> <4DE2E2CC.3010005@internode.on.net> <4DE2E605.8060501@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <5D57AD2D-2CA9-4D10-8726-35FCBE8EFCB4@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 30 May 2011, at 01:34, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? So I see but how? Well; we don't have it installed at the moment due to the fact that I've had to recover the NetBook from the ground up. RollBAck and Diskeeper had a very violent argument and between them they managed to trash the entire system. But I would assume you just double-click on the sparse bundle as you would any other image. Note; I said double-click, not press enter. Lynne From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 30 02:31:26 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 18:31:26 -0700 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Yeah I'm sure you can run your programs and data off of a sata drive. I duno about these things so I'm just guessing. Take care all. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 29, 2011, at 5:23 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 30 May 2011, at 01:17, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I think you're missing the point. The point I'm making is that if the motherboard goes down, you lose your entire OS or whatever you have on the drive at the time. If your HD is separate from the motherboard you still have your data when the machine comes back. You may have to re-install the OS; but at least you still have your data. > > Lynne > > > ? Seems rather a mute point really, what's the difference between this and a hard drive built-in to a computer when it comes to potential data theft? Surely! you're not suggesting that every person who owns a computer should know how to take his machine to pieces to remove the hard drive before sending off to service to keep data safe? Yep, I could probably remove a hard drive from my PC but why should I need that knowledge? After all! I'd say that most people on the road take their cars to mechanics and that must be true otherwise they wouldn't be in business. > > > > > > On 30/05/2011 10:11 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hello Sarah >> On 30 May 2011, at 00:20, Sarah Alawami wrote: >> >> ? Nope I did not modify the subject line. I asume that you can install a sata drive in to there and have your apps and data stored there and run the os off of the 20 gig ssd drive. which is a good idea in my opinion. >> >> >> I think what Gordon was getting at was that the machine is not modular in as much as the SDD was in-built. So if the motherboard develops a fault, you've lost everything; and the potential for data theft exists when your machine goes away for repair/replacement, if that is necessary. >> >> Gordon used to build computers for a living in his not too distant past. And I think he sees things from a slightly different perspective than you do. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 30 02:32:17 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 18:32:17 -0700 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <4DE2E5E4.8060206@internode.on.net> References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> <4DE2E5E4.8060206@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <19B116D1-DECB-4614-A5D2-6335EC04E424@gmail.com> Yeah I have a back up and what I can afford to loose I just don't back it up. notes for meetings and such. Take care but I think the idea is prtetty cool and a faster os might make all the difference in a few years when we want everythign faster and faster in th eworld of tech. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 29, 2011, at 5:33 PM, Dane Trethowan wrote: > Yeah but either way, most computer users have an external backup drive or another hard drive in the computer system for backups anyhow so no difference. > > > > On 30/05/2011 10:23 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >> Hello Dane >> >> On 30 May 2011, at 01:17, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >> I think you're missing the point. The point I'm making is that if the motherboard goes down, you lose your entire OS or whatever you have on the drive at the time. If your HD is separate from the motherboard you still have your data when the machine comes back. You may have to re-install the OS; but at least you still have your data. >> >> Lynne >> >> >> ? Seems rather a mute point really, what's the difference between this and a hard drive built-in to a computer when it comes to potential data theft? Surely! you're not suggesting that every person who owns a computer should know how to take his machine to pieces to remove the hard drive before sending off to service to keep data safe? Yep, I could probably remove a hard drive from my PC but why should I need that knowledge? After all! I'd say that most people on the road take their cars to mechanics and that must be true otherwise they wouldn't be in business. >> >> >> >> >> >> On 30/05/2011 10:11 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: >>> Hello Sarah >>> On 30 May 2011, at 00:20, Sarah Alawami wrote: >>> >>> ? Nope I did not modify the subject line. I asume that you can install a sata drive in to there and have your apps and data stored there and run the os off of the 20 gig ssd drive. which is a good idea in my opinion. >>> >>> >>> I think what Gordon was getting at was that the machine is not modular in as much as the SDD was in-built. So if the motherboard develops a fault, you've lost everything; and the potential for data theft exists when your machine goes away for repair/replacement, if that is necessary. >>> >>> Gordon used to build computers for a living in his not too distant past. And I think he sees things from a slightly different perspective than you do. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >>> >>> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >>> >>> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >>> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 02:44:13 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 02:44:13 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Hello Sarah On 30 May 2011, at 02:31, Sarah Alawami wrote: Yeah I'm sure you can run your programs and data off of a sata drive. I duno about these things so I'm just guessing. Windows has to be running on the first physical drive. It won't boot off anything else. So, in other words, if the SDD is the first drive which, presumably, it will be, then you have no option; that's where you run it from. But yes, you can store your data files on a second drive and you can have your installed programmes there. But it comes to the same thing if your system fails, you lose the lot. Lynne From marrie12 at gmail.com Mon May 30 02:59:21 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Sun, 29 May 2011 18:59:21 -0700 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: References: <8AE51F8B-6F61-48AA-9BD4-5AC44DDC089D@mac-access.net> <7442AD9B-70F1-4D5C-9C1C-8918E982624D@mac-access.net> <4DE2E227.8050908@internode.on.net> <4EC4E28A-D420-41B9-B9B4-2702FA96B4F3@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <8249992F-5AB5-4F23-9170-2251F8A6F798@gmail.com> No I msn hav ethe system boot from the sandybridge drive. let's call that drive s. So have it boot from drive s and ryn your prorams off of drive z. Take care and hope that made a bit more sence. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 29, 2011, at 6:44 PM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Sarah > > On 30 May 2011, at 02:31, Sarah Alawami wrote: > > Yeah I'm sure you can run your programs and data off of a sata drive. I duno about these things so I'm just guessing. > > Windows has to be running on the first physical drive. It won't boot off anything else. So, in other words, if the SDD is the first drive which, presumably, it will be, then you have no option; that's where you run it from. But yes, you can store your data files on a second drive and you can have your installed programmes there. But it comes to the same thing if your system fails, you lose the lot. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 04:28:10 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 13:28:10 +1000 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <5D57AD2D-2CA9-4D10-8726-35FCBE8EFCB4@mac-access.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> <4DE2E2CC.3010005@internode.on.net> <4DE2E605.8060501@internode.on.net> <5D57AD2D-2CA9-4D10-8726-35FCBE8EFCB4@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <4DE30ECA.7050300@internode.on.net> I can't even access the Sparsebundle through Transmac so thats the first thing. On 30/05/2011 11:13 AM, Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith wrote: > Hello Dane > > On 30 May 2011, at 01:34, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > ? So I see but how? > > Well; we don't have it installed at the moment due to the fact that I've had to recover the NetBook from the ground up. RollBAck and Diskeeper had a very violent argument and between them they managed to trash the entire system. > > But I would assume you just double-click on the sparse bundle as you would any other image. Note; I said double-click, not press enter. > > Lynne > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From lynne at mac-access.net Mon May 30 15:38:12 2011 From: lynne at mac-access.net (Mrs. Lynnette Annabel Smith) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 15:38:12 +0100 Subject: Accessing Mac OSX Sparsebundles under Windows In-Reply-To: <4DE30ECA.7050300@internode.on.net> References: <7DF39079-836F-4133-B1C0-DD23774E8B19@internode.on.net> <33C670FB-EC51-4DD5-B177-B136636325E0@mac-access.net> <4DE2E13C.8080108@internode.on.net> <47B08F5F-65B8-4ED5-983D-BE1FC39C8F05@mac-access.net> <4DE2E2CC.3010005@internode.on.net> <4DE2E605.8060501@internode.on.net> <5D57AD2D-2CA9-4D10-8726-35FCBE8EFCB4@mac-access.net> <4DE30ECA.7050300@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <442BFBC5-77AA-432A-8ED6-69B8C6C16D5E@mac-access.net> Hello Dane On 30 May 2011, at 04:28, Dane Trethowan wrote: ? I can't even access the Sparsebundle through Transmac so thats the first thing. As soon as I get access to Windows again, and as soon as I can get Gordon back up and running on it we can try this for you. But we are both sure it dos work because we've done it before. Gordon can't try it with a screen-reader at the moment because our WE disk is duff and we are going to have to send it back to HumanWare and then ask them to ask GW Micro to send them a replacement disk to then send to us. What a carry on! Anyway until he gets access he can't try it. Lynne From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Mon May 30 17:57:32 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 11:57:32 -0500 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard Message-ID: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> This sort of design was almost inevitable. My only real complaint about modern electronic design is that the non-modularity of it all means that it is all or nothing if something breaks. We still have to connect our expensive computers to outside voltages on networks, possible ground loops on video monitors and sound interfaces. One stray spike of voltage from a lightning strike near by or plugging an RJ45 in to what one thought was an Ethernet connection but which may be something else with no telling what foreign voltages on it is enough to trash the whole mother board. Each new level of integration now means you spend more time and effort getting back to where you were and that's the real cost. Even if your backups are perfect, loose your drive and you've lost whatever time it takes to restore to the new system plus the security implications that now your old drive with all those data are knocking around somewhere that you have no control over. From grtdane at internode.on.net Mon May 30 18:01:22 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 03:01:22 +1000 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <4DE3CD62.7030508@internode.on.net> But that's always been the case with design though hasn't it, a classic case in point is the "3-in-1" or "Music Centre" stereo system which has been around for as long as I can remember. and is still around in some form or other today, I think they're called Midi or Micro hi-fi systems now and some actually sound very good! for what they are. I don't go round knocking things like that, each to their own and if people are satisfied with what they buy then that's all that matters. On 31/05/2011 2:57 AM, Martin McCormick wrote: > This sort of design was almost inevitable. > > My only real complaint about modern electronic design is > that the non-modularity of it all means that it is all or > nothing if something breaks. We still have to connect our > expensive computers to outside voltages on networks, possible > ground loops on video monitors and sound interfaces. One stray > spike of voltage from a lightning strike near by or plugging an > RJ45 in to what one thought was an Ethernet connection but which > may be something else with no telling what foreign voltages on > it is enough to trash the whole mother board. > > Each new level of integration now means you spend more > time and effort getting back to where you were and that's the > real cost. > > Even if your backups are perfect, loose your drive and > you've lost whatever time it takes to restore to the new system > plus the security implications that now your old drive with all > those data are knocking around somewhere that you have no > control over. > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Mon May 30 21:41:35 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 15:41:35 -0500 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard Message-ID: <201105302041.p4UKfZVs030885@x.it.okstate.edu> There are those who say that things used to be made better back in the good old days. I do not subscribe to that statement at all because it is an over simplification. Things were easier for an average technician or a competent do it your self repairer to fix because the sub assemblies broke so often they needed to be easily replaced. If a light bulb never burned out, would bulbs need to be easily removable? I think the cheap equipment today is better than ever and the best is fabulously good, but the one thing we seem to be loosing is the ability to easily make things whole again after minor damage or component failures. There should be some modularity between the mother board which is the same for every computer of that model, and any storage which has security implications at worst and takes time to restore at best. The trend towards USB or similar components partly addresses this problem in that if you blow up your sound card, somehow, one can buy another USB sound card and, for fifty Dollars or so, things are as good as new again. I don't yet practice that, myself, as my older computers all have sound chips embedded on their mother boards so I know that if something happens to that chip, that mother board is a write off. The only thing I knock is any design philosophy that puts the consumer out large amounts of money and time over relatively small failures in other words, that two-Dollar chip just cost me two weeks and 1500 Dollars. Had it been socketted, it would have maybe cost me two Dollars for the chip and at most an hour or two to open things up, pop out the offending chip and snap in the new one. Putting every IC on the board in sockets is not practical, these days, but those chips that have inputs or outputs that connect to the big wide world are most likely to be destroyed as they have the least protection. Dane Trethowan writes: > But that's always been the case with design though hasn't it, a classic > case in point is the "3-in-1" or "Music Centre" stereo system which has > been around for as long as I can remember. and is still around in some > form > or other today, I think they're called Midi or Micro hi-fi systems now and > some actually sound very good! for what they are. > > > > I don't go round knocking things like that, each to their own and if > people > are satisfied with what they buy then that's all that matters. From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 01:10:09 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 10:10:09 +1000 Subject: Latest Build of Easy CD DA Extractor Message-ID: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> A new build was released a few days ago and it seems more accessible than the older builds, about damn time too! . You can now for example select your output directory or folder for conversions and rips easily. From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 31 01:32:05 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Mon, 30 May 2011 17:32:05 -0700 Subject: E-Book prices fuel outrage -- and innovation Message-ID: E-Book prices fuel outrage -- and innovation An e-book that costs the same as a printed book doesn't feel right. No trees died to make it. No heavy machinery ran to print it. No planes flew to ship it. So why should you have to spend as much as you would for a heavy hardcover book to own it? http://bit.ly/l2qMxH From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 12:00:12 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 21:00:12 +1000 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder Message-ID: Hi! Most people on this list would have seen the various discussions on the excellent Zoom H1 handy audio recorder. I knew the company made a video recorder but up until now hadn't been able to find any information on it. I find a distributor in Australia where I can purchase the thing and certainly will, hope the stock doesn't run out . This recorder has all the audio characteristics of the Zoom H1 along with a video camera, video capture I'm told is very acceptable, not professional grade of course but what does one expect for a couple hundred dollars, just perfect! for those times you may wish to do a little video recording of one form or another, perhaps upload that to a web site of some sort etc. The unit comes with a 2GB Micro SD card which will hold 1 hour of Video content. product_id=3519&category=73&brand=&sort=&page=&q=/&gclid=CJ2fvfSdkakCFc2DpAodRly8iw From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 12:40:44 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 12:40:44 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> References: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <2D265B1B-012A-4D86-930B-0EE12C052E96@mac-access.net> Hi Martin That was precisely my point, it's all or nothing. Gordon On 30 May 2011, at 17:57, Martin McCormick wrote: This sort of design was almost inevitable. My only real complaint about modern electronic design is that the non-modularity of it all means that it is all or nothing if something breaks. We still have to connect our expensive computers to outside voltages on networks, possible ground loops on video monitors and sound interfaces. One stray spike of voltage from a lightning strike near by or plugging an RJ45 in to what one thought was an Ethernet connection but which may be something else with no telling what foreign voltages on it is enough to trash the whole mother board. Each new level of integration now means you spend more time and effort getting back to where you were and that's the real cost. Even if your backups are perfect, loose your drive and you've lost whatever time it takes to restore to the new system plus the security implications that now your old drive with all those data are knocking around somewhere that you have no control over. _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 12:50:03 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 12:50:03 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <4DE3CD62.7030508@internode.on.net> References: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> <4DE3CD62.7030508@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <810EE53B-C7E5-48FE-BD0E-26A34DD2FFFB@mac-access.net> Dane This is something you and I discussed a while ago. I hate all-in-one, gimmick-packed so-called hi-fi systems. If one thing goes down, you've lost the entire system. I have always been a fan of separately built hi-fi systems. Computers are exactly the same. It's great that things like the iMac and many many other computer systems can handle video, music and even HD stuff now. But to have all of your computing and entertainment stuff in one box, I for one certainly wouldn't ever do away with all the external audio stuff just because the computer does it. Now, before this gets personal as, sadly, some people always seem to insist on making such discussions, this is not a personal thing ... it is just my own opinion. You're quite right, it's each to their own. But the point here is that I personally prefer separately assembled hi-fi systems. If you like the all-in-one type, fine, go for it. Im just expressing my own personal opinion. And, to get back to the original subject, I think that putting the SDD on the motherboard is a bad move, and that's my own personal opinion. For one thing, you can get far larger capacity SDD's than 20GB and given the way Windows eats hard drive space, 20GB might end up, before long, being large enough for the OS and not much else. Gordon On 30 May 2011, at 18:01, Dane Trethowan wrote: But that's always been the case with design though hasn't it, a classic case in point is the "3-in-1" or "Music Centre" stereo system which has been around for as long as I can remember. and is still around in some form or other today, I think they're called Midi or Micro hi-fi systems now and some actually sound very good! for what they are. I don't go round knocking things like that, each to their own and if people are satisfied with what they buy then that's all that matters. From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 12:53:14 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 12:53:14 +0100 Subject: Latest Build of Easy CD DA Extractor In-Reply-To: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> References: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <16CBE137-AAB7-4D03-83A4-5A8CB6543827@mac-access.net> That's great news. I'll go and get that right now. It might solve a big problem. Gordon On 31 May 2011, at 01:10, Dane Trethowan wrote: A new build was released a few days ago and it seems more accessible than the older builds, about damn time too! . You can now for example select your output directory or folder for conversions and rips easily. From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 12:55:08 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 21:55:08 +1000 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <810EE53B-C7E5-48FE-BD0E-26A34DD2FFFB@mac-access.net> References: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> <4DE3CD62.7030508@internode.on.net> <810EE53B-C7E5-48FE-BD0E-26A34DD2FFFB@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <86BE5821-BEE5-417A-A3D3-E8208B2A87F5@internode.on.net> Thank Goodness you're only one , the sort of system with everything in one - whilst not suiting me nor you - will suit a lot of people and again, its a case of "Whatever Floats Your boat", I'm not going to knock that sort of system nor am I going to make myself sound superior by saying that they're no good, not the way to go etc. On 31/05/2011, at 9:50 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Dane > > This is something you and I discussed a while ago. I hate all-in-one, gimmick-packed so-called hi-fi systems. If one thing goes down, you've lost the entire system. I have always been a fan of separately built hi-fi systems. Computers are exactly the same. It's great that things like the iMac and many many other computer systems can handle video, music and even HD stuff now. But to have all of your computing and entertainment stuff in one box, I for one certainly wouldn't ever do away with all the external audio stuff just because the computer does it. > > Now, before this gets personal as, sadly, some people always seem to insist on making such discussions, this is not a personal thing ... it is just my own opinion. You're quite right, it's each to their own. But the point here is that I personally prefer separately assembled hi-fi systems. If you like the all-in-one type, fine, go for it. Im just expressing my own personal opinion. And, to get back to the original subject, I think that putting the SDD on the motherboard is a bad move, and that's my own personal opinion. For one thing, you can get far larger capacity SDD's than 20GB and given the way Windows eats hard drive space, 20GB might end up, before long, being large enough for the OS and not much else. > > Gordon > > > On 30 May 2011, at 18:01, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > But that's always been the case with design though hasn't it, a classic case in point is the "3-in-1" or "Music Centre" stereo system which has been around for as long as I can remember. and is still around in some form or other today, I think they're called Midi or Micro hi-fi systems now and some actually sound very good! for what they are. > > I don't go round knocking things like that, each to their own and if people are satisfied with what they buy then that's all that matters. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 12:55:44 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 12:55:44 +0100 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> Just to say I totally agree with Dane's comment about specs of the recorder. If I can find one in the UK I will buy one of these. Lynne would find it extremely useful. Gordon On 31 May 2011, at 12:00, Dane Trethowan wrote: Hi! Most people on this list would have seen the various discussions on the excellent Zoom H1 handy audio recorder. I knew the company made a video recorder but up until now hadn't been able to find any information on it. I find a distributor in Australia where I can purchase the thing and certainly will, hope the stock doesn't run out . This recorder has all the audio characteristics of the Zoom H1 along with a video camera, video capture I'm told is very acceptable, not professional grade of course but what does one expect for a couple hundred dollars, just perfect! for those times you may wish to do a little video recording of one form or another, perhaps upload that to a web site of some sort etc. The unit comes with a 2GB Micro SD card which will hold 1 hour of Video content. product_id=3519&category=73&brand=&sort=&page=&q=/&gclid=CJ2fvfSdkakCFc2DpAodRly8iw _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 12:56:47 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 21:56:47 +1000 Subject: Latest Build of Easy CD DA Extractor In-Reply-To: <16CBE137-AAB7-4D03-83A4-5A8CB6543827@mac-access.net> References: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> <16CBE137-AAB7-4D03-83A4-5A8CB6543827@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <828BEB09-93CD-4915-BD06-5E123CB082D4@internode.on.net> Yep it is good news, its been something I've been annoyed about for quite some time ad I've written about on more than one occasion. I don't know exactly what the problems have been but in the past Easy CD DA Extractor has gone for being perfectly accessible, to hardly accessible, to nearly fully accessible and then back to naut accessibility again. On 31/05/2011, at 9:53 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > That's great news. I'll go and get that right now. It might solve a big problem. > > Gordon > > On 31 May 2011, at 01:10, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > A new build was released a few days ago and it seems more accessible than the older builds, about damn time too! . > > You can now for example select your output directory or folder for conversions and rips easily. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 12:57:51 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 21:57:51 +1000 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> References: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> Message-ID: Well forgive me for sounding patronising but even a person with no site would find a use for a video recording device such as this these days. On 31/05/2011, at 9:55 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Just to say I totally agree with Dane's comment about specs of the recorder. If I can find one in the UK I will buy one of these. Lynne would find it extremely useful. > > Gordon > > On 31 May 2011, at 12:00, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Hi! > > Most people on this list would have seen the various discussions on the excellent Zoom H1 handy audio recorder. > > I knew the company made a video recorder but up until now hadn't been able to find any information on it. > > I find a distributor in Australia where I can purchase the thing and certainly will, hope the stock doesn't run out . > > > This recorder has all the audio characteristics of the Zoom H1 along with a video camera, video capture I'm told is very acceptable, not professional grade of course but what does one expect for a couple hundred dollars, just perfect! for those times you may wish to do a little video recording of one form or another, perhaps upload that to a web site of some sort etc. > > The unit comes with a 2GB Micro SD card which will hold 1 hour of Video content. > > product_id=3519&category=73&brand=&sort=&page=&q=/&gclid=CJ2fvfSdkakCFc2DpAodRly8iw > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 13:06:15 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 13:06:15 +0100 Subject: Gigabyte builds a 20GB Intel SSD into new Sandy Bridge motherboard In-Reply-To: <86BE5821-BEE5-417A-A3D3-E8208B2A87F5@internode.on.net> References: <201105301657.p4UGvWFM029955@x.it.okstate.edu> <4DE3CD62.7030508@internode.on.net> <810EE53B-C7E5-48FE-BD0E-26A34DD2FFFB@mac-access.net> <86BE5821-BEE5-417A-A3D3-E8208B2A87F5@internode.on.net> Message-ID: It sounds as though you're twisting what I said Dane. I went out of my way in my last message to make it clear that I am expressing my own view, nothing else. I have no idea what you mean by sound superior, that's just odd! Be that as it may, if you like the all-in-one gimmicks, fine. I personally don't, and I recently made it very clear, in another place, why I don't like these plastic boxes. Now, it's only fair to say that at the higher end of modular systems, those which concentrate on quality rather than bells and whistles, there are some exceptionally good quality units available. If I was looking at that particular market, I would probably have no problem with buying something like that which, although it goes against my separate unit preference, would undoubtedly delivery quality and convenience. I don't dispute that for a second. I suppose this preference for separate units is just something which dates back years and is difficult to shake off. As somebody who grew up in an era when equipment was made with an emphasis on quality rather than gimmicks such as beeping clocks, reverse-play cassettes and multi-stack CD's, it's difficult for me to come to terms with the idea of buying something modern and gimmicky. But again, this is not a silly my toy's better than your toy argument. I'm just expressing my own personal view. Others differ, and they are perfectly entitled to do so. On 31 May 2011, at 12:55, Dane Trethowan wrote: Thank Goodness you're only one , the sort of system with everything in one - whilst not suiting me nor you - will suit a lot of people and again, its a case of "Whatever Floats Your boat", I'm not going to knock that sort of system nor am I going to make myself sound superior by saying that they're no good, not the way to go etc. On 31/05/2011, at 9:50 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > Dane > > This is something you and I discussed a while ago. I hate all-in-one, gimmick-packed so-called hi-fi systems. If one thing goes down, you've lost the entire system. I have always been a fan of separately built hi-fi systems. Computers are exactly the same. It's great that things like the iMac and many many other computer systems can handle video, music and even HD stuff now. But to have all of your computing and entertainment stuff in one box, I for one certainly wouldn't ever do away with all the external audio stuff just because the computer does it. > > Now, before this gets personal as, sadly, some people always seem to insist on making such discussions, this is not a personal thing ... it is just my own opinion. You're quite right, it's each to their own. But the point here is that I personally prefer separately assembled hi-fi systems. If you like the all-in-one type, fine, go for it. Im just expressing my own personal opinion. And, to get back to the original subject, I think that putting the SDD on the motherboard is a bad move, and that's my own personal opinion. For one thing, you can get far larger capacity SDD's than 20GB and given the way Windows eats hard drive space, 20GB might end up, before long, being large enough for the OS and not much else. > > Gordon > > > On 30 May 2011, at 18:01, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > But that's always been the case with design though hasn't it, a classic case in point is the "3-in-1" or "Music Centre" stereo system which has been around for as long as I can remember. and is still around in some form or other today, I think they're called Midi or Micro hi-fi systems now and some actually sound very good! for what they are. > > I don't go round knocking things like that, each to their own and if people are satisfied with what they buy then that's all that matters. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 13:08:44 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 13:08:44 +0100 Subject: Latest Build of Easy CD DA Extractor In-Reply-To: <828BEB09-93CD-4915-BD06-5E123CB082D4@internode.on.net> References: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> <16CBE137-AAB7-4D03-83A4-5A8CB6543827@mac-access.net> <828BEB09-93CD-4915-BD06-5E123CB082D4@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <86BBB1C3-3714-47F5-97C7-8550DD245D50@mac-access.net> The problems seems to be that he's trying to make his interface visually attractive rather than functional. yes, it's functional enough as long as you're a "point and click" person. But he didn't do a screen-reader any favours at all with the last few releases. On 31 May 2011, at 12:56, Dane Trethowan wrote: Yep it is good news, its been something I've been annoyed about for quite some time ad I've written about on more than one occasion. I don't know exactly what the problems have been but in the past Easy CD DA Extractor has gone for being perfectly accessible, to hardly accessible, to nearly fully accessible and then back to naut accessibility again. From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 13:10:33 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 13:10:33 +0100 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: References: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> Message-ID: I have no problem with that. I'm blind myself and I can think a thousands of uses for that kind of thing. After all, when I record from TV I don't just record the sound. I know a lot of blind people do, but to me personally that isn't the way to go. On 31 May 2011, at 12:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: Well forgive me for sounding patronising but even a person with no site would find a use for a video recording device such as this these days. From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 13:21:22 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 22:21:22 +1000 Subject: Latest Build of Easy CD DA Extractor In-Reply-To: <86BBB1C3-3714-47F5-97C7-8550DD245D50@mac-access.net> References: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> <16CBE137-AAB7-4D03-83A4-5A8CB6543827@mac-access.net> <828BEB09-93CD-4915-BD06-5E123CB082D4@internode.on.net> <86BBB1C3-3714-47F5-97C7-8550DD245D50@mac-access.net> Message-ID: In this build you have to make extensive use of the mouse simulation keys in your screen reader but at least its usable. On 31/05/2011, at 10:08 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > The problems seems to be that he's trying to make his interface visually attractive rather than functional. yes, it's functional enough as long as you're a "point and click" person. But he didn't do a screen-reader any favours at all with the last few releases. > > > On 31 May 2011, at 12:56, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Yep it is good news, its been something I've been annoyed about for quite some time ad I've written about on more than one occasion. > > I don't know exactly what the problems have been but in the past Easy CD DA Extractor has gone for being perfectly accessible, to hardly accessible, to nearly fully accessible and then back to naut accessibility again. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 13:23:12 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 22:23:12 +1000 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: References: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <878F1904-E9CD-4F62-8962-2D31AD9E0A77@internode.on.net> I wasn't thinking of recording from the TV actually though that's one use for the device. I was thinking of say record keeping, on various occasions I've had to show proof that I've had a document of one form or another so what better way to get the proof than with one of these zoom recorders. I have video recording facilities for my TV so the Zoom probably wouldn't get used for that here. On 31/05/2011, at 10:10 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > I have no problem with that. I'm blind myself and I can think a thousands of uses for that kind of thing. After all, when I record from TV I don't just record the sound. I know a lot of blind people do, but to me personally that isn't the way to go. > > On 31 May 2011, at 12:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Well forgive me for sounding patronising but even a person with no site would find a use for a video recording device such as this these days. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 13:48:07 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 13:48:07 +0100 Subject: Latest Build of Easy CD DA Extractor In-Reply-To: References: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> <16CBE137-AAB7-4D03-83A4-5A8CB6543827@mac-access.net> <828BEB09-93CD-4915-BD06-5E123CB082D4@internode.on.net> <86BBB1C3-3714-47F5-97C7-8550DD245D50@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <22528752-3694-4B78-93CB-0C9FF8E47529@mac-access.net> I have no problems with that. Well, as long as the screen-reader itself is usable which, sadly, WE 7.5 doesn't seem to be in a lot of cases. For instance, before the machine got trashed, I found I wasn't able to use the mouse keys even though the Laptop keyboard layout was selected. Gordon On 31 May 2011, at 13:21, Dane Trethowan wrote: In this build you have to make extensive use of the mouse simulation keys in your screen reader but at least its usable. On 31/05/2011, at 10:08 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > The problems seems to be that he's trying to make his interface visually attractive rather than functional. yes, it's functional enough as long as you're a "point and click" person. But he didn't do a screen-reader any favours at all with the last few releases. > > > On 31 May 2011, at 12:56, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Yep it is good news, its been something I've been annoyed about for quite some time ad I've written about on more than one occasion. > > I don't know exactly what the problems have been but in the past Easy CD DA Extractor has gone for being perfectly accessible, to hardly accessible, to nearly fully accessible and then back to naut accessibility again. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From gordon at mac-access.net Tue May 31 13:50:01 2011 From: gordon at mac-access.net (Gordon Smith) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 13:50:01 +0100 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: <878F1904-E9CD-4F62-8962-2D31AD9E0A77@internode.on.net> References: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> <878F1904-E9CD-4F62-8962-2D31AD9E0A77@internode.on.net> Message-ID: <77114116-7848-4456-A40C-307D3DA5ECEA@mac-access.net> yes, I understand that. I was just using that as an example. The primary use for me would be recording real time video scenes which is something I have wanted to do for a very long time. But I don't know how well a blind person would be able to assume the role of "camera man". :) Gordon On 31 May 2011, at 13:23, Dane Trethowan wrote: I wasn't thinking of recording from the TV actually though that's one use for the device. I was thinking of say record keeping, on various occasions I've had to show proof that I've had a document of one form or another so what better way to get the proof than with one of these zoom recorders. I have video recording facilities for my TV so the Zoom probably wouldn't get used for that here. On 31/05/2011, at 10:10 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > I have no problem with that. I'm blind myself and I can think a thousands of uses for that kind of thing. After all, when I record from TV I don't just record the sound. I know a lot of blind people do, but to me personally that isn't the way to go. > > On 31 May 2011, at 12:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Well forgive me for sounding patronising but even a person with no site would find a use for a video recording device such as this these days. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > _______________________________________________ The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 13:54:11 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 22:54:11 +1000 Subject: WE EEEPC etc In-Reply-To: <22528752-3694-4B78-93CB-0C9FF8E47529@mac-access.net> References: <4DE431E1.7010102@internode.on.net> <16CBE137-AAB7-4D03-83A4-5A8CB6543827@mac-access.net> <828BEB09-93CD-4915-BD06-5E123CB082D4@internode.on.net> <86BBB1C3-3714-47F5-97C7-8550DD245D50@mac-access.net> <22528752-3694-4B78-93CB-0C9FF8E47529@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <89CDDBBD-8997-4B59-80CC-C1F09BA227B8@internode.on.net> I had a lot of that sort of trouble with WE as well on my EEPC, I'm not sure actually if its WE or something else causing the trouble there? I'll give WE the benefit of the doubt and I'll tell you why, the EEPC uses some sort of keyboard shortcut manager so I'm wondering if this is actually playing funny buggers with WE? Regardless of that WE is no longer installed on the EEEPC, I have NVDA working on that machine and NVDA and EEEPC are perfectly happy! On 31/05/2011, at 10:48 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > I have no problems with that. Well, as long as the screen-reader itself is usable which, sadly, WE 7.5 doesn't seem to be in a lot of cases. > > For instance, before the machine got trashed, I found I wasn't able to use the mouse keys even though the Laptop keyboard layout was selected. > > Gordon > > > On 31 May 2011, at 13:21, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > In this build you have to make extensive use of the mouse simulation keys in your screen reader but at least its usable. > > > On 31/05/2011, at 10:08 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > >> The problems seems to be that he's trying to make his interface visually attractive rather than functional. yes, it's functional enough as long as you're a "point and click" person. But he didn't do a screen-reader any favours at all with the last few releases. >> >> >> On 31 May 2011, at 12:56, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >> Yep it is good news, its been something I've been annoyed about for quite some time ad I've written about on more than one occasion. >> >> I don't know exactly what the problems have been but in the past Easy CD DA Extractor has gone for being perfectly accessible, to hardly accessible, to nearly fully accessible and then back to naut accessibility again. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From grtdane at internode.on.net Tue May 31 13:56:22 2011 From: grtdane at internode.on.net (Dane Trethowan) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 22:56:22 +1000 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: <77114116-7848-4456-A40C-307D3DA5ECEA@mac-access.net> References: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> <878F1904-E9CD-4F62-8962-2D31AD9E0A77@internode.on.net> <77114116-7848-4456-A40C-307D3DA5ECEA@mac-access.net> Message-ID: in all seriousness didn't the BBC employ a blind cameraman a couple of years ago? My original message was posted to another list and since then I've received a private email from a blind person, he's in a band. He used a H1 to record his bands live performances but he now uses the video recorder to video the bands performances, the idea being that he wants to put them up on the Internet, nothing wrong whatever with that. On 31/05/2011, at 10:50 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > yes, I understand that. I was just using that as an example. The primary use for me would be recording real time video scenes which is something I have wanted to do for a very long time. But I don't know how well a blind person would be able to assume the role of "camera man". :) > > Gordon > > > On 31 May 2011, at 13:23, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I wasn't thinking of recording from the TV actually though that's one use for the device. I was thinking of say record keeping, on various occasions I've had to show proof that I've had a document of one form or another so what better way to get the proof than with one of these zoom recorders. > > I have video recording facilities for my TV so the Zoom probably wouldn't get used for that here. > > > On 31/05/2011, at 10:10 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > >> I have no problem with that. I'm blind myself and I can think a thousands of uses for that kind of thing. After all, when I record from TV I don't just record the sound. I know a lot of blind people do, but to me personally that isn't the way to go. >> >> On 31 May 2011, at 12:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >> Well forgive me for sounding patronising but even a person with no site would find a use for a video recording device such as this these days. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From martin at x.it.okstate.edu Tue May 31 17:43:05 2011 From: martin at x.it.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder Message-ID: <201105311643.p4VGh5Dq035517@x.it.okstate.edu> It would depend a lot on whether one wanted the video for technical reasons such as to document some event or for aesthetic reasons. It would be like trying to record audio while being profoundly deaf. You might activate the recorder, have the microphone in the right place and do everything right but be unaware of the laun mower passing back and forth just outside that totally obliterates the sound you were trying to capture. When taking good video, the person shooting the pictures usually looks through the monitor/view finder to get the image they want framed in the center of view and level. Professional video cameras have some over-scan to let you see things that are outside the frame that you are recording and markings that show where the actual frame stops so one can control what is in the picture. A blind person could certainly record video, but one wouldn't know exactly what got recorded because that is directly analogous to listening through the monitor. We could be a security camera man, but not likely a Warner Brothers photographer. I think if I ever need a video capture device, however, it will be an Ipad or Iphone as the cameras in those devices do rather well close up and wire color identification, for example, is possible already. I always wonder, though, how color ID apps let you know what part of the frame it is identifying. Telephone wire, for example, usually has a predominant solid color with a spiral pattern or stripe of some other color so you need to know more than just the color of the wire. The first pair to use, for example, is blue with a white tracer and white with a blue tracer. The second is orange and white. If the predominantly white wire was not also flagged as having the orange tracer, you could get it mixed up with the white-green, white-brown, white-orange or white-blue wires. This is not a good thing. Sorry to go a little off the main subject, but there are many reasons why a person who is blind might want to take a picture of something. Gordon Smith writes: > yes, I understand that. I was just using that as an example. The > primary use for me would be recording real time video scenes which is > something I have wanted to do for a very long time. But I don't know how > well a blind person would be able to assume the role of "camera man". :) > > Gordon From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 31 18:21:23 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 10:21:23 -0700 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: References: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> Message-ID: <6F8225AB-418D-4957-A76D-83FBBC10CAC8@gmail.com> lol. I need one that won't 'die at the push or touch of a button when someone switches the thing and a tripod would be useful. that way it will be very easy for someone to set up and tape my performances for me. I wonder what format the vids come in. I could convert them of corse with mpeg stream clip but yeah. Take care. Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 31, 2011, at 5:10 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > I have no problem with that. I'm blind myself and I can think a thousands of uses for that kind of thing. After all, when I record from TV I don't just record the sound. I know a lot of blind people do, but to me personally that isn't the way to go. > > On 31 May 2011, at 12:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > Well forgive me for sounding patronising but even a person with no site would find a use for a video recording device such as this these days. > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > From marrie12 at gmail.com Tue May 31 18:22:07 2011 From: marrie12 at gmail.com (Sarah Alawami) Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 10:22:07 -0700 Subject: Zoom Handy Video Recorder In-Reply-To: <77114116-7848-4456-A40C-307D3DA5ECEA@mac-access.net> References: <752A89A6-EB58-4065-8CA4-7EF6F588EEAE@mac-access.net> <878F1904-E9CD-4F62-8962-2D31AD9E0A77@internode.on.net> <77114116-7848-4456-A40C-307D3DA5ECEA@mac-access.net> Message-ID: lol. I do it all the time and most of the time my vids come out quite good. I'll explain later as the post will be long ish. lol! Sarah Alawami If you need an edit done on a small project go to http://music.marrie.org/master.html for more info. If you need to contact me my info is below. MSN and AIM: marrie12 at gmail.com website: http://music.marrie.org Podcast: http://marrie.podbean.com youtube: http://youtube.com/marrie125 On May 31, 2011, at 5:50 AM, Gordon Smith wrote: > yes, I understand that. I was just using that as an example. The primary use for me would be recording real time video scenes which is something I have wanted to do for a very long time. But I don't know how well a blind person would be able to assume the role of "camera man". :) > > Gordon > > > On 31 May 2011, at 13:23, Dane Trethowan wrote: > > I wasn't thinking of recording from the TV actually though that's one use for the device. I was thinking of say record keeping, on various occasions I've had to show proof that I've had a document of one form or another so what better way to get the proof than with one of these zoom recorders. > > I have video recording facilities for my TV so the Zoom probably wouldn't get used for that here. > > > On 31/05/2011, at 10:10 PM, Gordon Smith wrote: > >> I have no problem with that. I'm blind myself and I can think a thousands of uses for that kind of thing. After all, when I record from TV I don't just record the sound. I know a lot of blind people do, but to me personally that isn't the way to go. >> >> On 31 May 2011, at 12:57, Dane Trethowan wrote: >> >> Well forgive me for sounding patronising but even a person with no site would find a use for a video recording device such as this these days. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free >> >> To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat >> >> You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: >> http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >> > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html > > > _______________________________________________ > > The Techno-Chat E-Mail forum is guaranteed malware, spyware, Trojan, virus and worm-free > > To modify your subscription options, please visit for forum's dedicated web pages located at http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/techno-chat > > You can find an archive of all messages posted to the Techno-Chat group since the 12th of April 2010, at: > http://mail.tft-bbs.co.uk/pipermail/techno-chat/index.html >